Final Fantasy Hacktics

Since we've got people thinking about their favorite RPGs (http://ffhacktics.com/smf/index.php?topic=10547.0) recently, I decided to turn that around and head in the opposite direction - what are the worst RPGs you've played? They need not be downright awful (though it will be more interesting if they are), just whatever rubbed you the wrong way.

I haven't played any truly terrible RPGs, myself, which is really what has me curious. My worst experiences are mainly from games that just don't stand the test of time for my tastes. But, to get the ball rolling...

Final Fantasy II (not to be confused with FFIV)
Being an NES RPG, the story was never going to be what really carried this game - because the gameplay is what mattered most at the time - and the gameplay was laughably atrocious. Playing this game is about as fun as beating yourself in the face, which is aptly the best method of leveling your team's stats. It's all just broken and stupid. But I'm sure none of this news to you, so let's move on.

Dragon Quest (you probably remember it as Dragon Warrior)
Another drudgery in the gameplay department, the grandfather of JRPGs has you opening menus to perform any task, even to simply walk up stairs. To call the gameplay 'clunky' would be overly diplomatic, especially when the accuracy of your attacks feels like a game of roulette. Get your eyes checked, dude.

Final Fantasy: Mystic Quest
There was a time when it was part of gamer culture to hate on this game like it kicked your dog, and I've since seen a fair amount of love for this game from people who genuinely played it when it first came out. Considering I had already played not only FFIV but FFVI before getting to this game, I am most certainly not in the latter camp. I've heard the music be defended as catchy and memorable, but I've played through this miserable thing multiple times and can't recall a single tune. All I ever remember is feeling cheated by a nothing game wearing a pretty title, like that time I brought home Mario is Missing. Only worse.

I'll neglect to mention Quest 64 to any great extent, except to mention that I found it more memorable than Mystic Quest. I mean, I can still hear that wretched little battle theme in my head, at least.

I love these threads :D
I'll just list my top 3, as has been the trend.

1. Phantasy Star III
- The second RPG I actually owned (the first being Final Fantasy). As a kid, I could never even figure out what the hell to do in this game. 20 years later, without the
help of a walkthrough I STILL can't fucking figure it out other than that I needed to find a cyborg. I don't know if it was simply that or the gameplay itself, but ever since
I have been terribly put off by this game. The box and cart for it have been in storage for many years. Seriously fuck this game.
(Note: Phantasy Star II & IV are awesome)

2. Fallout Tactics
- I've always been a HUGE fan of Fallout, I own every game and have every achievement for the 360 and PS3 versions of 3 and NV. I even have a picture of Vaultboy tattooed
on my chest. That being said, the gameplay in this game was sooo annoying compared to Fallout 1 & 2. I tried so hard to like this game and even bought it on the PS2 when
it was released as Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel. I did end up beating this one unlike Phantasy Star III. However in the end, it only made me wish I was playing Fallout 2 instead.

3. Final Fantasy XIII
- This one seems to be about 50/50, either people love it or hate it. I personally don't like it one bit, this may be due to the fact that I had not played a FF game since IX
(which I also didn't care for, fuck you Tetra Master). This was another game I tried REALLY hard to like. I played about halfway through disc 2 (Xbox version) and nothing ever
grabbed my attention or interest. I hear everyone say the PS3 version is better, however, since I don't give two fucks about graphics, I highly doubt that would be the case for
me, unless it entirely changed the game into something I could enjoy.

Oooooh, Phantasy Star III. Phantasy Star was the first RPG I ever had (and, to this day, the only SMS game I own), and PSII and IV are undeniable classics. I don't hate III as much as other Phantasy Star fans do, but I admit that it's every bit the redheaded stepchild it's known to be. It's not a game I see myself replaying ever again.

I've made it rather known that I have a sort of Stockholm Syndrome with FFXIII, since I forced myself to play through it after it was given to me as a birthday present. I think that once you get roughly halfway in it's a perfectly fine game as long as you ignore the part of the title that defines it as a Final Fantasy, but I don't deny any of the complaints anyone has with the game, because they're all 100% true. Also, the PS3 version just has much prettier FMVs, runs at a higher resolution, has more detail, and both fewer and shorter loading times, along with the benefit of being on one disc. So yes, the PS3 version is better, but you're not missing any of the experience by playing on 360 instead. If you don't like it on 360, you won't like it any better on PS3. I own and have 100% completed both versions, so I will allow myself to speak with this authority.

Hoshigami
<Main character> Why are we fighting, we are friends!
<Ally> ¯\(°_o)/¯ because I feel like it.
Note that I only played halfway through the game, but this scenario happened for 3/4th of what I played. It's always like that; it's ridiculous. That's about all I can say about the storyline, because oh my gosh is it lacking. It's a Turn-based SRPG, but halfway through the game, there are 18 enemies on the map. Eighteen. Do you have any idea how long an enemy turn takes with 18 enemies? Five. Fucking. Minutes. That's the main reason I gave up playing that game... I had been soloing with the main character, something you can totally do up until that point, it's just not nearly as rewarding as say, Disgaea soloing. The battle system is interesting on its own: there are quite a few weapons, but ultimately, you'll have everyone with boomerangs because of their kickass range while still doing great damage. Spells are cast by using coins. Coins can be leveled up, and while it doesn't take much time early on, it gradually becomes the worst pain in the ass ever just so that your spells are as useful mid-game as they were early game.
GRIND GRIND GRIND GRIND YOUR TEETH.

