Final Fantasy Hacktics

Well its now time to start submitting your teams for the FFT Arena A.I. Tournament Season 4

As far as teams, for those who are submitting their teams for the tournament shall PM me your team and I will check to see if they are legal.

For those that don't know the rules are as follows:

RULES:
Teams will consist of 4 generic humans at Level 35, controlled by enemy AI routines.

Fury and Faith range is between 40 and 70. There is no minimum or maximum for Team Fury/Faith

Each unit has 3000 JP to spend on various abilities. It costs 250 JP to unlock ANY job.(includes Squire/Chemist) For example, to unlock Ninja, you only have to spend 250 JP(the 250 JP is lost forever). You do not need to unlock Squire/Knight/etc to unlock Ninja.

Only two units can buy any individual ability. Innates do not count towards this. (i.e. four units could have the Punch Art skillset, but only two could have purchased Earth Slash; conversely, you can have two Chemists and a Knight with Throw Item)

Only two units can equip any individual item.



The Deadline will be 6/10 at 11:59 PM EST. You can change your team anytime before registration is up. If you have any questions about the tournament please let me know. Thanks and good luck.

Also pending on how many people are going to enter the tournament I will need a volunteer or two to help me run the tournament and update the winner/loser bracket. If you do plan on helping I need you to be there throughout the whole tournament. I don't mind trading matches to cover for you if you have something going on, but please let me know in advance. I don't need tournament hosts bailing out on me during the thing like last time. Once again thank you all very much

As noted by silentkaster and Rouroni Elmdor, Gold Armor and Genji Shield are immune to dead but not death sentence. This can either potentially screw over the other team using death sentence or can prevent dead procs for being too much to overcome. So also please vote for either a ban or no ban on those items

Registered Players
Mudvayne
Anima Zero
TrueLight
silentkaster
Rouroni Elmdor
Shintroy
White Knight Wiegraf
skiploom188
fattyzilla
Barren
Reks
Epic
Heroebal
Dol
reinoe
Corosar
dw6561
Fanatic
StarRacer
Jumza
Lakitu673
Andante49
Malroth
CT5Holy
VireBlaze
Vigilanti
Zotis
RedWorld

There was talk about banning items that were immune to dead but not DS. Are those going to be banned or no? Specifically, Genji Shield and Gold Armor. Would these items be allowed?

I would be against that ban. You mess up a whole bunch of perfectly fine setups just to deal with a minor bug on a mediocre ability. I would suggest just not using DS, but I can't stop you. We gotta be careful when banning stuff, we might make some abilities OP just because its' counter will be removed. I say we work with what we got.

Remove immune:dead and suddenly Odin is the most OP spell ever.

Good point silentkaster and Rouroni, I should have addressed that. I'll make a poll during registration to see if we should allow genji shield and gold armor or not. Death Sentence/Dead is still allowed because they count as status effects.

I say keep em. If people are worried about Genji Shield/Gold Armor screwing their team over, give Shield Break and Armor Break a call.

If we want to ban anything, let it be Cursed Ring or Stop, otherwise, let's just have at it with what we've got.

Sorry, but what is the current bug with DS?

Regardless I don't think any items should be banned.

Also to Barren, I have 4 weeks left of this semester of school and afterwards I am more than willing to help with any recording/editing/uploading of videos for the tourney if need be or anything else that you may need help with.

I'm in favor of keeping them,  Gold armor prevents a lot of horrible things  and i dont think we should get rid of the only reliable petrify counter simply due to mediators being stupid.

Keep em. Everyone's aware of the risks of using DS by now and has ways to work around it.

No idea what kind of team I'm going to make for this tournament. It will defiinetly have a Mime in it though. Good luck to everyone in advance. This is going to be one stacked tournament.

Well cursed ring isn't as powerful as it once was due to the 50/50 chance of coming back. And as far as stop, it got buffed because people were not using stop as much as the previous patch. It had either too high of a mp cost or was just unreliable in general due to the hit rate. I'm just concerned with the people wanting to use the moves but dumb AI can sometimes be the reason people lose.

