Final Fantasy Hacktics

all down here!

so far:

QuoteSquire-none
Knight-Level 3 Squire
Archer-Level 3 Squire
Monk-Level 3 Knight
Thief-Level 3 Archer
Geomancer-Level 4 Monk
Lancer-Level 4 Thief
Samurai-Level 4 Knight, Level 5 Monk, Level 2 Lancer
Ninja-Level 4 Archer, Level 5 Thief, Level 2 Geomancer

Chemist-none
Priest-Level 3 Chemist
Wizard-Level 3 Chemist
Oracle-Level 3 Priest
Time Mage-Level 3 Wizard
Blue Mage-Level 4 Oracle
Summoner-Level 4 Time Mage
Red Mage-Level 3 Priest, Level 3 Wizard, Level 2 Knight

Dancer*-Level 4 Lancer, Level 4 Geomancer
Bard*-Level 4 Summoner, Level 4 Blue Mage
Mime-Level 4 Geomancer, Level 4 Lancer, level 4 Blue Mage, level 4 Summoner

*Dancer is still female only, Bard still male only

Here are the stats and innate abilities I propose (similar to FFT Sigma):

......   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Squire.   10   100   13   075   100   100   50   100   50   080   4   3   10
Chemist   11   080   12   075   100   100   60   075   50   090   3   3   05
Knight.   08   160   15   070   100   100   35   120   60   070   3   3   10
Archer.   10   100   16   065   085   115   42   110   60   060   3   4   10
Monk...   09   150   13   080   100   110   40   120   55   080   3   4   20
Priest.   11   080   10   120   100   110   50   090   45   105   3   3   05
Wizard.   12   075   09   120   100   100   60   060   40   130   3   3   05
Time M.   12   075   10   120   100   100   65   050   42   115   1   1   05
Summon.   13   070   07   150   100   090   70   050   40   120   3   3   05
Thief..   10   090   16   050   075   125   45   100   60   060   4   4   25
Blue M.   10   100   11   110   100   100   50   090   42   110   3   3   15
Oracle.   12   075   10   110   100   100   60   050   45   110   3   3   05
Geoma..   10   110   11   095   100   100   45   110   50   105   4   3   10
Lancer.   10   120   16   050   090   110   40   110   50   050   3   4   15
Samurai   10   075   13   090   100   100   45   125   50   110   3   3   20
Ninja..   12   070   13   050   080   120   50   100   60   075   4   4   30
Red M..   10   105   11   105   100   100   48   090   48   100   3   3   10
Bard...   13   075   11   095   100   100   55   080   50   115   4   3   05
Dancer.   13   080   14   070   100   100   50   110   50   095   4   3   05
Mime...   06   200   20   050   100   120   35   120   40   115   4   4   05  
Other stuff
Squire - can equip everything
Chemist - equip: Robe
Knight - equip: Axe, Spear; cannot equip Robe
Archer - Concentrate
Priest - equip: Flail
Time Mage - Teleport
Thief - equip: Ninja Sword
Red Mage - Short Charge; equip: Sword, Rod, Staff, Shield, Robe, Armor, Helmet...
Oracle - Move in Water, Any Weather
Geomancer - Move on Lava, Half: Earth
Lancer - Ignore Height, cannot equip Shield, Robe
Samurai - Two Hands
Ninja - cannot equip Knife
Blue Mage - Monster Talk, Monster Skill; equip: Sword, Hat, Clothes, Robe...
Bard - immune: Silence, equip: Robe

I also propose innate magdef up for priest and innate secret hunt for thief along with all the above. Also I feel that monks should have the highest hpm/hpc in the game since they can only wear clothes.

Squires shouldn't be able to equip Guns or Knight Swords.

