I figured this time around I'd post work in progress pictures so I could incorporate the criticism before I call them "finished" and spend the time to prepare the maps for use.
"Outside Rara Aves" (19x12):
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-b01.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-b02.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-b03.png)
Track: On the Outside (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/ON THE OUTSIDE.ogg)
Event Track: No Such Luck (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/music/No Such Luck.ogg)
Older approach: 001 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/outside_rara_aves_preview-001.png), 002 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/outside_rara_aves_preview-002.png), 003 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/outside_rara_aves_preview-003.png)
"Rara Aves Factory" (18x13):
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/rara-aves-factory-preview-001.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/rara-aves-factory-preview-002.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/rara-aves-factory-preview-003.png)
"Aboard the Rara Avis" (~6x10):
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-g01.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-g02.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-g03.png)
Track: Aboard the Airship (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/AIRSHIP.ogg)
Event Track: Lighter than Air (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/music/Lighter Than Air.ogg)
What it looks like in Blender (the 3d application): 001 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-fb1.jpg)
Older approach: 001 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-001.png), 002 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-002.png), 003 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-003.png)
Yes, one of these days, you may find yourself fighting... in the sky.
--
Stuff that's already been suggested:
Map 1:
- Buildings look expensive (when they're supposed to be cheap/quick/dirty)
- Use dirt/oil instead of metal for floor
- Incorporate wood as a cheap material (instead of metal)
- Too complicated
- Add variation to architecture
- Power lines
- Wind-powered water pump
- Grass/rocks/puddles
Map 2:
- Function of scaffolding not readily ascertained
- Add "its been used before today" feeling to rails/walkways
- Add tracks (to texture) for movement feature of scaffolding
Map 3:
- Extra squares outside of ship area for flying characters
- Design of ship not immediately believable
- Wood textures look flat
- Multi-level design
Words cannot express my love for that third map.
Wow, the third map is realy great! The clouds look yummy :3
The first map looks fun too play. But stricly graphicaly speaking, I think it is too perfect, almost symetric. Is it intentionnal?
On the second map, wich seams to be large. I can imagine some mages trying to hit the others units from to lower stairway. But such a stairway has no reason to exist. Why would people build such a stairway?
This give me an idea: a city build on clouds, there would be 4-5 small clouds of 5x5 to 10x10, linked together with old stairs covered of grass and rare flowers. So the coulds would be on different heights. And some houses on the clouds islands. With some clouds enough close to allow a jump or a magic from one to another.
This would result in a very strategic map.
Howabout the fly movement ability or equipment allowing you to go outside the airship? Would that be possible in tethical?
These are all from the perspective of some form of industrial revolution. On the first map, you have simple manufactured-type houses crammed together because there becomes less and less space elsewhere because of factories. Most people no longer live on/near the farm, because machines make the large amount of workers unnecessary. They work at a factory instead, and so you get the symmetrical poor district. My only other option would be to push the houses up next to each other, I think, to get that idea across, but I'm open to suggestions. On the second map, the stairs are there because I don't plan to have the point between the yellow lines be walkable. I textured the ground there last, but the point of that section is to move out to facilitate larger projects (the object in the 3rd map). The stairs should have been connected to something up instead of down where possible, and the parts attached to the edges should have some form of rollers to get that idea across, I guess.
Why not incorporate the cloud city idea into the stairs map you started earlier? Vary the z-height of the repeated mesh along with x-y transforms and remove some of the steps (to replace with blank squares that are walkable over clouds).
There are no movement abilities (ex: Fly, Move-Find Item, etc) in Tethical at the moment.
There's too much going on in the Sheds map. It looks expensive to build, with that many parts. Why not do cheap corrugated aluminum and plastic on a steel frame look, with dirt floors and oil puddles on the ground?
Quote from: lirmont on June 28, 2011, 02:54:39 pm
There are no movement abilities (ex: Fly, Move-Find Item, etc) in Tethical at the moment.