Also mudvayne to answer your question the reason why the ban is in question is that while gold armor and genji shield prevent dead it doesn't prevent death sentence. Death sentence gives the AI two turns until the dead status kicks in while being ignored by the other AI players. So next patch FFMaster needs to fix that over sight because there have been instances where death sentence doesn't work because the AI doesn't see that immune to dead also means immune to death sentence unless the item is tagged as such

How will Maps work? Will it be completely random like exhibition matches or like S3 where teams fight on a small, then large, then medium sized map? Are all maps legal? Can't stand the checkerboard, 1v1, and maps where units are spread out. (see Grog Hill, Nogias, ect).





Highly doubting Squires, Summoners, Geomancers, Lancers, Bards, and Dancers making it into top 8.
I'd like to see some popular past combos make top 8 like Mediator/Draw Out, Time/White, 2H Thief. Hope there are more absorb teams this time around with the changes to oil in 139. Some Andante/Truelight unfaith teams as well. Scary stuff. I'm too hyped let me stop posting.

Not counting my mime team, I think a team relying on status will take this tournament. *coughstopcough* *coughsleepcough*.

We can do Large Medium Small maps

I definitely want map sizes to be considered like last season. Would hate to see a team win/lose just because they got two lucky/unlucky map sizes.

Quote from: Shintroy on May 15, 2015, 03:44:52 pm
I definitely want map sizes to be considered like last season. Would hate to see a team win/lose just because they got two lucky/unlucky map sizes.

Agreed.

I'll close the poll now since no one seems to mind the two equips bypassing death sentence. I know everyone knows the deal here in Arena but I will say that if anyone does mention/complain about AI stupidity about not recognizing the difference between dead and death sentence, just remember you voted for this. Other than that I want everyone to have a good time regardless with what happens. Thanks again for your input

How are map sizes determined? Large and small maps are pretty obvious yes, but what about medium sized? Always wondered this. Maybe squared are taken into consideration? Also what about banned stages? I figure maps with insane obstacles like Bes-dio's house, Hospital in the Slums, and the chapel from the intro would be banned because it cripples the AI of certain units (ranged).

Well some of the maps may be banned due to either bad AI placement or bottlenecks. As far as what classifies as a medium map I will eventually look at the maps and evaluate them

I'd say 1 move to engage is a short map, 2-3 moves is a medium and 3+ would be a large map. Give or take 4 move, don't be using crazy eight crew to measure stuff :p

So I'd consider araguay woods and slums of dorter standard medium maps, mostly due to unit placement than square feet.

After all the maps I looked at this morning this is how I classify every map except for the check board land maps, we're leaving those out. The ones in bold are the ones that we may bann again due to bad AI placement or bottlenecks. If anyone wants to keep these maps you can go ahead and make your case.