Quote from: "VincentCraven"Here are the stats and innate abilities I propose (similar to FFT Sigma):

Code Select Expand

......   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Squire.   10   100   13   075   100   100   50   100   50   080   4   3   10
Chemist   11   080   12   075   100   100   60   075   50   090   3   3   05
Knight.   08   160   15   070   100   100   35   120   60   070   3   3   10
Archer.   10   100   16   065   085   115   42   110   60   060   3   4   10
Monk...   09   150   13   080   100   110   40   120   55   080   3   4   20
Priest.   11   080   10   120   100   110   50   090   45   105   3   3   05
Wizard.   12   075   09   120   100   100   60   060   40   130   3   3   05
Time M.   12   075   10   120   100   100   65   050   42   115   1   1   05
Summon.   13   070   07   150   100   090   70   050   40   120   3   3   05
Thief..   10   090   16   050   075   125   45   100   60   060   4   4   25
Blue M.   10   100   11   110   100   100   50   090   42   110   3   3   15
Oracle.   12   075   10   110   100   100   60   050   45   110   3   3   05
Geoma..   10   110   11   095   100   100   45   110   50   105   4   3   10
Lancer.   10   120   16   050   090   110   40   110   50   050   3   4   15
Samurai   10   075   13   090   100   100   45   125   50   110   3   3   20
Ninja..   12   070   13   050   080   120   50   100   60   075   4   4   30
Red M..   10   105   11   105   100   100   48   090   48   100   3   3   10
Bard...   13   075   11   095   100   100   55   080   50   115   4   3   05
Dancer.   13   080   14   070   100   100   50   110   50   095   4   3   05
Mime...   06   200   20   050   100   120   35   120   40   115   4   4   05  
Other stuff
Squire - can equip everything
Chemist - equip: Robe
Knight - equip: Axe, Spear; cannot equip Robe
Archer - Concentrate
Priest - equip: Flail
Time Mage - Teleport
Thief - equip: Ninja Sword
Red Mage - Short Charge; equip: Sword, Rod, Staff, Shield, Robe, Armor, Helmet...
Oracle - Move in Water, Any Weather
Geomancer - Move on Lava, Half: Earth
Lancer - Ignore Height, cannot equip Shield, Robe
Samurai - Two Hands
Ninja - cannot equip Knife
Blue Mage - Monster Talk, Monster Skill; equip: Sword, Hat, Clothes, Robe...
Bard - immune: Silence, equip: Robe

cool with me, but yes, i think that squires shouldn't be able to equip gun, bows, knightly swords, and maybe shields.

Okay, but are you going to use a Squire over a Knight or an Archer anyway? I sure hope so, especially since its the only way males can wear ribbons or perfume. I can see a case for gun considering only... Chemist can use that now. Btw, does Chemist get [the support skill] Equip Gun?

Should anyone get MgDef Up or Def Up? Probably not. There was a problem with Secret Hunt, someone please refresh my memory. I think Monk may be okay with 2nd best HP (excluding the soft and squishy Mimes) unless we jack up HP bonuses for armor real high.

Squire equipping everything is great in every way. If you want Chemist to get more value out of the gun, swap the Chemist and Squire's move rating.

I think thieves, ninjas, bards, dancers, and mimes should be the only generic classes with 4 move. Everything else should have 3. Alternatively for squires how about taking armor and helmets off them. That way they aren't too tough with all their super magic guns, swords, ribbons, and smelly perfumes.

I don't have a problem with a Chemist moving 4. It's not a huge thing. But I'm really against any idea that reduces the Squire's niche. I.e, taking equipment from it.

QuoteOkay, but are you going to use a Squire over a Knight or an Archer anyway? I sure hope so, especially since its the only way males can wear ribbons or perfume. I can see a case for gun considering only... Chemist can use that now. Btw, does Chemist get [the support skill] Equip Gun?

absolutly. i would make the guns a chemist exclusive. and equip guns becames their support skill.

QuoteShould anyone get MgDef Up or Def Up? Probably not. There was a problem with Secret Hunt, someone please refresh my memory. I think Monk may be okay with 2nd best HP (excluding the soft and squishy Mimes) unless we jack up HP bonuses for armor real high.

i think that magic def and dep up are ok as supports. nobody should have them innate. i agree on hps.
   

QuoteSquire equipping everything is great in every way. If you want Chemist to get more value out of the gun, swap the Chemist and Squire's move rating.

adding movement to chemist would make the throw item skill less useful, so i would say no.
   

QuoteI think thieves, ninjas, bards, dancers, and mimes should be the only generic classes with 4 move. Everything else should have 3. Alternatively for squires how about taking armor and helmets off them. That way they aren't too tough with all their super magic guns, swords, ribbons, and smelly perfumes.

a squire with 3 movement might be an idea. after all the can equip almost everything, so if they'll have to use up the move +1 or +2 ability that won't hurt them.
      