Well, sure, at the moment. But perhaps its something to keep in mind?
Quote from: Pickle Girl Fanboy on June 28, 2011, 04:13:55 pm
There's too much going on in the Sheds map. It looks expensive to build, with that many parts. Why not do cheap corrugated aluminum and plastic on a steel frame look, with dirt floors and oil puddles on the ground?
Looks very similar to the Dorter map at the beginning of chapter 2. Perhaps at this point wood is cheaper than metal?
Interesting stuff but could that thing fly? it looks like a balloon tethered to a castle of stone... there's no support between the balloon and the base of the ship.
Something that looks so heavy, be it stone or steel is only hanging by threads.
Those clouds do look yummy though.
Interesting workers' barracks also. I see the the concept you are going for, but the tiles are loud (super vivid) and really repetitive.
I love the stair case's structure but that yellowish floor tile is loud. And maybe water would be nice for what the bridge is going over to better show that it isn't a place to walk. It'd be nice to make the bridge structure more dingy or worn since it looks almost like brand new aluminum or something now.
the way i see it the staircase thing is more like a scaffolding for building the airship/balloon things.
P.S. Magic Helium :)
Oil leaks are a great idea. The second map you are looking at a giant pneumatic door on the ground. It opens, sliding both halves of the bridge (I meant it to be scaffolding) out, allowing the airship to be raised and serviced. At the point in time of the map, the airship has reached completion, so, when the floor door opens, the airship is taking off (which, if story ever gets added, will explain why you wound up on the airship). This was the influence for the airship: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FG08HTlBf3Q (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FG08HTlBf3Q). It sports a much bigger balloon in comparison to the base than mine, which is probably a change that would make mine seem viable (whether it is or not).
As for the textures/design being repetitive and loud, that fits with my vision for these maps. There is a driving force for that in the ideas I used as a basis for the direction. This land is a medium-sized volcanic island (Hawaii, as a reference for plausibility). "Rara Aves" (it means "rare birds") is a royal scientific society hailing from somewhere else that undertook an expedition (via airship), ultimately discovering this island and the people that inhabited it. The expedition was lead by an eccentric scientist. A rival scientist of his/hers succeeds in convincing one of the members of the expedition to sabotage the airship. The plan is to strand or seriously inconvenience his/her rival during the expedition's undertaking. When the expedition discovers the island, it lands to explore. The saboteur destroys the more advanced technical components that allowed the airship to fly. Taking a skiff planned for escape in event of an airship problem, the saboteur sets off, only to find the current around the island isn't conducive to leaving easily (the currents surrounding Japan, as a reference for plausibility; Bermuda Triangle?). The saboteur and the rest of the expedition party are stuck on the island.
Returning to find the airship unable to leave the island, the expedition sets in motion a plan to revolutionize the island to a level conducive enough to create a means of escape after determining that sailing will not work. Using parts from the now defunct airship, they craft rudimentary machines that are capable of revolutionizing the island's farming techniques enough to free the majority of the workforce from farming. Being that their only goal is to get off the island, they chose to give the machinery to a headman (as opposed to the people in general) who agrees to help them control the area. The point for this is that they need manpower to develop the more advanced machinery to create a means of escape, since they salvaged parts from their original to bring up the island's technological level (i.e. so they can mine, manufacture, etc). The maps are a year (or more) into that endeavor. The loud textures are repurposed parts from the original airship's components (flamboyantly decked out as any royal-funded, manifest destiny-esque, "We're awesome!" endeavor can be).
About the textures:
I guess my aesthetic views are a little different. I prefer hand pixeled works to photographic textures, but I've already realized that from before I even began here.. no point in butting heads; I understand your opposing view on graphics from the posts in the other thread. The maps look very playable esp. map 1 here.
I appreciate the work you've done with the modeling, I'm just not into the textures' styles I guess.
The second map makes more sense now but the texture is too brand new looking on the scaffolding i.m.o. Edit: also, I don't get how it slides open if the scaffolding is connected to it the way it appears.