Most bad RPGs I stop playing before they do any real damage and thus I forget I even played them. As such, all I have are unfair examples; these are probably decent games but I both hated them and felt compelled to play them to a substantial degree.

Valkyrie Profile 2.
The first game is one of my favorites ever. They left sequel hooks for both a prequel and an actual sequel, and unfortunately they decided to do both at the same time with time travel shenanigans. It ended badly. VERY badly. Also they butchered the excellent battle system of the original by adding a worthless positioning system (the different body part targeting they also added wasn't so bad, though it didn't add much either).

FFT Advance.
Ya'll know this one. The story literally made me feel ill. It's probably one of the worst stories I've ever experienced in any form. Of course the gameplay changes from FFT also bugged me, but at least I wouldn't describe those as "abysmal"; more like "not suited to my taste."


Again both these are decent games in their own right but had reasons to disappoint me massively.

FF8
Retarded in so many ways, it's not even funny

- Super duper bland story (Oh, you all come from the same Orphanage as me? Too cool!)
- Horrid system/balance (Using magic makes you weaker! Not levelling > Levelling! You can craft the final weapon in Cd1!)
- Comes after a GREAT game (FF7) and it's the first FF ever translated in Italian (So I had high expectations...)

I suspect that the only reason I like FF: Mystic Quest is the fact that it was the first RPG I ever played. I played about half-way through it before I'd even learned to read, and played it multiple times. It's not really a great RPG though.

Worst that I can remember were both Playstation games.

Beyond the Beyond: I didn't get very far at all on it. Was pretty bland.

Digimon World: My memory of it isn't that great, but I remember it being tedious and boring with combat just being sitting there and letting two monsters exchange attacks. I remember being very disappointed.

Quote from: Fox on August 25, 2014, 06:11:22 am.

Digimon World: My memory of it isn't that great, but I remember it being tedious and boring with combat just being sitting there and letting two monsters exchange attacks. I remember being very disappointed.

oh god.  so much so.  you had to be near a toilet at all times in case your digimon needed to go and if you let him dooky on the ground too many times he digivolved into the stupid poop digimon.  2 and 3 were just as tedious.  in 2 you couldn't make it through a dungeon without your car breaking sone vital part or not bringing enough missiles or having to go back and dna digivolve so you can gain 2 more levels.  in 3 it sends you all over the world with little to no hint on what you are actually supposed to do and no way to fast travel so you spend 3 hours rabdom battling stupid monsters way below your level for no reason.

these games, man...

More comments! I was actually going to include FFTA, but figured I'd gone on long enough. Aside from the gameplay not agreeing with me (Judges can go to hell), the whole thing was just a massive disappointment. They shouldn't even joke about calling that place Ivalice, I'm sorry. Why not just say Hitman takes place in Spira?

I haven't gotten the chance to play really play VP: Silmeria, since I don't have a good way of hooking up my PS2, and the game doesn't run very well in pcsx2 at all. But I'm sure I would have liked VP: Hrist more either way. Lenneth's game is hard to top, though. The US PSX version, I mean. Fuck that PSP version. Haven't been more disappointed in a game I bought until WotL.

Beyond the Beyond, oh my. I would have included that if I had remembered it, but it's far too forgettable.

I never could understand Digimon to start with. "This Pokemon thing is pretty popular, huh? Let's steal that idea, but give all the monsters creepier eyes." But I had my own car by the time Pokemon was a thing, so even that was lost on me. I never understood the draw of it, even though (or perhaps because?) the entire student body of my high school was into Pokemon. Final Fantasy VII was much less of a big deal, and I was having a much better time with that. Even though I didn't understand why the character models were so goofy, or why it seemed to have worse sound quality than FFVI. And worse proofreading than the school newspaper.

Also, I love Final Fantasy VIII, and I have no idea why. I can only think of reasons why it is hateful, stupid, nonsensical, etc... but I still love it. No idea why.

Quote from: Toshiko on August 25, 2014, 01:18:14 pm
Final Fantasy VII was much less of a big deal, and I was having a much better time with that. Even though I didn't understand why the character models were so goofy, or why it seemed to have worse sound quality than FFVI. And worse proofreading than the school newspaper.

Attack while the tail's up!  Off course!

Also, yeah.  I loved ff8 as well.  I think it was all the extra stuff you could do.

Quote from: Dome on August 25, 2014, 02:47:10 am
FF8
Retarded in so many ways, it's not even funny

- Super duper bland story (Oh, you all come from the same Orphanage as me? Too cool!)
- Horrid system/balance (Using magic makes you weaker! Not levelling > Levelling! You can craft the final weapon in Cd1!)
- Comes after a GREAT game (FF7) and it's the first FF ever translated in Italian (So I had high expectations...)