   
       
      
   
   
Asmo X (Posts: 127)    Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster Fri Mar 21, 2008 2:14 am
I don't have a problem with a Chemist moving 4. It's not a huge thing. But I'm really against any idea that reduces the Squire's niche. I.e, taking equipment from it.

Why should Bards and Dancers have 4 Move while Geomancer gets 3? If Geomancer gets 3 Move, I'd say only Thief, Ninja and Mime get 4.

4 Move - Thief, Ninja, Mime
 
4 Jump - Archer, Thief, Lancer, Ninja, Mime

Is that how it should be?

4 mv on Chemist:

1. He's a medic. It's only fair

2. Problem with him only being "on par" with the other gun user? Not any more. His attacking ability with the gun is now one tile larger than the Squire (if he goes down to 3 mv). He is now the only character who needs no assistance from equipment or support abilities to have 4 move while being able to equip a gun.

3. Doesn't devalue throw item. His ability to do so has been expanded by one tile.

That's pretty much my case. Squire and Chemist can both equip guns without the Chemist having his territory invaded. And it goes to show the purpose of the new Squire: To be worse at using all of the equipment than the specialty classes but competing by being able to create novel combinations of equipment.

Why should Bards and Dancers have 4 Move while Geomancer gets 3?

They're meant to be able to run around so they have enough time to sing/dance. Besides, they don't exactly have much else going for them.

Please consider maps when you do this.  Remember that movement is cut in half in the water.  I was in the story fight with Olan in Sigma, I had no one that could get to the roof to help out.  My main concern is Chocobo chasing.  If humans have move 3 and if some chocobos have move 9, it can be a long battle.

Why not just give Bards and Dancers innate Fly? I also disagree with giving them 4 movement.

^Ooo. That could work, but Fly is really good so we'd have to cut back a bit on stat boosts.

Actually huthutchuck might have a point. The new mv situation is great for balance and giving you a reason to ride chocobos but what about fighting them? The best a 3 mv characters can do now is 5 (battle/germinas boots and mv+1). The problem is, if you try and change the battle boots to add, say mv+2, you've essentially put that skill back in the game. And now Ninjas become fucking crazy again.

I'm going to suggest here, that Ninjas don't have 4 move. Why would they be one of the high mv characters anyway? It doesn't suit their class.  But I think that Geomancers should have 4. Ninjas are already the category winners in speed and C.Ev, right?

Based on the theme of the job, the 4 mv characters should be Chemist, Thief and Geo.

Back to the point, now you can make battle boots mv+2 without ninja stupidity. You still get an overall boost in mobility. Adding mv bonuses to other equipment might also be an option

Making the later boots in the game +2 would be a good change imo. By then when you can have +3 pa or reraise, those germinas boots aren't going to be very useful anymore.

Quote from: "Asmo X"I'm going to suggest here, that Ninjas don't have 4 move. Why would they be one of the high mv characters anyway? It doesn't suit their class.  But I think that Geomancers should have 4. Ninjas are already the category winners in speed and C.Ev, right?

Well actually, I made Thief have a spot more speed than Ninja for that very reason (see wall of stats above), but you are right if you discount the fact that Ninja is one of the few classes whose skillset is based on movement range.

I'm not too big a fan of adding increased move boost to shoes; however, we may want to change the movement range a bit. Perhaps Chocobo should have a bit less range with better innate movement skills? Just remember: if a person can catch up to a Chocobo, riding one is no longer of use.

Besides, we always have guns and crossbows and such. I do see your concern, but I just don't think chasing down Chocobo will be too big of an issue. In fact, you might even need a Chocobo to catch one! And I wouldn't be too concerned about the usefulness of Germinas boots. As chuck points out, movement/range is very important for saving people.

Which reminds me, perhaps we should make Chocobo appear later so that you will be equipped (with Boco) to take them down?

Would there be a way to make so a person could immediately mount a chocobo when a battle starts? I'd probably do it more often if I didn't have to waste that turn every time I start a fight.

Story battles - yes (but see below)

Random battles - idk

The only catch is I don't know how to make an event that says "IF Chocobo is present THEN Ramza mount Chocobo" or anything of that nature. Now if we figure out how to do THAT, then we're in business.