Actually, I bet a simple desaturation of the reds would help with the first map's loudness.
We'll just see what happens.. I still need to know more about this project directly from Kivutar before I should move on.. (slightly confused about something in terms of scale)
Imagine there are things attached. More/less/the same believability as the first design?
Image: 001 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-x01.png)
Yes, that seems more feasible. Those clouds look so good in this pic. could you put more clusters around that main one too?
I think some kind oh support built on the bottom of the balloon part to look like it's strongly attached to the ship would be neat. I should scan a little sketch or something to show what i mean..
aye, the chains are a good idea imo
Images: 001 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-x02.png), 002 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-x03.png), 003 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-x04.png)
Wow!
We could use the particle system to emit those clouds, so there would be an illusion of movement.
I'm really liking Lijj's design additions to the blimp, the plain bunker ship section isn't working for me. Great combination of ideas though guys.
FYI, an airship wouldn't use loose chains to secure the ship portion to the balloon because when the rotors start turning they would push the ship portion forward and drag the balloon behind it, where it would snag on parts of the ship or in the rotors, if they are big enough. Dirigibles have, proportionally, very small aerodynamic ship portions secured very close to the balloon (so close that air cannot flow between the the ship and the balloon in some cases) by a stiff framework of lightweight metal. Any windows will be at the sides, front, rear, and perhaps at the bottom, where people can walk around on the transparent plastic and see the clouds beneath their feet (could be a cool effect). An inside airship area, where loading bays at the sides and rear can open and close to allow flying characters in and out. Large windows that can be broken for access sound cool too.
Google Raiders of the Lost Ark for ideas. You forgot the fins at the rear of the ballon, and the propulsion system on the ship. Some airships could have stubby "wings" on the ship portion for steering.
You could also have a "diving hole", an area open to the air in the rear of the airship where people can stand at a railing and look down, and, presumably, fish for seagulls with lumps of bread on a string. Or, even better, you can have an amphibious airship which can suck the helium into holding tanks and fold the balloon and it's framework into an area at the top of the ship, and then move on or under the water.
the blimp was in Last Crusade, Indy was talking to his Dr. Jones Sr. while on it.
Google Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade airship. My bad.
@PFG: too much realistic. The map must be playable first. If the ballon is too big, it would block the camera.
Something like this would be perfect in term of proportions:
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_4MUf6T4VzPw/Sn7BxpITTOI/AAAAAAAALRI/86ubaJkgMag/s1600-h/steampunk-lz100-airship-papercraft-02.jpg)
Also having stairs on the ship makes the map less "plain".
Found a design on wikipedia, which you can see here: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3c/Brockhaus-Efron_Aeronavtika.jpg (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3c/Brockhaus-Efron_Aeronavtika.jpg) (fig. 7).
I really don't like the body for my purposes (the "it's so plain" concern), but, at the same time, I do want to have something that's believable/presentable. Hopefully, if you guys think this version is believable, the body can be adjusted to be more interesting.
Images: 001 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-y01.png), 002 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-y02.png)
Definitely looks less like a deathtrap. just needs a more arrow dynamic platform in the front and some support chains or tethers on the sides of the platform.. Im not sure what the x's are at the feet of the craft either.
The X's are probably just decoration for the assembly that supports the propeller. It was part of the design image I linked, and so I didn't question anything, since we saw what happened when I tried to design an aircraft.
Images: 001 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-y03.png), 002 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-y04.png), 003 (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhacktics/aboard-the-rara-avis-preview-y05.png)
Shapes look good now. It looks solid.
I like it very much.
Just want to say thank you for all the suggestions on the airship map. It's obviously like night and day between the original and what we have now. You can see them on the first post if you skipped here. I'm not going to export any of the maps to Tethical's format until all of them are done, so don't hesitate to add more suggestions into the mix. Thanks!
Good to see such creativity on this project..