Fail (It's spam, I can totally say that)

Quote from: Rufio on August 25, 2014, 07:49:50 am
oh god.  so much so.  you had to be near a toilet at all times in case your digimon needed to go and if you let him dooky on the ground too many times he digivolved into the stupid poop digimon.  2 and 3 were just as tedious.  in 2 you couldn't make it through a dungeon without your car breaking sone vital part or not bringing enough missiles or having to go back and dna digivolve so you can gain 2 more levels.  in 3 it sends you all over the world with little to no hint on what you are actually supposed to do and no way to fast travel so you spend 3 hours rabdom battling stupid monsters way below your level for no reason.

these games, man...

I can understand the issue with the first game, as I could never fucking understand how it worked in the first place. However the second game was not much different than
any other dungeon crawling RPG, so I'm not sure where that comes from, it wasn't even particularly hard. Just like any other game of that type, it's quite repetitive. Now
Digimon World 3 I dont understand the complaints for one bit, it was just a standard JRPG with many different characters (Digimon) to get in your party, it was a pretty
awesome game :P dunno where the no hints or sending all over the world thing you are talking about comes from, i beat DW3 without any issues and only got lost once or
twice due to exploring places I shouldn't have been yet, then again, I don't really enjoy games that say, "go to this place and do this, then come back here so I can send you
somewhere else to do the same thing"
(Digimon World 4 was pretty awesome too, especially for the multiplayer aspect)

Quote from: Toshiko on August 25, 2014, 01:18:14 pm
Beyond the Beyond, oh my. I would have included that if I had remembered it, but it's far too forgettable.

This ^^

Quote from: Toshiko on August 25, 2014, 01:18:14 pm
I never could understand Digimon to start with. "This Pokemon thing is pretty popular, huh? Let's steal that idea, but give all the monsters creepier eyes." But I had my own car by the time Pokemon was a thing, so even that was lost on me. I never understood the draw of it, even though (or perhaps because?) the entire student body of my high school was into Pokemon. Final Fantasy VII was much less of a big deal, and I was having a much better time with that. Even though I didn't understand why the character models were so goofy, or why it seemed to have worse sound quality than FFVI. And worse proofreading than the school newspaper.

I actually enjoyed Digimon a lot more than Pokemon. I even enjoyed the first season of the show (used to tape it along with Monster Rancher every friday) I always found
the concept a lot more enjoyable than Pokemon. It wasn't really a stolen idea other than 'Mon' in the name and the use of Monsters. Digimon are intelligent and can talk
and aren't caught through some ball thing, nor was the objective ever, ermergerd, gotta catch em all. That being said, I still love pokemon as well :P

Quote from: Toshiko on August 25, 2014, 01:18:14 pm
Also, I love Final Fantasy VIII, and I have no idea why. I can only think of reasons why it is hateful, stupid, nonsensical, etc... but I still love it. No idea why.

Another THIS ^^
FF8 is my favorite game in the FF series. Even more so than 7. I even completely agree with everything you mentioned, but for some reason it just holds such
a special place in my heart. It may be due to the junction/battle system which i very much loved, or simply triple triad. Plus, it has Zell, and at the time I played it, I very much
related to Squall, being the socially awkward person that I am.

Dude, "I think there's an Agumon that can help you with that." was the entire clue you are given at one point near the end game.  Do you know how many Agumon there are by the time you get that far? Or how many towns on both servers you can go to? Or the fact that the maze between servers makes no sense whatsoever.  Maybe I was just angry because my stupid digimon fail at training when I take them to the secret gyms.  haha.

Haha, fair enough. I just remember still really enjoying it the last time I played it, but I haven't gotten passed about mid-game since the first
time I beat it. Which was right around the time it came out, so I'm likely forgetting some of the frustration.

Quote from: Elric on August 25, 2014, 06:44:55 pm
Fail

(http://images5.fanpop.com/image/photos/24800000/Your-argument-is-invalid-random-24837760-500-582.jpg)

P.s: Don't fucking apoligize for stating your opinions. It's spam, we are meant to hurt each other' feelings

FF8 IS THE WORST PIECE OF SHIT EVER, AND EVERYONE WHO DISAGREES IS A FUCKING FAGGOT (Or a bisexual furry pony)

^^

Equal opportunity hater right here folks.

Don't make me turn you back into the Spam mod.

P.S. Who the fuck apologized? I stated that I was allowed to do so, never said I was sorry for it :P

FF8 was amazing, the fact that you could get the final weapon right after timber if you played enough cards was awesome.  the junction system was brilliant.  and the draw system of magic was a nice change from MP.

Agreed on all accounts

I would say that Dirge of Cerberus (FF7) was pretty bad for Final Fantasy standards. One game I first hated, but eventually got into was Enchanted Arms for the Xbox 360.

Agreed on the Dirge of Cerberus.   Does anyone remember Quest64?  It was like, the only N64 RPG and I don't have good memories of it at all but can't recall why.

I mentioned Quest 64 in the OP, yeah. I rented it and played through it with a couple days to spare before it needed to be returned. I've gone back to it two or three more times in the past 15 years just to see how badly it was aging, really. It's clunky, and I hate the random battles (but I universally hate random battles, anyway), and all I ever really manage to remember is the final dungeon (despite seeing it exactly once), the overworld music, and battle music. It's not so much awful as just... bland and pointless. It's the Nissan Sunny of RPGs.