Quote from: "VincentCraven"Which reminds me, perhaps we should make Chocobo appear later so that you will be equipped (with Boco) to take them down?

Chocobos are one of the things that made random battles harder, though. Swarms of them Choco Curing = longer battles.

Is there a way to slow down the birthrate of monsters, though? That would make some of the rarer "species's" poach drops more special.

Good point about trying to catch up to Chocobos. And I totally forgot about Ninjas Throw. Geez.

At any rate, I posted the accessory list in the weapons/items thread with updates to a few entries. There IS one item with mv+2, but see what you think anyway. I was trying to go for balance and 0 redundancy.

I don't see why you'd be worried about needing to have longer battles if that was the problem with the move gap. In chapter1, strong monsters w/o the ability to heal will still prove a problem, since you only have a limited amount of money and a small amount of MP during that time.

Slowing down monster birthrate is good, but it probably would just make players walk on the world map longer.

I've been thinking about trying to balance all the classes. If you think some class doesn't have enough love, let me know:

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Squire      10   100   13   075   100   100   50   100   50   080   3   3   05
Equip: ALL

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Knight      09   150   15   070   100   100   35   120   60   075   3   3   10
Equip: Sword, KnSword, Axe, Shield, Helmet, Armor, [Shoes, Gauntlet, Ring, Mantle]

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Archer      10   100   16   050   085   115   40   110   60   060   3   4   10
Equip: Crossbow, Longbow, Hat, Clothes, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Concentrate

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Monk        09   150   13   080   100   110   40   120   55   090   3   4   20
Equip: Clothes, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Martial Arts

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Thief       10   090   16   050   075   125   45   100   60   060   4   4   25
Equip: Knife, NjSword, Hat, Clothes, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Geomancer   10   110   11   095   100   100   45   110   50   105   4   3   10
Equip: Sword, Axe, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Move on Lava, Half Earth damage

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Lancer      10   120   16   050   090   110   40   110   60   060   3   4   15
Equip: Spear, Helmet, Armor, [Shoes, Gauntlet, Ring, Mantle]
Innate: Ignore Height

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Samurai     10   075   13   090   100   100   45   125   50   100   3   3   20
Equip: Katana, Helmet, Armor, Robe, [Shoes, Gauntlet, Ring, Mantle]
Innate: Two Hands

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Ninja       12   070   16   050   080   120   50   100   60   075   4   4   30
Equip: NjSword, Flail, Hat, Clothes, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Two Swords



........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Chemist     11   080   12   075   100   100   60   075   50   090   4   3   05
Equip: Knife, Gun, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Throw Item, Maintenance

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Priest      10   090   10   120   100   110   50   090   45   105   3   3   05
Equip: Staff, Flail, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Wizard      12   075   09   120   100   100   60   070   40   130   3   3   05
Equip: Rod, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Oracle      11   080   10   110   100   100   50   090   45   110   3   3   15
Equip: Staff, Book, Stick, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Move in Water, Any Weather

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Time Mage   12   075   10   120   100   100   65   050   42   115   1   1   05
Equip: Staff, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Teleport

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Blue Mage   10   100   11   095   100   100   50   090   42   110   3   3   10
Equip: Sword, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Monster Skill, Train

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Summoner    13   070   07   150   100   090   70   050   40   120   3   3   05
Equip: Rod, Staff, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Red Mage    10   105   11   105   100   100   48   095   48   100   3   3   10
Equip: Sword, Rod, Staff, Helmet, Armor, Robe, [Shoes, Gauntlet, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Short Charge



.......    HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Bard        13   075   11   095   100   100   55   075   50   115   4   4   05
Equip: Harp, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Immune: Silence

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Dancer      13   080   14   070   100   100   50   110   50   090   4   4   05
Equip: Cloth, Hat, Clothes, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Immune: Don't Move

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Mime        06   200   20   050   100   120   35   120   40   115   4   4   05
Equip: (nothing)
Innate: Concentrate, Martial Arts, Monster Skill
Immune: Berserk, Don't Act

Skillsets will be posted later and item stats may be changed, so not everything about the classes is here.

looks good, i'm still wondering on squire having just 3 move... also i think that time mage should have at least 2 move... you can't have them moving 4 squares at 25% chance... and 2 at 50%...

