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FFT: ASM'D main info/discussion

Started by philsov, October 11, 2009, 04:38:12 pm


Xifanie

  • Modding version: PSX
Anything is possible as long as it is within the hardware's limits. (ie. disc space, RAM, Video RAM, processor, etc.)
<R999> My target market is not FFT mod players
<Raijinili> remember that? it was awful

philsov

QuoteMiluda's sprite working in-game is quite win, now epicsauce can be done with her and it won't look out of place!

Indeed, only now I can't seem to make a ppf with the change in place, unless it's the ppf is specifically applied to a clean iso that has been restructured by shishi.  It's a pain, really, but I'll keep playing with it.
Just another rebel plotting rebellion.

The Damned

Congratulations on finally getting your own forum, philsov.
"Sorrow cannot be abolished. It is meaningless to try." - FFX's Yunalesca

"Good and evil are relative, but being a dick cannot be allowed." - Oglaf's Thaumaturge in "The Abyss"

"Well, see, the real magic isn't believing in yourself. The real magic is manipulating people by telling them to believe in themselves. The more you believe, the less you check facts."  - Oglaf's Vanka in "Conviction"

Eternal

About time this got its own section. Congrats, Phil. ^_^
  • Modding version: PSX & WotL
"You, no less human than we? Ha! Now there's a beastly thought. You've been less than we from the moment your baseborn father fell upon your mother in whatever gutter saw you sired! You've been chattel since you came into the world drenched in common blood!"
  • Discord username: eternal248#1817

Sephirot24

Holy shit, I knew you were gonna get your section sooner or later! Congrats Phil!! :D

RavenOfRazgriz

Quote from: "philsov"
QuoteMiluda's sprite working in-game is quite win, now epicsauce can be done with her and it won't look out of place!

Indeed, only now I can't seem to make a ppf with the change in place, unless it's the ppf is specifically applied to a clean iso that has been restructured by shishi.  It's a pain, really, but I'll keep playing with it.

...You're as bad as Eternal when it comes to that stupid program, really.

:p

Hopefully you can get it to work, a couple new / changed sprites where they're needed, maybe a couple extra sprites for bosses, etc. would be cool.

It'd also be cool to change a lot of the color palettes for generic jobs, but finding usable palettes / people to make usable palettes seems like it could be a pain... back burner idea, I suppose.

Timbo

You don't show on the main page where Squire and Chemist fit into the equation for stat growths.

I would assume Squire falls under "Fighter" and Chemist falls under "Status Mage".  Am I right?
  • Modding version: PSX
  • Discord username: Timbo


philsov

QuoteI would assume Squire falls under "Fighter" and Chemist falls under "Status Mage". Am I right?

Heh, indeed.
Just another rebel plotting rebellion.

philsov

With the introduction of several discoveries by formerdeathcorps, I'm pleased to include more hex/asm hacks into the fold!

Chickens regain 5 Br per action
Brave Up now increases Br by 10 per application
Faith Up now increases Fa by 10 per application
Arrow Guard now blocks gunshots (I guess we'll call it Missile Guard now?)
Performing units will evade attacks. (in fact, theres now no drawback with performing -- this will allow song and dance to be a large radius around the performer rather than hiding in the corner with 255/255 range)
Oil takes 2x damage from fire; float takes 2x damage from wind (v2) (fixed)

Now then, one thing I'm waffling about is

QuoteChange reaction ability activation rate (v1). Note, this affects all reactive counter abilities.
BATTLE.BIN
0x12639C change 0x64 to 0xYY
The chance of a reaction to activate is (Br / YY).

because, I can then set it to like 60.  Meaning anything at 60 Br or higher = 100% counter rate.  With this in place, I can then implement the Brave to Fury hack.  For those not versed in that hack, it turns Br and physical attacks to act very much like Fa and magic attacks -- more Br = more damage taken AND given.

Opinions?

Edit:  Raven, I already know your stance on the matter <3
Just another rebel plotting rebellion.

The Damned

First, I would ask for a minor clarification: Do you mean that you're going to implement Fury regardless of what opinions are voiced? Or that you will only implement Fury if people voice that they want this to be set to 60?

Secondly, I have to say that I don't support a 100% counter rate, if only because of things like Dragon Spirit and Damage Split. It's a shame we can't affect Reaction skills individually yet.

Lastly, I'm not sure how I feel about Fury still to be honest. I'll probably end up using it in my hack, but it makes things way to hard to test, at least initially, since damage ends up varying so much. (I also don't think that changing the name is really necessary either.)

Shrug. All I know is that I don't want counter rates to be 100%, but that may just be me.
"Sorrow cannot be abolished. It is meaningless to try." - FFX's Yunalesca

"Good and evil are relative, but being a dick cannot be allowed." - Oglaf's Thaumaturge in "The Abyss"

"Well, see, the real magic isn't believing in yourself. The real magic is manipulating people by telling them to believe in themselves. The more you believe, the less you check facts."  - Oglaf's Vanka in "Conviction"

RavenOfRazgriz

I need to steal some of those hacks off FDC for something eventually.  Dayum.

Fury is fun, but playing with a lot of numbers makes me realize you need to be rather careful with it unless you design your power scales with it from the beginning.