Map List

Map 1 - Medium
Map 2 - Large
Map 3 - Large
Map 4 - Small
Map 5 - Medium
Map 6 - Large
Map 7 - Small
Map 8 - Small
Map 9 - Medium
Map 10 - Large
Map 11 - Small
Map 12 - Small
Map 13 - Small
Map 14 - Small
Map 15 - Large
Map 16 - Medium
Map 17 - Large
Map 18 - Small
Map 19 - Large
Map 20 - Small
Map 21 - Small
Map 22 - Medium
Map 23 - Small
Map 24 - Small
Map 25 - Medium
Map 26 - Large
Map 27 - Large
Map 28 - Large
Map 29 - Large
Map 30 - Medium
Map 31 - Small
Map 32 - Medium
Map 33 - Large/Banned
Map 34 - Medium
Map 35 - Large
Map 36 - Medium/Banned
Map 37 - Large
Map 38 - Large
Map 39 - Large
Map 40 - Large
Map 41 - Small
Map 42 - Large
Map 43 - Small
Map 44 - Large
Map 45 - Large
Map 46 - Large
Map 47 - Large
Map 48 - Medium
Map 49 - Small
Map 50 - Large
Map 51 - Medium
Map 52 - Small
Map 53 - Small
Map 54 - Large
Map 55 - Large
Map 56 - Large
Map 57 - Medium
Map 58 - Medium
Map 59 - Large
Map 60 - Large
Map 61 - Large
Map 62 - Small
Map 63 - Medium
Map 64 - Large
Map 65 - Small
Map 66 - Large
Map 67 - Large
Map 68 - Small
Map 69 - Medium
Map 70 - Small/Banned
Map 71 - Large
Map 72 - Large
Map 73 - Small
Map 74 - Large
Map 75 - Large
Map 76 - Large
Map 77 - Medium
Map 78 - Large
Map 79 - Large
Map 80 - Medium
Map 81 - Large
Map 82 - Large
Map 83 - Large/Banned
Map 84 - Large
Map 85 - Large
Map 86 - Small
Map 87 - Large
Map 88 - Large
Map 89 - Large
Map 90 - Large
Map 91 - Medium
Map 92 - Small
Map 93 - Small
Map 94 - Small
Map 95 - Large
Map 96 - Small
Map 97 - Medium
Map 98 - Large
Map 99 - Large
Map 100 - Large
Map 101 - Medium
Map 102 - Large
Map 103 - Small
Map 104 - Small
Map 105 - Medium
Map 106 - Large
Map 107 - Large/Banned
Map 108 - Large
Map 109 - Large
Map 110 - Large
Map 111 - Small
Map 112 - Large
Map 113 - Small
Map 114 - Large/Banned
Map 115 - Large
Map 116 - Medium
Map 125 - Large

That's fine with me. How are we doing map selection? Is it a preset map or is it RNG based and if it happens to land on a banned map, just re-roll for a new map?

I would re-roll for a new map. The order I'm thinking for every match is Large/Medium/Small. If anyone else prefers a order of size maps for rounds 1/2/3 let me know

I prefer Small/Large/Medium. We've been doing it the last couple of tournaments and it's been working pretty well.

I 2nd TL. I think Lg/Sm should be Rounds 1 and 2. Round 3 should be medium.

Medium last is definitely the most balanced way to go. Close range teams would be weeded out R1 if small was last.

41 - Besrodio's House (Needs to be banned. AI will attempt to attack through the mechanism)
52 - Chapel of St. Murond (Seperation)
62 - Chapel of Orbonne(Teleport units become untouchable for some teams here)
64 - Bethla Garrison Dam
66 - Bethla Garrison South Wall
67 - North Wall ( Not a neutral start )
78 - Zigolis Swamp (Poisoned Swamp. Problem according to some. Me included)

Just going by AI problems, neutral start problems, and past map discussion.

We have 8 entrees so far. We could use 8 more to add up to 16 at least. I may extend the deadline for that. Just a reminder that the registration for season 4 is still ongoing

If it means getting a few more participants I have no problems leaving the registration open for the tournament for a few more days. But if we do leave it open and aren't getting many more entries I have no problem doing the tourney with 10-12 teams instead of 16.

I assume that since they posted and voted in this thread, Otabo and Malroth will be putting teams together. I also believe that Reks will, at minimum, be entering the team that he submitted to me. Barren, are you participating? Your name isn't in the thread. So with that, we have at least 12 participants if I'm correct. At least Four more would be ideal, though.

Still contemplating on participating, to be honest with you. I haven't even begun the thought process of making a crappy halfway decent team yet. Depends how much time I will actually have, though. If you all don't hear anything from me by, say Friday - assume that I'm not entering.

If I can get someone to help me run the matches then yea I will participate. Mudvayne said that he can help. Are you willing to help out too silentkaster? If so then I can ask TrueLight if he can help out as well. Four people doing the videos should be enough.

I should be able to...my schedule is much more static now than it used to be.

Hang on, I thought AI Tournaments such as these should make it in the news of Hacktics. If the tournament at least made the headlines, maybe it could've gotten some attention?