Well, according to the BMG it's -10% for each square out of range. That means 2 = 90%, 4 = 70% though I haven't tested it.

I think teleport works by every square out of your move range= -10%, so 4 spaces is still 70%. If I remember correctly that is.

Edit: You ninja'd me!

Also I noticed archer was missing innate concentrate. I hope you aren't taking it off them, it made the game a lot more challenging/better.
And I think chemists are okay w/o innate maintenence, knights should be entitled to beat their guns off them if they want to.

Really? Innate Concentrate?

Karsten, double-check the list and see if you have any problems with it. I haven't changed anything since the last time you saw it, but knowing that Teleport only removes 10% each square is 1 Move still a problem? And if Squire can use every item, is losing 1 Move a problem?

Oh, and should Archer have Concentrate or Chemist have Maintenance? No one else has said anything, so I think everything else is fine.

Quote from: "VincentCraven"Really? Innate Concentrate?

You didn't like it? I thought it did a lot of good for the archer class, seeing as I actually bothered to use one for some fights. Plus, now that squires get bows AND armor who in their right mind is going to use one unless it has some kind of perk?

Archers are faster and stronger...

Would it be enough for people to pick the speed and attack boost over the hp boost you could get from wearing armor though? If so then that's fine, but if not I think they should keep concentrate so they can have that advantage over the squire.

Quote from: "VincentCraven"Should anyone get MgDef Up or Def Up? Probably not. There was a problem with Secret Hunt, someone please refresh my memory. I think Monk may be okay with 2nd best HP (excluding the soft and squishy Mimes) unless we jack up HP bonuses for armor real high.

I believe the problem you are referring to is the fact that the poaching shops do not work unless you have secret hunt equipped, in other words the shop owner will not talk to you if you only have innate secret hunt.

Quote from: "NeedsMoreNoise"

Quote from: "VincentCraven"Which reminds me, perhaps we should make Chocobo appear later so that you will be equipped (with Boco) to take them down?

Chocobos are one of the things that made random battles harder, though. Swarms of them Choco Curing = longer battles.

Is there a way to slow down the birthrate of monsters, though? That would make some of the rarer "species's" poach drops more special.

I disagree, if anything births should be more common because i find nothing more annoying than wasting 30 min. moving between 2 blue dots because i want some stronger monsters.

Quote from: "Prinygod"I believe the problem you are referring to is the fact that the poaching shops do not work unless you have secret hunt equipped, in other words the shop owner will not talk to you if you only have innate secret hunt.

Did they change that for the PSP version, then? Luso has innate Poach, and I don't remember having to equip it to get the shops to work. It has been a while, though.

-Don

so:

QuoteSquire - can equip everything
Chemist - equip: Robe
Knight - equip: Axe, Spear; cannot equip Robe
Archer - Concentrate
Priest - equip: Flail
Time Mage - Teleport
Thief - equip: Ninja Sword
Red Mage - Short Charge; equip: Sword, Rod, Staff, Shield, Robe, Armor, Helmet...
Oracle - Move in Water, Any Weather
Geomancer - Move on Lava, Half: Earth
Lancer - Ignore Height, cannot equip Shield, Robe
Samurai - Two Hands
Ninja - cannot equip Knife
Blue Mage - Monster Talk, Monster Skill; equip: Sword, Hat, Clothes, Robe...
Bard - immune: Silence, equip: Robe

all is fine by me with the innates. i'm still questioning mysefla bout squires using guns too, but beside that everything's cool.

hm I really don't like the idea of guns or even knight swords on squires because those weapons are the perks of having "EQUIP GUNS" support abillity and changing your job to knight to use a "KNIGHTS" sword

I'm starting to wonder if maybe it would be a good idea to let squires only wear clothes. After all they are getting to wear perfumes right? A squire with a knight sword or gun, some armor, and chantage would tear the enemies up. Or maybe it would be better to only let them equip all close range weapons. That would make it fine for them to have armor, perfume and such, plus archers wouldn't have any competition so they wouldn't need something like innate concentrate to balance things out.

So karsten, you prefer the original list of innates as opposed to the newer list?