Yeah that sounds about right.  For some reason my brain completely failed to process that there was an entire other paragraph after your Mystic Quest one.  I remember wanting an RPG for my 64 soo badly because I loved Chrono Trigger and FF3 (6) soo much.  I also just remembered that Paper Mario was a thing that existed and that I never really played it for some reason

Quote from: Dome on August 25, 2014, 08:14:42 pmFF8 IS THE WORST PIECE OF SHIT EVER, AND EVERYONE WHO DISAGREES IS A FUCKING FAGGOT (Or a bisexual furry pony)

I'd point out that I actually agree with you, but I'm taking a class right now that teaches standard logic and through using that I know that your statement is not incorrect. You only said anything about people who disagree with you, but nothing about people who DO agree with you. Thus, I can be a depraved bisexual furry pony and agree with you without you being wrong.



Also Mystic Quest is great and anyone who disagrees is a stupid head.

He only stated if(¬A)→B which is a perfectly fine logical statement in and of itself.  It does not imply if(B)→(¬A).

Edit: which is exactly what you said.  I missed your double negative "not incorrect".

Earthbound.

Any of them. Pick one. I've tried to play several and I can't get more than about 30 minutes into them before the voice in my head screaming "What the fuck is this bullshit?" just drives me to give up. I do not get what people see in it. There is too much focus on wacky comedy for the game to take the time to make me give any kind of a shit about the plot or characters. And speaking of the 'comedy', I really use the term loosely because nothing about it is even remotely funny. All I see is one bad, failed joke or pun after another and I just want to facepalm after each.

Beyond that, the art direction just boggles the mind. I won't say it looks bad but my mind just can't comprehend the viewing angle of the world because all I see is this twisted landscape where "up" isn't perpendicular to the ground but rather a 45-degree angle elevated away from it.

The mechanics are nothing but the standard recycled Dragon Quest basics with very little to set it apart there. There is so little of note about them that I can't think of anything else to say about it. *yawn*

I just do not understand how this series has any kind of a following at all. When a game's best and most-defining feature is 'being quirky' then you've got a problem.

Plus, shooting yourself in the butt with a lightning ball just so you can triple jump is super annoying.

Grandia.

I have no love for this game whatsoever.  I remember my mom bought it a few years after we'd gotten a playstation.  I'd done played the hell out of the other four games we had (FFT included), and I remember being soooo excited to play this... Then I just... hated it. From start to me turning it off after a few hours.  I had my mom take it back, lol.   Sad that a physical copy is something like $120 now.  Can't win all the PSX lotteries.  I have two copies of FF7, a FFT, and the first two Suikoden...  Can't get much better than that, but it'd be nice to own a game with a price tag that I wanted to get rid of.  Honestly, I've no idea why I even hated it now.  I've tried to play it again with emulators, but it failed.  Just not my game.

Enchanted Arms

This game is VERY much the WORST game I've EVER played, and FINISHED.  FFXIII wasn't this bad, it's next on the list, but it wasn't this bad.  This game I poured hours upon hours into.  I built up the main character so much!  I finally got through this horrible battle system... To find out that the final boss fight was not only super effective on that character, but would also steal my fakkin turn.  So, it was a LONG and drawn out loop of >>Smack the boss, die, heal... TURN STOLEN! GAME OVER!<< until I finally got lucky.  I don't even want to to talk about the horrid scripted dialog, and the even worse voice acting.  I'd sooner go to jail than play this again.

Final Fantasy XIII and it's spawned ilk

Hey!  I got a great idea for a game! We can spend countless hours designing a full world and amazing system for leveling!  We can just cheat off the sphere grid, and make it pretty for stats.   Hmm, pretty... I like that... LET'S MAKE THIS GAME BEAUTIFUL!  The main character can even have a really bad ass gravity device!  She'll only use it twice, but screw it.  It's only there to make her more badass than Cloud for fifteen minutes anyway.  Now... The best part about this game?!  It's a hallway.  Yeah.  A forty hour long hallway.  I mean... We'll change the scenery... Even throw in some exceptionally big rooms...  Then, seeing as the forty hour long hallway can really bore some folks, her sister can have the most confusing god damned time line of a story that anyone that knows how to correctly count will just give up on figuring it out.   Can't wait for the third one.

Okay, I need to set one thing straight. Grandia is pretty standard through the first disc. Nothing really special, just ordinary JRPG fare that's all a bit one dimensional. It's the SECOND disc where everything explodes and goes topsy-turvy and it becomes the masterpiece everybody says it is. Because it is a masterpiece. I'll forgive you for not finishing it, but I won't let you call it awful without finishing it. Seriously, anybody who's played through the game will tell you this.

As an aside, despite having Grandia for freaking years, I bought and played Grandia II on Dreamcast loooooooong before getting around to the first game. Which is to say, I made Xifanie play it for me, since she had such praise for it. I really liked Grandia II until she showed me how much better the first game was.