This doesn't mean I'm against it at all though, really, though I don't see why you're relating Fury to Br% ability activation.  X/60 means any practical Br score has over 50% chance to trigger reaction, meaning Br manipulation beyond flexing your Fury damage potential is useless unless you're bombing yourself or someone down to some really low Br scores (even 15 Br gives a 25% reaction rate).

Unless that was your intent?  Though that seems odd, as the drawback for turtling out seems small unless you drop to extreme and already unnecessary numbers.

philsov

QuoteDo you mean that you're going to implement Fury regardless of what opinions are voiced? Or that you will only implement Fury if people voice that they want this to be set to 60?

Neither.  I'm just at the sounding wall stage of the matter :).  Fury (simply being called so to differentiate it from Brave for the discussion) is a pretty cool concept, with variable physical damage much how faith matters in the realm of magic.  However, because the melee potential of a unit and its reaction rate are intertwined, the whole concept is marred -- I don't like a unit being double-dinged for having a low Br.  By upping the Br cap on reactions, this takes the sting out of it, which enables Fury to be present.  

It's very much of a package deal.  

QuoteX/60 means any practical Br score has over 50% chance to trigger reaction, meaning Br manipulation beyond flexing your Fury damage potential is useless unless you're bombing yourself or someone down to some really low Br scores (even 15 Br gives a 25% reaction rate).

Unless that was your intent?

Much like how altering one's faith only affects their magic, Br altering will be more for affecting melee potential rather than dealing with the reaction rate.  So... mostly my intent if I'm reading that correctly.

~

Similarly, I can be really devious and tie reaction rate to something like... level, which works out really well endgame but suuuuuuuucks when you're starting off.  

Or maybe even HP -- the more wounded you are the less likely you are to react.  HP restore gets boned, though.  This has the same problem as level though with scaling in that early on you're far more screwed than later, especially as its set to an exact number of HP (ie, greater than 150 HP = 100%, then grading linear downward from that).

Like I said, I'm still waffling on the fury thing anyways.
Just another rebel plotting rebellion.

Dokurider

Wow, if this works out, Brave Up on MA fists are going to be sick.

Frankly, I like the idea of levels tying into reactions and I don't mind the idea of 100% reactions either. Sure it's going to suck at low levels, but it always sucks at low level.

formerdeathcorps

Quote from: "Dokurider"Wow, if this works out, Brave Up on MA fists are going to be sick.

Frankly, I like the idea of levels tying into reactions and I don't mind the idea of 100% reactions either. Sure it's going to suck at low levels, but it always sucks at low level.

Except then all reactions other than weapon guard and abandon are exponentially worse at early levels (low damage to enemy maxHP ratio and low activation chance).  I personally think that's too much.  The 100% trigger isn't bad, though I think philsov should edit the Fury hack so that the multiplier for increased damage dealt < the multiplier for increased damage taken, if Brave > X, which would then use Fury to balance that added benefit.
The destruction of the will is the rape of the mind.
The dogmas of every era are nothing but the fantasies of those in power; their dreams are our waking nightmares.

Dokurider

Well for one, weapon guard is an innate for everyone and abandon was removed from the game. Secondly, Reactions, offensive reactions in particular, aren't really a big part of the early game anyhow. Thirdly, we (okay, I) don't really know how levels are going to be incorporated in yet.

RavenOfRazgriz

Quote from: "philsov"However, because the melee potential of a unit and its reaction rate are intertwined, the whole concept is marred -- I don't like a unit being double-dinged for having a low Br.  By upping the Br cap on reactions, this takes the sting out of it, which enables Fury to be present.

Melee potential is easily fixed, though.  :o

Quote from: "philsov"Or maybe even HP -- the more wounded you are the less likely you are to react.  HP restore gets boned, though.  This has the same problem as level though with scaling in that early on you're far more screwed than later, especially as its set to an exact number of HP (ie, greater than 150 HP = 100%, then grading linear downward from that).

Like I said, I'm still waffling on the fury thing anyways.

You could always be a dick and add a jump, then use some free space to create a percentile like (CasCurrentHP - CasMaxHP) / CasMaxHP.  IIRC ASM values are unsigned, so this should result in a percentile that moves inversely to a character's HP total, with the code for drawing CasCurrentHP and CasMaxHP able to be drawn from the Lifebreak damage formula.  A similar formula would be CasMaxHP / ((25 * CasCurrentHP)/10) from what I can tell, but that shit's too ugly for me to want to play with much right now.

You could also do similar, with something like ((CBr/2)+(CFa/2)/100), so that both Brave and Faith are incorporated, making high-frequency reactions exclusive to characters who walk the fine line of high Br and Fa (and as such need more reactions to go off), and both Br and Fa are now equal in game influence damage and reaction wise.

Or for similar to what you were describing before, CasCurrentHP/CasMaxHP should work, though as you said it fucks HP Restore and co rather handily.


*I'm assuming ASM can handle mildly complicated math here of course, but given some of the damage formulas the game employs I don't see how it couldn't if you make a jump to a place with more space to handle the calculation.

BlackMageShin

Is this mod based on 1.3 or is it a from-scratch project?

philsov

I'd prefer to think of it as from-scratch that just-so-happens to have a lot of stuff in common in 1.3.

The goal is to make this different enough from 1.3 to stand out, be well-received, and provide a unique gameplay experience.  So there's a lot of stuff I've been intentionally altering just for the sake of being different from both 1.3 and newtype.

<3 Attack.out editor
Just another rebel plotting rebellion.