I just need to know so that we can finalize the attributes of each class. If there is something you are still debating we can change it later.

Actually, I'll just add Concentrate back, but I still strongly believe Squire should be able to equip EVERYTHING.
If anything, I'd lower their stats more.

If Red Mage is taking the place of Calculator, don't you think that's less of a 'reward-class' (that is, Math Skill is the result of grinding on several Mage classes, and emcompasses/improves on the skills already learned)? Being able to equip swords is nice, but it'll never be nearly as unique as the Calculator was. Blue Magic, when you think about it, is pretty much the same set of skills are Red. Both have fire/ice/lightning/healing skills, both equip swords, etc.

I'm not saying Red Mage wouldn't be a good class, but I'm just not sure how well it'd replace Calculator.

I think Red Mage would replace mediator and Blue Mage will replace Calculator.

Erhm, Blue Magic has a total of 2 fire/lightning spells and I am moving for a removal of HP healing from the skillset. Calculator was a 'reward class' in that it improved on nearly all magic so much that using such a character [I mean skillset: Calculator itself sucks] provided no challenge.

I don't want anything near the same as the Calculator class, although I am now aware that Blue Mage may need a weapon other than Sword. Sword is a bit too common and, despite what tradition may have upheld, fighting bare-handed or with a staff or something seems a bit more fitting to a monster-master type class.

Those poles or stick can be for BlueMage since they're the replacement of Calc. and also only 2 jobs can equip those.

Quote from: "VincentCraven"Erhm, Blue Magic has a total of 2 fire/lightning spells and I am moving for a removal of HP healing from the skillset. Calculator was a 'reward class' in that it improved on nearly all magic so much that using such a character [I mean skillset: Calculator itself sucks] provided no challenge.

Ahh, I was reading an older post. Removing Choco Cure would probably be a good idea, though.

What we left out was the S/R/M skills in each skillset. Did we ever discuss which skills needed to be removed?

Basic Skill - Counter Tackle, Monster Skill, Defend, Move-Get Exp, Move-Get JP

Item - Auto Potion, Throw Item, Maintenance, Equip Change, Move-Find Item, Equip Gun

Battle Skill - Weapon Guard, Equip Armor, Equip Shield, Equip Sword

Charge - Speed Save, Arrow Guard, Equip Crossbow, Concentrate

Punch Art - HP Restore, Counter, Hamedo, Martial Arts, Move-HP Up

White Magic - Regenerator, MgDef Up

Black Magic - Counter Magic, MgAtk Up

Time Magic - Critical Quick, Short Charge, Float

Summon Magic - MP Restore, Half of MP

Steal - Caution, Gilgame Heart, Catch, Secret Hunt, Move+1, Jump+1

Blue Magic - Train, MP Switch

Yin-Yang Magic - Absorb Used MP, Def Up, Any Weather, Move-MP Up

Elemental - Counter Flood, Atk Up, Any Ground, Move on Lava, Equip Axe

Jump - Dragon Spirit, Equip Spear, Jump +2

Draw Out - Meatbone Slash, Blade Grasp, Equip Katana, Two Hands, Move in Water

Throw - Sunken State, Abandon, Two Swords, Walk on Water

Red Magic - Distribute, Gained Exp Up

Sing - MA Save, Face Up

Dance - A Save, Brave Up

*Removed Gained JP Up, Teleport, Move+2, Ignore Height, Damage Split, Move+3, Jump+3, Fly
Finger Guard, Monster Talk are no longer of use.

**Bold skills mean it has been moved from its original set.

¿Qué más?

Blade Grasp, and you're adding in monster skill again? I liked the game better with the monsters already knowing their skills.

I'm not fond of Blade Grasp OR Abandon.

Also, the RSMs in general are starting to look a bit bare. With the text editor are we able to go into these lists and actually make a note that the skill is innate?

So for instance in the Time Mage's Movement list you could have "Teleport, JP cost (whatever. 0 probably) and then 'innate' instead of 'learned'". Or maybe just keep it as "learned". As long as the skill isn't transferable.

Quote from: "Asmo X"With the text editor are we able to go into these lists and actually make a note that the skill is innate?

So for instance in the Time Mage's Movement list you could have "Teleport, JP cost (whatever. 0 probably) and then 'innate' instead of 'learned'". Or maybe just keep it as "learned". As long as the skill isn't transferable.