Edit: My Stockholm Syndrome for FFXIII aside, I say XIII-2 is pretty fucking godawful, but Lightning Returns is actually fun to play. I expected to hate it even more than I do Majora's Mask, given the similar time limit mechanic, but it really is fun. A damn sight better than XIII-2, at least.

Quote from: Toshiko on August 26, 2014, 02:18:02 am
Okay, I need to set one thing straight. Grandia is pretty standard through the first disc. Nothing really special, just ordinary JRPG fare that's all a bit one dimensional. It's the SECOND disc where everything explodes and goes topsy-turvy and it becomes the masterpiece everybody says it is. Because it is a masterpiece. I'll forgive you for not finishing it, but I won't let you call it awful without finishing it. Seriously, anybody who's played through the game will tell you this.

As an aside, despite having Grandia for freaking years, I bought and played Grandia II on Dreamcast loooooooong before getting around to the first game. Which is to say, I made Xifanie play it for me, since she had such praise for it. I really liked Grandia II until she showed me how much better the first game was.

Edit: My Stockholm Syndrome for FFXIII aside, I say XIII-2 is pretty fucking godawful, but Lightning Returns is actually fun to play. I expected to hate it even more than I do Majora's Mask, given the similar time limit mechanic, but it really is fun. A damn sight better than XIII-2, at least.

maybe grandia should swap first discs with Xenogears

Final Fantasy Tactics. It's a game so horribly broken, so unbalanced, and so poorly made that it requires an extensive modding community to make it good, often times rewriting its entire story and characters. This is good, because the plot makes no sense, and is poorly translated The characters are not engaging. Oh, cool, a character that could have a kinda cool plotline? As soon as you get them in the party, they're just generics with an exclusive job. Great character idea, idiots. Don't understand the love for this game. It's not even Final Fantasy.

Quote from: Kaijyuu on August 26, 2014, 01:15:53 am
I'd point out that I actually agree with you, but I'm taking a class right now that teaches standard logic and through using that I know that your statement is not incorrect. You only said anything about people who disagree with you, but nothing about people who DO agree with you. Thus, I can be a depraved bisexual furry pony and agree with you without you being wrong.

You are a Bisexual furry faggot
Problem solved

Quote from: Elric on August 25, 2014, 08:17:42 pm
Don't make me turn you back into the Spam mod.

(http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/485/488/28a.png)

Final Fantasy All The Bravest: Could been awesome, you dont get to choose your jobs, your attack targets are randomized if you re not fighting a single enemy/boss. Your characters are always 1-HKO'd, which makes 32 max characters a hell to survive mainly with long cooldowns to attack again, but at least when they are attacking they dont die (also they dont in fever mode, which freezes your enemies and you keep attacking wihtout cooldown but it goes away quickly). Its just a big trap to waste money to buy golden hourglasses to revive all your characters and keep playing without having to wait 3 hours for it. I know they tried to innovate but it sucked, Pictlogica innovated and it was so fun to play even though it was 100% japanese and i had no idea what the menu said.

Class of Heroes:I dont like that Dungeon Crawling system at all, and its the thing that you do alot, because if you dont grind like a motherfucker you will never suceed in here. I wouldnt mind that if good graphics, animations, battle mechanics, and storytelling were present in the game.

Evergrace: PS1-quality graphics, awkward controls, terrible translation (and voice work), limited exploration and laggy battles. Then you combine All that with insta-death pits everywhere - including the final boss battles.

Quote
Evergrace: PS1-quality graphics, awkward controls, terrible translation (and voice work), limited exploration and laggy battles. Then you combine All that with insta-death pits everywhere - including the final boss battles.

Guessing you don't like Shadow Tower, Kings Field, Demons Souls or Dark Souls either then huh? Cuz Evergrace was the shit yo, as was it's
sequel Forever Kingdom.

Quote from: Celdia on August 26, 2014, 01:38:28 am
Earthbound.

Any of them. Pick one. I've tried to play several and I can't get more than about 30 minutes into them before the voice in my head screaming "What the fuck is this bullshit?" just drives me to give up. I do not get what people see in it. There is too much focus on wacky comedy for the game to take the time to make me give any kind of a shit about the plot or characters. And speaking of the 'comedy', I really use the term loosely because nothing about it is even remotely funny. All I see is one bad, failed joke or pun after another and I just want to facepalm after each.

Beyond that, the art direction just boggles the mind. I won't say it looks bad but my mind just can't comprehend the viewing angle of the world because all I see is this twisted landscape where "up" isn't perpendicular to the ground but rather a 45-degree angle elevated away from it.

The mechanics are nothing but the standard recycled Dragon Quest basics with very little to set it apart there. There is so little of note about them that I can't think of anything else to say about it. *yawn*

I just do not understand how this series has any kind of a following at all. When a game's best and most-defining feature is 'being quirky' then you've got a problem.

but... but... you get to beat up rabid dogs with baseball bats :(
Plus, Mr. Saturn.

Though i get what you mean, I guess my love for the EB games comes from playing the SNES one when i was younger with my brother, since you can actually control in
battle with both controllers, so one person would walk around and another would battle and then switch off :P

I guess its kinda one of those things where you grow to love it because its one of the only things you have to play.