The wood textures are the only complaint I have Lirmont, especially on the outside. there's so much you can do with the textures to make the ship seem more special.. using the optical illusions of textures and faux depth.
I saw another amazing map in the works last night from Kivutar that hopefully I will be texturing soon. I'm also working on the double resolution sprites right now; they are very tedious because each frame is at least four times the work and I don't have shishi's to check the frames for these so I need to make gifs manually for each cycle and edit from there til they are perfect. So hopefully I can switch back and forth from texturing and spriting so I don't get bored with one or the other... mostly sprites, because they're huge and therefore time consuming as hell.
If anyone wants to try to make a high resolution sprite let me know.. I can think of only two people I think would be capable of such sprites and that's Smash or Twinees so if you guys are interested or if you do spriting and you are not Smash or Twin but think you can handle the big leagues [(4x pixels at least) per sprite but only 24 frames for fighter types] let me know.. So I can show you the format standard since I changed the format and the proportions slightly to stray from FFt copyrights.
Quote from: Lijj on July 02, 2011, 06:34:24 pmI'm also working on the double resolution sprites right now; they are very tedious because each frame is at least four times the work and I don't have shishi's to check the frames for these so I need to make gifs manually for each cycle and edit from there til they are perfect.
What features do you need from Shishi's? Something that loads an image and cycles through certain blocks of it in order? Also, are you on Windows?
I just realized the above sounds cocky..but I just mean it as in it's hard work so don't say ' ooh I want to try a sprite ' if you don't have the confidence in it or experience (not that I think anyone will, it is work) There is more merit to making one of these though for sure, It's more than a frankensprite and it would be your very own pixel art to be proud of if anyone does decide to give it a shot.
Quote from: lirmont on July 02, 2011, 06:43:07 pm
What features do you need from Shishi's? Something that loads an image and cycles through certain blocks of it in order? Also, are you on Windows?
Yes I'm on windows 7 64 bit.
What features I need or would love is exactly that ,something that shows the selected squares aligned perfectly in a window that I could scroll through and see the frames one by one one by pushing up or down on the keyboard. It would really make this easier and faster.. Especially if the frame scroller program or shishi clone had a refresh command like control r to refresh the saved bmp or pngs.
(http://lijj.ffhacktics.com/fs.png)
Here's the Tethical sprites size and layout from Kivutar's script and doubled in size to show the frames of a type 1.
we need another script for casters with 2 more frames added but we can get to that later
this just shows where the sprites go and what frames are use thank goodness the frames are little..
this isn't an actual tethical sprite
Try to make maps a little more dynamic. If you want a town area with houses, look at some of the FFT maps like Magic City Gariland. Notice how it's not just a straight row of houses; they're positioned differently among interesting terrain elements. A good comparison to yours would be Dorter 2. It IS 2 rows of houses on an incline, but the terrain looks really organic and theres a lot of variation in the architecture.
This is more of a complaint against fantasy movies and video games in general, but could you give that woman some head protection, Lijj? I hate seeing people with all this elaborate body armor but no helmet. Even something like a force field helmet (like full-body shields in Dune) that is just a nearly transparent bubble around her head would be nice.
So here's a test house/dwelling for Map #1. Dirt/dust as the floor, tin as the building material, wood as the door material. Start of pathing leading away from the house to a road. The scene isn't deformed to the height of the sprites yet, so imagine it squished down until the door is the height of a sprite (it'd be about 2.5 units high if you use the sprite's height as a unit).
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_house-a01.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_house-a02.png)
Very nice work.
It would look great with real 3d characters instead of sprites. Don't you think?
If you know where to find some models, I can try to write and abstraction layer over sprites/models for the units.
It probably would, but I'd be more interested in starting work on 3d effects than that. :P
This does look really cool. But it is hard for me to imagine FFT clone sprites running around on.
That's because I haven't scaled it down to be short and stubby yet. Part of my problem (as I understand it) with the original go was trying to copy what FFT did with dimensions (badly, on my part). So this time (like with the airship), I'm modeling in similar proportions to the real world (pictures I found on the internet) and deforming them as a last step to fit dimensions that work for maps (namely square dimensions versus rectangular dimensions).
