FFT Arena AI Tournament Season 2 Registration

[Dokurider]

I endorse this motion.  Large maps give teams an opportunity to spam Quickening at the start of battle, as well as room for spellgunners to run and gun.  Putting large maps last will challenge these strategies, if only ever so slightly.

So if I were to enter my Air Knife team, you guys will be fine with the fact that you just weighted my chances, as well as most close quarter teams, of winning just because you hate Quickening/Spellguns, right? We should not be favoring other team types on simple whims because the goal of the Tournament is to determine who is strongest, not who we think deserves to win because they aren't using a overused/overpowered strategy. One of the very reasons we are having this tournament is to evaluate whether overpowered strategies are truly overpowered or if they're just the Arena equivalent of Pub Stompers/Scrub strategies and thus can be overcome with good team composition.

You guys have seen these maps 1000x times already, what's a 1000x times more going to do? We need to be as fair as possible about the way we conduct this tournament. May the strongest team win, not the fairest.

[Barren]

What map order do you suggest then?

[LightningHax]

Uh... Small/Large/Medium?

I don't really see what's wrong with it. It's worked fine in the past, so why not keep using it?

[reinoe]

We could also try Large/Large/Large.  .  Change is good and there's one team I'm considering that can prove that such a set-up is completely fair.

[Dokurider]

Uh... Small/Large/Medium?

I don't really see what's wrong with it. It's worked fine in the past, so why not keep using it?

This

[Otabo]

Uh... Small/Large/Medium?

I don't really see what's wrong with it. It's worked fine in the past, so why not keep using it?

I second this. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

[iamBQB]

Honestly what does it matter? The order isn't going to change the outcome of any battle anyway. If a team can only win in large maps they're going to lose no matter when the large map fight takes place. And if they can win either the small or medium map along with the large map, then they'll win no matter when the fight takes place.

If you're going to take probable outcomes into consideration, then you should base map order off of what you think would create the largest amount of 2-0 victories to lessen the burden on the members who will be recording videos.

Edit: Of course that only matters if were using 1 of each map type.

[reinoe]

Well if we're doing Large/Large/Large then I need to change the team I submitted.

On a more serious note, here's how map sizes change the outcome of the matches.  Especially compare the results of round 1 vs round 2 and 3...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G55666SaC8A

[Dokurider]

It matters because it supposed to act as a method of testing team composition. A well made team is made for the eventuality of fighting on a map that doesn't immediately benefit their strategy. If a team can't over come the disadvantage the map gave them, then there's the next map which should cater to their strategy, and the tiebreaker that are somewhere in the middle. So a team that can only win on large maps will get nowhere in the tournament because they'll be running into small maps every match and vice versa. Design your teams to handle both kinds of maps or prepare to lose.

My suggestion about making Map selection Medium/Medium/Medium was a joke if you guys are complaining about seeing the same maps over and over now, wait until we cut 2/3rd of the maps altogether. At least with Small/Large/Medium, only 1/3rds of Map Selection is basically cut.

[iamBQB]

What I'm trying to say Dokurider, is that as long as we have a combination of Small/Medium/Large, the order of things will not change the outcome. I'm definitely not arguing for something like all medium or all large, especially since registration ends tomorrow.

[Dokurider]

You do realize that this is a best out of three, right? Or are you trying to say that map size has no effect on fights period?

And even if it somehow didn't, why not err on the side of caution?

[Dokurider]

There's also an additional point of letting the teams play in their strongest map type. If we were to just whatever order we want as long as we do all three types, a team maker that lost would leave with the feeling he never got to show his team off at their best. Besides tiebreakers are more dramatic on middle ground.

[iamBQB]

No that's not what I'm saying at all XD. I'm saying that all 6 possible combinations of:

S-M-L
S-L-M
M-S-L
M-L-S
L-S-M
L-M-S

will always produce the same winners in every contest. If somebody is going to win say, the large map and the medium map, then whether or not they do those first or last isn't going to change the ultimate outcome. The idea that by changing the order we'll favor one team over another isn't really the case, so it doesn't matter what order we decide upon.

As for your point of about making matches more interesting I don't disagree, I was mainly just trying to point out that arguments about competitive advantage didn't really need to happen.

[Dokurider]

Yeah I see you're right about the competitive advantage, but like I said, Large/Small lets every type of team show off their best.

[reinoe]

Barren, did you get my team revision?

[Barren]

Yep I got it

[Eternal]

Submitted my team! One of my units is a blast from FFH's past.

[Barren]

We need 3 more registered players to make it to 32. We're close already

[reinoe]

We need 3 more registered players to make it to 32. We're close already

http://www.printyourbrackets.com/29teamdoubleelimination.html
Although it's possible to have two a 29 player bracket, it just means three people will get a "Bye" to the next week.

[Fanatic]

And submitted!

Only one monk this time, alas. I almost submitted by status spamming move 8 team, but I thought better of it. I went a more boring traditional team.

PS: Phoenix Blade. wow. The only viable use I saw for it was on a speed 14 character who also had Balance. I must say the Thief I created in testing spammed it reliably well, and I almost went with it. Then I ran into poison. For the love of god, why doesn't that stupid sword also give immunity to poison? If you can design a team that consistently wins with that stupid weapon, I will eat my hat.