Also, for sale sign, nuff said :P

Beyond the Beyond.

Quote from: Elric on August 26, 2014, 01:34:14 pm
Guessing you don't like Shadow Tower, Kings Field, Demons Souls or Dark Souls either then huh? Cuz Evergrace was the shit yo, as was it's
sequel Forever Kingdom.

I didnt say i didnt like it, i said it was bad compared to the ones i played, and might not be the 3rd worse rpg i played, i probably forgot many others, i have a really bad memory; Also never played shadow tower, kings field, but loved demons and dark souls. I was going to get Forever Kingdom in the store but i saw .Hack// quadrilogy and got those instead, no regrets.


And in response to people up there i liked Mystic Quest, FFXIII, Grandia and Earthbound. :v

Quote from: Elric on August 26, 2014, 01:34:14 pm
but... but... you get to beat up rabid dogs with baseball bats :(

But I can do that in real life. I like my games for their escapism. :P

Quote from: Elric on August 26, 2014, 01:34:14 pm
Plus, Mr. Saturn.

Okay, I don't know what that thing's deal is, but it is ugly as sin. Looks like some kind of fucked up mutation of a human and a pug.

Earthbound's battle system is pretty terrible. The rest of the game runs on style, and if it doesn't tickle your fancy, then you won't enjoy the game.

MOTHER 3 is much better if you care more for solid gameplay and presentation.

Quote from: Kaijyuu on August 26, 2014, 06:02:28 pm
Earthbound's battle system is pretty terrible. The rest of the game runs on style, and if it doesn't tickle your fancy, then you won't enjoy the game.

MOTHER 3 is much better if you care more for solid gameplay and presentation.

Battle system is no different than 1,000,000 other RPGs that are equally awesome.

Quote from: Celdia on August 26, 2014, 03:34:20 pm
Looks like some kind of fucked up mutation of a human and a pug.

Was that supposed to be negative? Cuz that all sounds pretty awesome to me.

You haven't played those one million RPGs, then. There's little choice of actions to be made the entire game; largely you spam attack and occasionally heal. Offensive PSI is relegated to screen clearing weak enemies and unloading all your PP on bosses, and other abilities are either not worth your time or replace the attack command (looking at you, heavy bazooka). The rolling HP meter also makes you want to go through menus as fast as possible, which leads to fighting the UI.

The most "strategic" thing I ever did in Earthbound was putting the Heavy Bazooka in Jeff's first item slot so I could use it faster and end my turn as quickly as possible. Stopping to think and make decisions can hurt you and rarely gives any benefit, since the basic attack command (or bazooka) is likely the ideal choice anyway. A turn based game with few decisions to make is a tedious game.


There are a lot of RPGs with bad battle systems but Earthbound's is particularly bad. The game's merit is elsewhere.

I still dont see it any different than, attack, magic, item, escape. Which is what most of the RPGs of that time were.
sure they each have their own differences, like Paladins Quest were you can attack with any body part, but its all the same basic principle. Maybe its just because i dont mind excessive grinding or the same battles every 15 seconds that I dont see the argument here. Or maybe its because i enjoy the art style of the enemies. Even to
this day I still love it, even got a repro of earthbound uncut not long ago and played thru the entire thing loving every minute :P

Also, being half man, half dog not only makes you a mog, but it also makes you your own best friend, so thats
a win in my eyes ^-^

Quote from: Elric on August 27, 2014, 01:27:49 am
Also, being half man, half dog not only makes you a mog, but it also makes you your own best friend, so thats
a win in my eyes ^-^

When you're your own best friend you're your only friend in the world.

That would make John Candy cry :(

I will note that things like enemy appearance design and battle music are different than the "battle system" proper. Enemies and music look and sound great. I just wish you did more with them than just spam A (or was it B?).

Anywho, I won't go into detail but I'll point out Chrono Trigger for a good game to compare Earthbound to. Both have battle systems where you need to rush a little bit, problems with UI, and "attack" is your most used command. They're very different in enemy and ability design though: Chrono Trigger often makes you think about things like targeting, timing heals, waiting for combo attacks, etc. Earthhbound's decision making can be much more easily reduced to a simple algorithm.

Quote from: Kaijyuu on August 27, 2014, 02:16:13 pm
... Chrono Trigger ... "attack" is your most used command.

Good points but just that one bit made me twitch. I'm sure it's a personal gripe since everyone plays a little differently but god damn that must be boring if you use Attack more than anything else in CT. I stop using Attack as soon as I get Cyclone and try to avoid using it as much as possible because good god are the different techs just glorious to behold. So many different forms and functions and areas of effect not to mention just being beautifully animated a lot of the time... Sorry. Just had to say something about it, but your point does stand regardless.

Carry on.

Quote from: Kaijyuu on August 27, 2014, 02:16:13 pm
... Chrono Trigger... "attack" is your most used command.

I've played hundreds of times, attack was never my 1st option, thats why i always set the configs to remember where the cursor was, it helped me to use the techs, mainly cuz i was always changing teams and exploring all combo possibilities. I'd say that Attack being spammed would make the game boring and longer.