Still, looking at the members visiting at this period, plenty of people are in their off-days. It's too bad :(

Is it too late to make it in the news section?

I can ask xifanie if it would be all right. I'll have to extended the deadline to an extra two weeks

Of course I'm in

Just forgot to say so

Well PM me your team and you're set

Update: I am going to extend the deadline to June 10 11:59 PM EST. We do need more people participating in the tourney

Hi guys, I'm going to get a team ready, and I'll let Fenire know this is going on.

Quote from: Barren on May 24, 2015, 03:12:56 pm
Well PM me your team and you're set

Update: I am going to extend the deadline to June 10 11:59 PM EST. We do need more people participating in the tourney

I'll either "convince" VB to, or help him with a team.

Another friend of mine likes the concept and from hearing me talk about it constantly, might join in.

Welcome back Zotis. Good call on the delay. Was wondering if there would even be a tournament with the low amount of entrants we had.

I'm in, I'll be submitting my team soon.

I'll join in too, especially if you guys need more entrants.

What happens if a unit gets knocked out of bounds? I figure since it's not intended it's an auto matic rematch since you take fall damage and the AI stops acting.

Happens with Hawk's Eye from what I've seen, unless you're referring to something else. But anything that stalls a round should force a rematch for that particular round unless the win was decisive the moment it happens.


In the event this occurs, what constitutes a decisive win? Permanent 2 vs 4? You have seen way more matches than I have, but I have yet to see a team win a 2 vs 4 in Arena.

I saw the message on Gamefaqs. No idea how the meta's changed, but count me in! My team will be good for a laugh.

So uhh.. is registration closed or you guys wanna wait a week? Personally I'd vote to get on with it, but I can think of more than a few regulars that could be part of this. I'd prefer as many people as possible, but how much more we gonna get?

Edit: Oh and welcome corosar, epic and haven't seen you around so hi fanatic. If I don't see some action soon I'll have to make a request, getting all anxious as the tournament draws near.

@Heroebal/Barren: oh $#*% I missed that. Well I heard something about it but nothing definitive. Thanks for the clarification, I'll make a request for intergalactic in the vids thread. And hi to you too Heroebal.

^^ they reset the deadline to June 10th 11:59 pm est

Right we reset the deadline so we can get more entrees. Preferably the amount being rounded up to a even number or multiple of 4 (i.e. 24 entrees)

How many entries are we at currently? Is the 14 names posted on the OP correct and up to date so far?
What do we do if we get an odd number of entries? Wait another few days hoping for more players? Or are we gonna have BYE rounds? Or eliminate the last submitted team(s) making it an even number/multiple of 4?

Also, good thing you updated the OP. When I checked yesterday (or maybe it was Saturday) it still said the deadline was 5/31, which is why I sent you my 'final revision' of my team, Barren. I knew it was mentioned somewhere that the deadline was being pushed back a week or so but I just couldn't find it on the OP the last time I checked.

I will likely still be doing more testing and edits on my team if I have another 10 days or so to mess with it  :twisted:

If we have a odd number of people entered we can set up the matches where someone does get a bye while everything else evens out. Once I use a tournament generator it will be set

Quote from: Reks on May 24, 2015, 10:10:44 pm
I'll either "convince" VB to, or help him with a team.

Another friend of mine likes the concept and from hearing me talk about it constantly, might join in.

Okay i just read through everything and I am the one that Reks Stated might join in!... i love to join up... just preping my team... i wanna actually try without getting my butt kicked in round one

We have now 16 entrees. And we have 8 days left. Lets try to get another 8 players to enter. I know we can do it!

I think i managed to get my fiance to be interested in putting in a team of her own... hopefully it will be accepted! I would love to see as many people as possible enter!~

19 entrees. 5 days left to register. We can squeeze in a few more

Quote from: Barren on June 05, 2015, 07:07:04 am
19 entrees. 5 days left to register. We can squeeze in a few more

VireBlaze and another friend of mine is gonna do it, after he studies a bit more on teams and whatnot.

