Final Fantasy Hacktics

Hey everyone,
I am pretty new around here, and have been lurking for the last few days. I downloaded the patcher and am having a lot of fun with that, but down to business

I enjoy playing around with the RPG makers quite a bit, and I also like Final Fantasy Tactics. My logical conclusion was to make an RPG that was similar to the FFT concept, but with a more traditional-style RPG system. At this point I am really not very far, having just transferred over most of the Items and Classes. I am currently working on abilities, and thats where things are becoming difficult. RPG VX is a fairly useful utility, but there are limitations. I will need to have a good ability set for each job that functions well with the standard RPG battle.

Anyway, I figured I would just throw that out there and see some reactions. From lurking around I have found that most of you are pretty creative thinkers, and you all may be able to throw in a great idea that gets my creative juices flowing. Anything from storyboard ideas to sprite ideas is welcome.

This ought to be interesting.

Theoretically, making an appropriate skillset for each class in a classical RPG sense would be possible, obviously with some modifications, but I don't know what your limits are.

I'm not really a fan of playing straight-up RPGs, but I'd be more than happy to shell out ideas to make FFT work like other Final Fantasy games.

I see where you are coming from with that one. The classic rpg kind of strips the strategy from it.

One of the main things I want to do is try and make it fit into the timeline of the other final fantasies. Maybe by slightly altering the story and usind some more timeline references I could make it fit. I`m not sure that there has been a real conclusion as to where FFT fits in with all of the others, and if there is please let me know.

On the story front, I obvioulsy wouldn`t be keeping the exact same story for my RPG that was used in FFT. I am hoping to stick to the general guidelines but try and clean it up a bit so its less focused on BETRAYAL BETRAYAL BETRAYAL and a little bit more on the characters.

P.S I`ve also started work on a Forgotten Realms patch for FFT . I just started with some classes last night, so that`s in its very early stages

The problem with the storyline of FFT as far as other Final Fantasies go is...

There really shouldn't have been a connection between games in the first place, IIRC.  The problem is that square has a few loose ends on that one and did not plan out a connection until after FFT was made.

How would you make it fit with other FFs if they don't connect anyway. Final Fantasy has a weird sequel system in that the sequels to the sequels share the same number.  What I'm trying to get at is simple unless your changing it to fit the format of Advanced and 12 why does the story need to be tweaked.

Well its more that i want the story to be more coherent and more Fantasyesque. A little bit more defined you could say.

So you would like it to fit the overall fantasy that brings the series so much after(which game did the games start getting insane?).  Would be nice but also a bit taxing on the materials at hand.

Quote from: "darthpaul"which game did the games start getting insane?

FFXI... big mistake, changed the whole genre for the worst... even though I loved it when I had an account.

No it was before that, I want to say FF6 or 7 started the insanity of the FF series. XI wasn't as big of a mistake as as X-2. XI should have been called FF Online though.

I agree about FFXI, but I really think the series started going downhill at least at X-2, if not earlier.

I read a really good article about FFVII pointing out that it was really the downturn in the FF series.

http://www.fryingbear.com/articles/crapthology/FF7.htm (http://www.fryingbear.com/articles/crapthology/FF7.htm)

Although I have to admit, FFX was pretty damn good.

EDIT: Darthpaul, you're nuts, FFVI was really good. =P

Quote from: "darthpaul"No it was before that, I want to say FF6 or 7 started the insanity of the FF series. XI wasn't as big of a mistake as as X-2. XI should have been called FF Online though.

My thoughts exactly; well except I lean more towards FF6.

I would like to make a hack of FF12 that changes the title and any reference to the title into FF11 instead. And the same for FF11 into FF online. Just so that I can live peacefully in my alternate reality. ^_^

Quote from: "nates1984"I agree about FFXI, but I really think the series started going downhill at least at X-2, if not earlier.

I read a really good article about FFVII pointing out that it was really the downturn in the FF series.

http://www.fryingbear.com/articles/crapthology/FF7.htm (http://www.fryingbear.com/articles/crapthology/FF7.htm)

Although I have to admit, FFX was pretty damn good.

EDIT: Darthpaul, you're nuts, FFVI was really good. =P

I think what we're referring to is when the slim theme that all the games had changed into something completely different, not so much a drop in quality. At least that's what I'm talking about.

FFVII get's knocked around a lot and pointed to as the start of the "downward spiral" for the series.   I'm not a FF7 fanboy by any stretch of the imagination(IX and X are my two favorites, although I thoroughly enjoyed the gameplay in XII).
The reason FFVII is so vilified is simple: its was popular and it brought the series mainstream.  Once the series became popular, it lost it's "geek credz".  It brought new blood and new life to the series, and that pissed off the older fans(get off my lawn damn it!).  "12 year old boys who creamed their pants every time they talked about how awesome Cloud was" ruined the series.