Quote from: Kaijyuu on August 27, 2014, 02:16:13 pm
... Chrono Trigger... "attack" is your most used command.

If attack is your most used attack in CT, you're doing it wrong. Very rarely should you be using anything other than double/triple techs. Even then you should only fall back on single techs if one of your party member isn't properly equipped for that battle.

Did ya'll spam ethers or something? I'd run out of MP so fast spamming techs every battle.

Unless you're just talking about bosses or something.

Quote from: Toshiko on August 26, 2014, 02:18:02 am
Okay, I need to set one thing straight. Grandia is pretty standard through the first disc. Nothing really special, just ordinary JRPG fare that's all a bit one dimensional. It's the SECOND disc where everything explodes and goes topsy-turvy and it becomes the masterpiece everybody says it is. Because it is a masterpiece. I'll forgive you for not finishing it, but I won't let you call it awful without finishing it. Seriously, anybody who's played through the game will tell you this.

I get it.  I do... And because I actually played, and beat a game as terrible as the other two on my list, I should probably go back, and play it seriously setting aside the unnerving gawd awful sound.  In the time I played it the sound was what made me quit...  I can deal with old graphics, and even bad graphics.   It's hard for me to get past bad sound.  Sound is what will make or break a game I'm playing.  I don't know why this happens to be my picky point, but it is...

Quote from: EmmaNigma on August 26, 2014, 02:35:11 am
Final Fantasy Tactics. It's a game so horribly broken, so unbalanced, and so poorly made that it requires an extensive modding community to make it good, often times rewriting its entire story and characters. This is good, because the plot makes no sense, and is poorly translated The characters are not engaging. Oh, cool, a character that could have a kinda cool plotline? As soon as you get them in the party, they're just generics with an exclusive job. Great character idea, idiots. Don't understand the love for this game. It's not even Final Fantasy.

Lolwut?  What is wrong with you kid?   It's 100% the only Final Fantasy that doesn't suck in one way, or another.  Even 7 has it's drawbacks (Materia lvled way too slow).   This game is -only- broken if you make it such.  The same can be said of all Final Fantasy.  I've seen that as one of the appeals of the franchise, that the more you train, the more you see a difficulty decrease.  It's a very rewarding system.  I see the difficulty in this game set to the will of the user.  It's up to you how intense you want your gameplay to be depending on how you train/abuse mechanics.   I mean, if you really want to be dumb, you can de-level, and relevel as Ninja's until your base speed is 50 and you take like six turns before any enemy.    Calling a game unbalanced due to your actions doesn't really fit.  If you just leveled via story, and the occasional random battle, the game is quite challenging... And I wish you good luck during the final Wiegraf battle...  Cuz the game can be punishing as hell if you neglect training...

Quote from: Kaijyuu on August 27, 2014, 06:47:53 pm
Did ya'll spam ethers or something? I'd run out of MP so fast spamming techs every battle.

Unless you're just talking about bosses or something.

Really depends on the enemies faced, but you get to amoment in the game that you have enough money to buy 99 Tonics, 99 Mid Tonics, 99 Shelters and 99 Ethers, depends how you exploit the game like in the 65,000,000 BC doing the hunting range lots of times, turning the loot into weapons and then selling the weapons is one example. But its not the earliest as i recall, i remember i used to defeat Gato with 1 hit, then i would keep redoing it then trading it for money is probably the earliest if im not mistaken. Mix that with knowing the mp values, knowing how strong each tech and knowing how to kill enemies with fewer techs and you re good to go.

Quote from: Xander on August 27, 2014, 07:00:25 pm
I get it.  I do... And because I actually played, and beat a game as terrible as the other two on my list, I should probably go back, and play it seriously setting aside the unnerving gawd awful sound.  In the time I played it the sound was what made me quit...  I can deal with old graphics, and even bad graphics.   It's hard for me to get past bad sound.  Sound is what will make or break a game I'm playing.  I don't know why this happens to be my picky point, but it is...

Yes, definitely give it another shot. Not sure what's wrong with the sound, though... Noriyuki Iwadare is praised for that soundtrack. The voice acting I can admit isn't awesome, but it isn't terrible, either. *shrug*

Quote<EmmaNigma post>
Lolwut?  What is wrong with you kid?

For the record, EmmaNigma is a veeeeery old friend of mine, and she posted this as a joke. Kinda sad that it took this long for someone to reply, and they thought it was a serious post. Oh well...

Quote from: Kaijyuu on August 27, 2014, 06:47:53 pm
Did ya'll spam ethers or something? I'd run out of MP so fast spamming techs every battle.

Unless you're just talking about bosses or something.

Well yeah. There's no reason not to. They're cheap and plentiful. Use ethers like tonics. The same for Lapis, Elixir and Megalixirs. I mean...they pretty much throw so many items at you that you never have to buy anything and it's not like dying with the fullest inventory wins you the game so you may as well use them. The only thing I ever bothered to buy other than equipment were Shelters because yesIwilltakeamegalixirfor150Gthankyouverymuch. Save points were pretty damned abundant so it helped to keep a healthy stock of those on hand. Between those and the treasure chests and enemy drops, there was truly no excuse not to have full MP all the time. Oh, and let's not forget about Silver and Gold Stud accessories on top of all that...