The engine already does that for you.
The ratio in FFT is (1, 1, 1*6/7).
If you take a look at our custom maps json files, you will see [ 1.5, 1.5, 1.285714286 ] wich is in fact [ 1.5, 1.5, 1.5*6.0/7.0 ].
The engine reads these informations and apply them to your model when loading it. So our blender models can still use blender units when editing them, making easy to stick to the grid.
Note: Since yesterday night, the scale for custom maps became [ 1.85, 1.85, 1.585714286 ], wich is [ 1.85, 1.85, 1.85*6.0/7.0 ] because it fixed many resolution issues. But the ratio never changes.
Trying to brainstorm stuff to litter the map with. In the meantime, progress pictures:
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-a01.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-a02.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-a03.png)
I'm very curious to see the result once in game!
The box and sand on it are nice. Same with the wood support on the ramps.
I could imagine some tires strewn about. Maybe a little human junk but I'm not sure.
One map left to re-do before I spend the large amount of time it will take to prepare the stuff for .egg files.
Here's the list of stuff that's in the map (as of now):
1. Tin shacks
2. Rusted/unusable corrugated tin sheets (free-standing)
3. Wood planks
4. Landscape fences
5. A wheelbarrow
6. Boxes
7. A discarded wheel
8. Oil drums
9. Oil (I might remove this)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-a04.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-a05.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-a06.png)
That big area up top with nothing in it but pathing bugs me, but I've decided that's where I'm placing one of the unit formations. So, it shouldn't look so ignored at the start of actually using the map. The other formation location would be down between the two houses, along the road.
Anyway, another night-and-day transformation, so, once again, thanks for the suggestions.
These are some very intelligently placed ramps and barriers, it is getting interesting. It is still rather visually boring though, maybe so powerlines or something going between the roofs of a few buildings?
Here's what that looks like:
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-b01.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-b02.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-b03.png)
Also, what I have planned music-wise for the two maps that are redone: On the Outside (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/ON THE OUTSIDE.ogg) and Aboard the Airship (http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/AIRSHIP.ogg).
Well I think this was a little too much, but I think it definitely adds a lot of visual flair to the map. Could you take down the power line poll and just have a few going between the buildings? Not every building, but like 3 or 4 lines, add a little dip to them so they aren't soo straight.
could the power lines be more terrain? best for range types to rain down hell on their foes? maybe i'm just wishful and have been playing too much inFAMOUS
Quote from: RandMuadDib on July 25, 2011, 03:18:21 am
could the power lines be more terrain? best for range types to rain down hell on their foes? maybe i'm just wishful and have been playing too much inFAMOUS
>.< I almost don't want to change it now because that would be so epic.
This is starting to look very good! Please go on polishing this map. Your are close to define a new style.
Suggestions:
- you can work on the floor adding grass, puddle, small rocks, what ever
- add an animated model like this http://wolpeper.com/generation-eolienne.jpg (http://wolpeper.com/generation-eolienne.jpg)
Quote from: Kivutar on July 25, 2011, 03:41:22 amYour are close to define a new style.
I'm gonna call it the "Crowd-Source Method". :P I just meant that making the power lines above the houses playable is such an intriguing idea that it has made me regret thinking about changing them.
Anyway, this is what it looks like toned down:
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-gx1.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-gx2.png)
Awesome, and then have only one going across the middle of the map between two of the houses. You work very fast lirmont, and as Kivutar said you are really defining your own style.
This adds lines between the middle section houses, and it adds a rusty wind-powered water pump. Puddles to follow.
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-gy1.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-gy2.png)
The windmill is a great idea and it adds a nice splash of color. I thought the powerline between the the house might be in the air though. Can you do a few of this map without the haze?
This is what they look like without anti-aliasing, if that's what you mean by "haze". If not, it's part of the lighting of the scene (which is set up for the dirt texture to look like it does, so I don't want to change it).