FFVIII doesn't deserve all the hate it gets.  Yes, it does have one of the worst plot twists in video game history and the magic system was broken(high tier magic was useless.  It was better used for junction).  The reason it is so hated?  The fanboys expected it to be FF7-2, and the older fans of the series were put of by the drastic changes to the battle system.

FFIX.  See above reason for hates from fanboys.  Most of the older fans of the series that I know like this one.

FFX. Most people liked this one.  The ones that don't usually complain that the hero was a brat.  That's what makes the story more interesting.  He's not some one-dimensional uber badass(they saved that for Auron).  He's a whiny brat who grows up along the way.

I don't know why so many people hate FFX-2.  Ok, so Squenix was just trying to bleed the last game dry.  I acknowledge that.  The early cutscenes and dialogue are a cornball fest.  After that, though, the game really tends to pick up speed, and fleshes out the FFX universe.  My only complaint about it was the return to ATB(I liked CTB from X better) and the battles need more strategy so that the job changing system could be utilized properly.

FFXI.  Never played it.

FFXII.  Story = Yawn.  It only picks up about 3/4 of the way through the game.  You either love or hate the battle system.  It took a while to grow on me, but now I love it.

Anyway, just my 2 cents about the series starting from the "decline".

On topic:
I had this same idea, literally, a few months ago.  Get out of my head!

FFXII is just a single-player version of FFXI, and if you've played FFXI you don't feel like grinding anymore, nor do you want to deal with long travel times.

I think the problem with FFVII isn't obvious until you've played X and gone back to it after it has aged a bit. FFVII put more emphasis on the story then was usual for FF games, and sure, at the time the "depth" of the storyline was greater then any FF game before it, but after comparing it to X's story it just fell short, and the battle mechanics weren't good enough to make up for it.

It was a transitional game more then anything else, from 2d to 3d, from a simplistic story to something more complex. It couldn't measure up to FFVI gameplay wise, and can't measure up to some newer ones stories. It deserves respect because it was pivotal, but at the same time it's fair to say it was transitional, and not nearly as good as some that came before and after. The same angst in Cloud can be seen in Tidus, but Tidus had Auron to balance him, Cloud didn't have shit.

Honestly, I just think the developers were excited to have the opportunity to have a broader story and just went a little overboard. Either that or us old timers just associate the transition seen in FFVII as a metaphor for the death of our childhood and innocence.

Movies, music, books, most artistic mediums have gone to shit over the last decade or two, it was really just a matter of time before it hit video games. If newer games were stellar, there wouldn't as many people on this website trying to alter Tactics. I don't know about the rest of you, but I think I'm just trying to recapture the glory days of Final Fantasy, and video games in general. =P

QuoteHe's not some one-dimensional uber badass(they saved that for Auron)

I don't know, that scene towards the end of the game, right before you get into Zanarkand and right after the boss fight you had to do after getting out of that cave, showed some depth to Auron.

What did he say?

"Auron: You remind me of myself. Before, the closer I came to Zanarkand, the more I wondered...when we arrive, Braska will call the Final Aeon... He will fight Sin, then die. I thought my mind was made up long before. But when I stood here, my resolve wavered.

Wakka: Huh, never would've figured. Legendary guardians choke sometimes, too, ya?

Auron: (Snort) Legendary guardian? I was just a boy. A boy about your age, actually. I wanted to change the world, too. But I changed nothing. That is my story."

Epic.

On topic: Include Biggs and Wedge. I always liked those two, but I don't recall those two ever making an appearance in Tactics.

Quote from: "nates1984"I agree about FFXI, but I really think the series started going downhill at least at X-2, if not earlier.

I read a really good article about FFVII pointing out that it was really the downturn in the FF series.

http://www.fryingbear.com/articles/crapthology/FF7.htm (http://www.fryingbear.com/articles/crapthology/FF7.htm)

Although I have to admit, FFX was pretty damn good.

EDIT: Darthpaul, you're nuts, FFVI was really good. =P

I never said it was bad the only FFs I don't like is X-2, Chrystal Chronicles, and I think that was it.

I do not recognize Crystal Chronicles as a Final Fantasy game.

Quote from: "Vanya"I do not recognize Crystal Chronicles as a Final Fantasy game.

Normally I don't either but for this I do ...and only this.

Quote from: "nates1984"On topic: Include Biggs and Wedge. I always liked those two, but I don't recall those two ever making an appearance in Tactics.

Strange but true:

Biggs and Wedge are archers in the very first fight of the game, outside of Orbonne.  Their names were butchered to Viggs and Wezaleff, however.

really? those two names were supposed to be "biggs" and "wedge" how weird.

In ff6 "biggs" was "Vicks" which i actually like better, But wedge sounds better than Wezaliff or whatever i guess. they really did butcher the names if thats true

Eh.  I just tried looking for confirmation, and now I realize I've just been assuming it as fact for the past...nine years.  Maybe I was looking too hard for a Biggs and Wedge reference.

*shrug*  Oh well, it works if you squint really, really, ridiculously hard, no?