Quote from: Xander on August 27, 2014, 07:00:25 pm
The same can be said of all Final Fantasy.

Your save files are as empty as your soul! Gamerkind ill needs a member such as you!
"What is a gamer?" *throws down a can of Mountain Dew* "A miserable little pile of achievements! But enough talk... Have at you!"

Quote from: Xander on August 27, 2014, 07:00:25 pm
I get it.  I do... And because I actually played, and beat a game as terrible as the other two on my list, I should probably go back, and play it seriously setting aside the unnerving gawd awful sound.  In the time I played it the sound was what made me quit...  I can deal with old graphics, and even bad graphics.   It's hard for me to get past bad sound.  Sound is what will make or break a game I'm playing.  I don't know why this happens to be my picky point, but it is...


Lolwut?  What is wrong with you kid?   It's 100% the only Final Fantasy that doesn't suck in one way, or another.  Even 7 has it's drawbacks (Materia lvled way too slow).   This game is -only- broken if you make it such.  The same can be said of all Final Fantasy.  I've seen that as one of the appeals of the franchise, that the more you train, the more you see a difficulty decrease.  It's a very rewarding system.  I see the difficulty in this game set to the will of the user.  It's up to you how intense you want your gameplay to be depending on how you train/abuse mechanics.   I mean, if you really want to be dumb, you can de-level, and relevel as Ninja's until your base speed is 50 and you take like six turns before any enemy.    Calling a game unbalanced due to your actions doesn't really fit.  If you just leveled via story, and the occasional random battle, the game is quite challenging... And I wish you good luck during the final Wiegraf battle...  Cuz the game can be punishing as hell if you neglect training...

These are, heh, nice opinions, for a clown. Play a real RPG, like the Elder Scrolls or Mass Effect.

Quote from: Toshiko on August 27, 2014, 11:30:28 pm
For the record, EmmaNigma is a veeeeery old friend of mine, and she posted this as a joke. Kinda sad that it took this long for someone to reply, and they thought it was a serious post. Oh well...

I am literally shakeing

Quote from: EmmaNigma on August 28, 2014, 12:26:18 amPlay a real RPG, like the Elder Scrolls or Mass Effect.

oh man I love elder scrolls online

Hmm... I'm a bit late, but I'll do this.

Two Worlds 2- Terrible dialogues, and yet worse voice acting. The quests make your supposed-badass character just a messenger in pretty clothes. The exploration is a plus... sort of... but the terrible framerate makes travel a hassle. Not to mention the merchants yelling out the same thing all the time, that annoys me to oblivion! ...no, really, I played Oblivion when this one annoyed me enough to shut it off. The story sucks, and you have to avoid enemies for quite a while, as the equipment is shut for a pretty long period. The game is just terrible in almost every way, and pisses me off to no end.

I'm only adding one, because it's sufficiently bad on its own. Tristan out.

Quote from: EmmaNigma on August 28, 2014, 12:26:18 am
These are, heh, nice opinions, for a clown. Play a real RPG, like the Elder Scrolls or Mass Effect.

Orite.  Soz.  Don't talk shit 'bout FFT!  We love eachother!  We have something special! D:  How about you keep your misguided storylines, and crap ending.  *cries*

That's too bad about Two Worlds 2.  I actually considered buying it at one point...

Quote from: Celdia on August 26, 2014, 03:34:20 pm
Okay, I don't know what that thing's deal is, but it is ugly as sin. Looks like some kind of fucked up mutation of a human and a pug.

Quote from: Elric on August 26, 2014, 11:43:35 pm
Was that supposed to be negative? Cuz that all sounds pretty awesome to me.

Okay, this is late but seeing it made me remember this post, so...

I would smoke with that dude. Still not seeing an issue here :P

Also completely aware of there being no God.

Elric, you would smoke with anyone.

By his addictions, i'd say he'd smoke anyone. *takes a step back*

After today, I'm going to need to add one.

Ni no Kuni
Those of you who know me will know I hate two things about RPGs: MP and random battles. Ni no Kuni forces you to use magic*, but doesn't give you enough MP to use magic, which is a great combination if you're designing games for people to play while they're in hell. It also takes one of my favorite mechanics ever introduced into RPGs - visible enemies on the map - and turns it into the bane of my existence; nearly everything aggros from considerable distance, absolutely everything is faster than you are, almost nothing will give up chasing you, and after you kill them, they respawn once you've moved a couple meters away. I'm quickly beginning to not give one bit of a shit about the story just because the gameplay is the most infuriating I've encountered in recent years.

* Yes, I know you're given familiars, but they're only barely enough to keep you afloat. I'm still constantly wishing for blue dots to drop so I can cast an attack spell against the 4932nd purple muppet that runs up insisting I kill it. I need a mod that makes enemies never spawn, holy shit.

Quote from: Elric on August 30, 2014, 03:04:46 am
I would smoke with that dude. Still not seeing an issue here :P

Also completely aware of there being no God.

Smoke smoke?  Or tobacco?  Let's join for whisky in either case.

Really seeing a rise in atheism.  It's about time.

Can an agnostic join?