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-gz1.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-gz2.png)
Also, here are two shots with no perspective or anti-aliasing:
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-gz3.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-gz4.png)
Could you add a platform and catwalk to the windmill, so someone could climb up there? You might have to put the fan on a different side so it won't have arrows passing through the blades of the fan as you fire down, or you could make the fan higher and have the platform halfway up. It might also be a good idea to make the windmill face a radically different direction from the rest of the map, so it looks less boxlike and artificial.
Also, windmills of this type are commonly used to pump water from wells in arid and plains regions in poor countries. So you could put a cistern up there, and have water pipes come out from underneath it and run to a public pump and a trough, if you have horses or chocobos. Also, windmills of this type are usually pretty big, something like 3 to 5 times as large as the houses around them.
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/47/164426484_018acece54.jp
http://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/democratherald.com/content/tncms/assets/editorial/b/e3/76b/be376b46-504e-11e0-a428-001cc4c002e0-revisions/4d818d7bb5608.image.jpg
http://wwwdelivery.superstock.com/WI/223/4102/PreviewComp/SuperStock_4102-15857.jpg
http://blog.seattlepi.com/insidebelltown/files/library/color_section_small.jpg
http://www.nwwsi.com/Images/16ft3000/7.jpg
http://chestofbooks.com/home-improvement/repairs/Mechanics-Household/images/Fig-148-This-diagram-shows-the-arrangement-of-domestic-w.jpg
http://rickardolson.com/Wind%20P1.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2473/5815693393_86e201504d.jpg
And if this is a desert town with at least electric technology, barbed wire should exist and wood should be hard to come by (no trees, it has to be carted in). I'm not saying you won't have any wooden fences; I am saying there will be wire and barbed wire fences.
I don't know if there will be a Joshua tree in town (hardwoods are the first to be cut down) but there might be a cactus in a back alley or something. And oil puddles won't show up in desert environments. Most lubricated parts are covered and protected from blowing sand when in the desert. The sand gets everywhere, and, being quartz and silicates, it will cut the crap out of metal when it gets caught between moving parts. So you won't find a machine shop out there, unless there's a damn good reason to be there. Like money. Like oil, or coal, or gold, or silver, or uranium, or unobtainium, or whatever expensive magic mineral you want.
You need to figure out some of the story elements before you move forward, but keep in mind that in this medium (video games) the artwork will influence the story as much as the story influences the art. So, why is this town here? Figure that out, and you know what to add to it, and the purpose of each building. Is this a shantytown? Where is worker housing (old broken bunk beds stacked behind it)? Where is the company store? Where is the whorehouse/saloon? Where is worker gear storage? Where is heavy wheeled equipment (this building will need one or two large roll doors, like those found on tractor barns) storage? Where is precious mineral storage? Are the minerals flammable? What kind of protection do they need? Could there be a scenario to blow up the minerals, or steal them? Where is the bank? Where is the mineral appraisal area, where they keep the well-paid nerds and geologists (mages, whatever) who appraise this stuff and decide it's worth? Where is the management (the pitboss, the overseers, and the thugs, enforcers, and mercenaries the company or pitboss hires to keep the workers in line) housing? Where is the geologist housing?
You won't be able to fit this all on one map. So why not make a little reference drawing of the town (if you decide to run with this idea) so you can make maps of all the places you'll use?
Quote from: Pickle Girl Fanboy on July 26, 2011, 02:09:39 pmSo, why is this town here? Figure that out, and you know what to add to it.
I touched on this earlier, but this town is located on a volcanic island. The population is force-fed some level of technology by an outside source that lands there and subsequently cannot leave (because their mode of transportation is sabotaged). The technology (equipment suitable for farming) is given into the hands of certain land owners (as opposed to the population at large). This results in a majority of the workforce being unemployed (the goal of giving the technology only to a select few). The group that got stranded employs them (primarily with food and housing), resulting in a crappy living situation (something akin to forced labor) and dislocation from areas most suitable to farming into an area centered around a factory (run by said group). The maps are set a year into the arrival of the people/technology that landed there.