He's rather very good at this kind of thing, even if he's not played FFT before.

I'm still going to enter, making my team this weekend. That's almost all the spots :)

Hello to you also Rouroni, sorry I didn't notice the edit on your post.

However this tournament turns out, I think I might have the title for most pm's to Barren for it.

I'm glad we are having such a great turn out. Good luck to everyone participating!

And don't worry I've sent quite a few pms to barren my self lol

I think Zotis, Fenirr and Malroth should still be entering right?

I've messaged a friend of mine, this could be one more potential entry.

I know when I talked to RedWorld she wanted to enter as well.

i'm entering just doing a last minute bit of team surgery

Just submitted a team. I have lofty expectations that I won't have the worst team in the tournament.

I don't think Fenire is going to enter.  He said he didn't have time to make a team.

I have my team done, I'm just going to test them out at home today before submitting it to see if I can spot any weaknesses to improve.  I was almost thrown for a loop by the change of Asura from MA to PA damage.  :P

Woah, hi Zotis!  Haven't seen a match with you in a while, but good to see you in any case. Too bad fenire can't get in on this, but at least we'll be at a cool 24 contestants, which ain't too shabby if I may say so myself.

Pretty excited, so I'll make my predictions now:

Very excited as well. Can't contain myself anymore!

Quote from: Rouroni Elmdor on June 09, 2015, 10:18:57 am

Pretty excited, so I'll make my predictions now:

spoiler: Rouroni's Predictions <--well let's see how close I am to these-->

Most used item:

1.chakra band
2.healing staff
3.black hood
<-- 1 for 3 here -->

most used class:

1.monk
2.thief
3.time mage
<-- 1 for 3 here -->

most used abilities:

1.haste
2.masamune
3.stop
<-- 0 for 3 -->
Other predictions:

- Thieves and archers will be the most valuable assets <-- 2 for 2-->
- at least 3 matches are going to end within 3 rounds  <-- probably in my favor and also not in my favor-->
- stop will be cast 100 times                                  <-- no stop ability for me -->
- shintroy makes finals with his mime team             <-- to be determined -->
- unshakable faith will not make an appearance        <-- to be determined-->
- there will be PRECISELY 13 mimes, mimes will take 4th spot on class/ability use <-- no mimes for me-->

*I think I've been running an archer in fft tourneys for about 2 years straight now, no specific reason or anything. Just the way it's played out.*

I look forward to the tournament also, good luck to everyone participating.

VB was still designing his team. I'll get him to finish and send it in today.

In fact, I have a promo video I made myself that I plan on uploading tomorrow when registration is up. Its a thanks to everyone who participated in Arena and helped spread the word.

Quote from: Reks on June 09, 2015, 11:43:56 am
VB was still designing his team. I'll get him to finish and send it in today.

I have been prodding VB along myself... i just hope i don't come off as annoying to him constantly reminding him of how much time is left DX

So surprised not to see CT5 and Otabo this year!! Maybe next time...

Quite a few people for this year's tourney.  Oughta be quite fun to watch my team which doesn't have a glaring error in it like my tourney team from last year, heh.

I'm quite looking forward to this myself. Maybe my team will actually get past the first round.

Quote from: silentkaster on June 09, 2015, 02:41:36 pm
So surprised not to see CT5 and Otabo this year!! Maybe next time...

CT5Holy Made it! XD

Ok, team is in! Did one test match against an old team that probably doesn't look like what other people are running XD

I think my team's pretty fragile and vulnerable to status, and it has a chance of completely backfiring! whee

silentkaster: what can I say, I'm really lazy~

Quote from: silentkaster on June 09, 2015, 02:41:36 pm
So surprised not to see CT5 and Otabo this year!! Maybe next time...

Meh. I'm stepping aside for a while. I've been just too busy to even keep up anymore. I might be quitting Arena cold turkey soonish anyway - haven't decided yet. But yeah. Good luck and all that. I'll watch some of the matches - especially with the newer players.