Quote from: "Zozma"really? those two names were supposed to be "biggs" and "wedge" how weird.

In ff6 "biggs" was "Vicks" which i actually like better, But wedge sounds better than Wezaliff or whatever i guess. they really did butcher the names if thats true

Indeed in the PSP version they are Biggs and Wedge and the mistranslation in the first battle was odd.

what a waste of perfectly good biggs and wedges ... some generics you never see again

Indeed they should have been super generics like Rad, Alicia, and Lavian.

Lol, this thread is going (wonderfully) off-topic fast, so I'll guiltly add to it a bit before it gets back on track (if ever).

It's so refreshing to see an FF discussion (outside of FFT) that isn't about whether FF6 or FF7 is the bestest thing evarz or which one of them sucks more cock than a gay version of Dustman.

It's also nice to see FFX getting some love.

Quote from: "Helbrax"FFX. Most people liked this one.  The ones that don't usually complain that the hero was a brat.  That's what makes the story more interesting.  He's not some one-dimensional uber badass(they saved that for Auron).  He's a whiny brat who grows up along the way.

I disagree about the Auron thing, partly because of what nates already said.

The other part of the reason why I disagree is because is if anyone was closest to the standard "one-dimensional uber badass", then it was Rikku.

Yeah, I said it. But, honestly, think about it. She's basically happy all the time, like she's LITERALLY Yuffie on crack (which is even more ironic considering that horribly unnecessary tie-in I hear they did with X-2...), Mix is still as broken as it was in FFV AND she gets constantly getting things done that others via godless machinery and a spoken coded language.

That is badass.

QuoteOn topic:
I had this same idea, literally, a few months ago.  Get out of my head!

This comment is actually funny because of the current Mindflayer avatar.

You started it by trying to eat people's minds!


With regards to FFX, I only have one thing to ask since I don't want to horribly derail the thread if the OP wants to actually use: Am I the only one who also liked FFX a lot because it like a HUGE critique of Christianity, namely Catholicism?

Quote from: "The Damned"Am I the only one who also liked FFX a lot because it like a HUGE critique of Christianity, namely Catholicism?

FFX kind of struck me as critiquing any major organized religion that imposes an oppressive authority.  That can be represented perhaps best by the Medieval Catholic Church, but it is by no means alone in that distinction (see the unquestioned human sacrifice of the Aztecs, which is somewhat eerily reflected in the self-sacrifice of FFX's summoners and the level of acceptance that denizens of Spira have with Sin's cycle of death and destruction).  It's got more of a case for questioning the status quo, of challenging viewpoints that might not be right but that are supported by the masses only because "that is the way things are."

It's a nice message, one that I agree with whole-heartedly.  But, as a game, I think I hate FFX.  The game play's fun as long as the characters are noticeably different, but once they start reaching outside of their own portion of the sphere grid, I lose interest.  And bleh to the story.

FFT, however, is pretty damn anti-Catholic.

Quote from: "The Damned"With regards to FFX, I only have one thing to ask since I don't want to horribly derail the thread if the OP wants to actually use: Am I the only one who also liked FFX a lot because it like a HUGE critique of Christianity, namely Catholicism?

You hit the nail on the head for why I think it's story is one of the best in the series!!!

Some off topics posts in reply to Auron:

He has about 10 minutes of character development, way late in the game.   True, he isn't entirely one-dimensional, but he is for most of the game.  You only catch pits and pieces of his non-badassery from memory spheres.  I still think that the character is one-dimensional throughout 90% of the game.

100% agree with Rikku.  Tidus, Yuna and Wakka has strong to moderate development.  Lulu and Kimarhi had a tiny bit(about as much as Auron.  A footnote in the story line).  Rikku was pretty much the same from the moment you pick her up till end game.  She doesn't even change in X-2.

FFX storyline was more about the dangers of "any" oppressive organization, but it's easy to draw parallels between the church of Yu Yevon with the dogma of the catholic church, so that's why it's so much easier to catch on to.  It's pretty much the same backplot to *any* RPG.  Instead of an oppressive "Empire" you have an oppressive "religion".  Although I liked the story and the message, I felt it was still a bit of the same old plot.

On-topic:
The only reason I didn't start with rpg maker or something is the massive amount of ruby scripting and editing that would have to be done with the stats.  I wanted as many skills to translate as possible, and certain formulas as well.  Not everything would translate either.  It was just too much work to chew through on my plate between work, school, life, and the dozen other games I have waiting for me that I haven't even started yet.

Auron doesn't need as much development as he is a badass and the little foot note that he was DEAD, or undead if you want to say it like that.

that kinda defeats the purpose of this website.

Quote from: "Zozma"what a waste of perfectly good biggs and wedges ... some generics you never see again

We should make a biggs and wedge patch. You start at level 1, and you work your way up with shit equipment and fight enemies way higher level than yourself, and you have to face off against the intro battle at the end, but they all have ??? stats.