Anyway, it's not a desert climate; it's one suitable for farming/grasslands/etc. So, I can see tacking the cistern on and putting platforming around it, but I can't really tell from the pictures where/how the pump's out-flow connects to a raised cistern/reservoir. I'm not the most mechanically inclined (remember my design for the airship?) so any help would be appreciated. At the moment, there is a hole attached to the base of the pump's shaft that acts as an outflow. I am trying to make an effort to make sure every suggestion's 3d counterpart does have a function though, and this is one of the reasons I didn't go with a more advanced design (because I had trouble figuring it out just looking at it).
Thanks!
I'll draw something for you. You could also look at the cistern in Fieval Goes West, or the cistern in the middle of Nibelheim in Final Fantasy 7.
This map looks like something out of the tv show "Firefly".
Rough idea of a cistern, windmill, and platform. Or is that a giant sunflower?
Here's what I have so far (based off the drawing):
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-px1.png)
wow that's cool. It's a redneck death corps fovoham base lulz
Wow, this is a great model!
The outflow pipe (the one at the bottom of the cistern) is too large. And you don't have in inflow pipe, which will move water from deep underground to the cistern. It doesn't have to terminate on top of the cistern, but it should be near to top if it terminates in the side of the cistern. The inflow pipe should also come right out of the ground, not from the windmill. For convienence, put it next to the (smaller, next time) outflow pipe.
The platform should go all the way around the windmill and cistern, so people can walk around it and fix things.
The platform itself can't hold a cistern with much water. The cistern needs a metal supporting structure, just like the cisterns in those pictures. It's on a platform and above the roofs of other houses so it can provide adequate water pressure to those houses.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_tower
^The pictures in this article should help. And, though it's not really needed, you could make the bottom of the cistern rounded or shaped like a funnel where the outflow pipe meets the cistern. And the outflow pipe can just go straight into the ground; it doesn't have to be curved. All the pipes which lead to the houses, as well as the actual pumping machines that the wind turbine power, are underground.
Alright, here's the second try:
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-py1.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-py2.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-py3.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-py4.png)
This try includes a metal frame for the cistern/tank, an inflow pipe attached near the top of the cistern, scaffolding around and up the structure as a whole, and a smaller outflow pipe. This version is 6x4 playable squares.
Also, start of the second map being re-done:
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/rara-aves-factory-preview-w01.png)
Wow!
Good job lirmont !
It looks great!
When are we going to see a pic of this windmill in the entire map?
I just wanted to wait until the people that had contributed the ideas got a chance to comment on them. So, since that's happened:
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-pz1.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-pz2.png)
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-pz3.png)
And one for kicks:
(http://darkabstraction.com/showOff/ffhackticks/outside_rava_aves_preview-pz4.png)
Request Filled!!
This is freaking amazing looking. I want to battle on this map. Even the layout and mechanics of this map are intelligent in addition to the actual visual design.
The level of detail will just never look good with sprites though right? We need some 3D models on this.
I wouldn't write sprites off yet. It will certainly look different than FFT, but mostly I think the focus is on making sure that the proportions match (namely, how tall things are by comparison to the sprite). Basically, what is the end result of a 3D character model anyway? It's a 2D sprite that composites variable lighting, textures, and other passes over a set amount of screen space (determined by what the camera can see of it). In other words, the map can be proportioned against the sprite (which is what I've done already, to the best of my knowledge), and I bet the end result will still look really good (and hopefully it'll be fun to play).
That windmill fits great in there.
I agree with cheetah this looks condusive to an epic battle.
Maybe if you end up using the sprites you could recolor them with softer colors or something.
Wow Lirmont, These maps are amazing :D, I wonder why square didnt recruit you for map making XD cuz I would :D.
I wonder when Lirmonet create new maps ?