Like Ct5 Holy  My team is also VERY fagile, vunerable to status, has a possibility of backfire and is probably unlike anything ever fielded ever,  however a very strong possibility of a triple or quadruple KO by the 9th clock tick made me field the team anyway.

Speaking of fragile teams, did anyone go for a zero move absorb/aoe scholar team? Was looking forward to seeing on this tournament.

I'm going to take time testing and tweeking my team.  I don't have the latest version, but that's not really setting me back.  I'm trying out a lot of variations.

Deadline is in a few hours!! I can't wait to see what everyone came up with :)

Edit: This post is made for the future...like tomorrow at the same time :P

Quote from: silentkaster on June 09, 2015, 09:19:47 pm
Deadline is in a few hours!! I can't wait to see what everyone came up with :)

I believe it's tomorrow, not today, given that the deadline is the 10th right before midnight Eastern

It's still the 9th

Quote from: Barren on May 14, 2015, 05:55:07 amThe Deadline will be 6/10 at 11:59 PM EST.

By a few hours you mean 26 hours and 29 minutes right?   ;)

Just submitted my team. Glad I made it lol. Best of luck guys!!

well if anyone wants me to run a last minute test for them I'm willing to record something for the next 3-4 hours

I wish you would reconsider not joining Otabo.  It won't be the same without you.  You're like one of the old-school legendary players.  You have an incredible knowledge of the game.  It would definitely be a loss to the community if you leave.

I just sent my team in.  It's all magic and status.  I've been testing it out a lot on old teams from Barren, CT5Holy, Otabo, and others, and I'm pretty satisfied with the results.  It's fairly resilient, good at sandbagging and coming back from the brink, and also pretty lethal too.  I have no idea what kind of crazy new teams you guys have been making these days though, so it should be interesting.

I heard a rumor that Mimes are broken now...

We have 27 people entered. We really need one more person then we should be at a even 28

I called Dokurider days before. He said "he'll be able to cobble up a team in time". I wonder what happened?

Awesome turn out guys. Can't wait for the tourney with this many people. Will be a lot of fun.

Something ended up happening with my internship for school that was supposed to be happening this summer. There was an issue uploading my resume so I won't be doing it until the fall semester when I finish my last class for my bachelors degree anyways. This gives me the entire summer free instead of having my job and an internship to keep me busy. Only going to be working my normal job, ~35 hours a week. Nothing too intensive so I will have quite a bit of free time. Gives me much more time to be able to record videos for this huge turn out of a tournament haha.

Hopefully he can make it in time

No Domie V this year?

I can talk to him when I get out of work

Here it is folks. The FFT Arena Season 4 Promo Video I made for all of you guys. This is my thanks and good luck to all of you

[youtube]jrZ_QebAee0[youtube]

Looks like no one from top 3 of season three will be in this year's AI tournament. DomieV, Lief1991, and even Dokurider haven't signed up yet. Was looking forward to seeing their teams with a JP cap.

Good luck everyone. I'm hoping for a melee team to take this if I don't. Silentkaster's team looks the scariest out of the all the ones shown so far. How do you beat a 12 speed chemist with a gun?

oh i can't wait to see how this plays out... i know i may be a bit weaker due to my lack of experience but it could be a ton of fun to watch can't wait~!

I'm pretty excited, and so glad I made it just in time.

That was a cute little video, barren. I'm always down for a smash (I main link, since n64 before he became OP)

I'll just go ahead and drop the bomb:

I submitted "no foolin'" as is in the team submissions page. I think they have a bat's chance in hell, but I'm not expecting 1st to be quite honest. If I can win "most hilarious game of the season" I'll consider it a victory. They have had 2 matches and 2 wins, and I kept them under a rug since then for this purpose exactly. Wish me luck (I'll need it) and I hope you all have a blast (no pun intended)

Edit: Aaaand as I post this barren drops a bomb of his own. H..holy crap..