I have a better idea, if you don't mind... just put it in the job description along with the requirements. *Shrug*

That's not very orderly. I think anything to do with skills should go inside the skill menus.

Oh, well then! I think it's safe to say we disagree. Which is completely fine. ^_^ It's not a bad way to do it, I just thought it'd be just as good in the description and easier, is all.

Quote from: "Lydyn"I have a better idea, if you don't mind... just put it in the job description along with the requirements. *Shrug*

"The Time Mage controls time and space.
This sorceror toys with the laws of the universe.

Prerequisite: Level 2 Wizard.
Innate: Teleport"

No thank you; that's extremely out of place. xd

Quote from: "Austin"Blade Grasp, and you're adding in monster skill again? I liked the game better with the monsters already knowing their skills.

[Edit: Will not be changing S/R/M for Alpha]

Should Monster Skill be removed? We can both jazz up Monster Skillset and keep Monster Skill, I think.

I can see a case for Blade Grasp and Abandon, though they aren't completely broken w/ the new Br limitation and the new shield/mantle.

I don't know how to do what you suggested, Asmo. I could add it in the skill description or job description, but not in the skill menu.
On the other hand, if someone else is willing and able to do that, by all means.

I suppose Abandon will be alright. Never mind me.

let's have monster skill adding an useful ability outside the normal monster skillset.

by the way, remember to give to lv and 3 bombs the blow fire ability, it'll make them less inclined to suicide and allow for a ranged attack

As humans are gigving them new skills via Monster skill, why not make them human skills?

Like bombs could have fire... whoever with a MA that high it would hurt a LOT. :/

However I don't know how messed up will look the animations.

Quote from: "Zodiac"As humans are gigving them new skills via Monster skill, why not make them human skills?

Like bombs could have fire... whoever with a MA that high it would hurt a LOT. :/

However I don't know how messed up will look the animations.

NOT a bad idea! to be looked into, really.

I gave Goblins Blind myself, which doesn't look glitched or messed up at all ... of course they have arms, but I'm just letting you know so maybe that knowledge helps. Also, Zozma was correct that monsters don't use any MP at all when casting spells.

If you want to use some jobs' skills for certain monsters, you could give every monster innate Non-Charge. That'd make things alot more challenging.

Remember to give uber-squire innate monster talk, otherwise monster will be unable to be invited, now that mediator has been kicked to the curb. Or, if its possible, you can make it so that monsters can be invited with out the need for monster talk, which would also allow them to be invited even when guts is set as a secondary.

all monsters should look fine while casting spells
all humanoids have all the animatinos, hell did u know they have singing animations too? bonesnatch or squiddy singing? wtf?

chocobos flap their wings untill the spell is cast, some of them shake like zodiac demons... but i think they all work. i gave goblin innate non-charge to encourage him to cast blind or confuse since eye gouge was instant as well.
i know they dont use mp but i think they cant cast if its more mp than they have max tho...

did they get such weird ma based formulas because they cant equip stuff or what?

Quote from: "Prinygod"Remember to give uber-squire innate monster talk, otherwise monster will be unable to be invited, now that mediator has been kicked to the curb. Or, if its possible, you can make it so that monsters can be invited with out the need for monster talk, which would also allow them to be invited even when guts is set as a secondary.

blue mage is supposed to have the ability to have critically injured monsters join....

Monster talk enables you to use talk skills on monsters, you're thinking of train. That's the one that invites them when they're critically injured, and the blue mage does already have it as an innate ability.

Quote from: "karsten"

Quote from: "Prinygod"Remember to give uber-squire innate monster talk, otherwise monster will be unable to be invited, now that mediator has been kicked to the curb. Or, if its possible, you can make it so that monsters can be invited with out the need for monster talk, which would also allow them to be invited even when guts is set as a secondary.

blue mage is supposed to have the ability to have critically injured monsters join....

Yeah it didnt think about train, but train is annoying if you are trying to invite pig (they die too easily). Still if you are giving uber-squire invite it would still make since to give him monster talk.

Monster Talk seems like a fine skill to put in Uber-Squire skillset. Maybe even innate depending on how easy it should be to recruit monsters.