Final Fantasy Tactics: Redesign Main Discussion [Newest: HUGE GEAR EDITS!]

[RavenOfRazgriz]

Samurai is basically Magic Knight and that one guy who you stay far away from because he does a fuckton of damage.  As in, Shimmer is stronger than most Swordskills will be, but that's Fire Element for you, huge charges for huge power.  Even Ifrit sortof embodies this as the second-strongest Esper.

Fixed Immobilize.

Iaido, when equipped, basically forces your weapon's current formula to be overriden with MA*WP on anything that calls Formula 01, both Attack and Skills, as well as giving the equipped unit access to the Iaido (Draw Out) Skillset.

[The Damned]

Okay, I suppose I see where you're going with both the Fire element thing and Iaido. I hadn't noticed the Ifrit thing and Iaido's wording was confusing, though I understand it now.

I'm guessing that the Draw Out skills are more or less the same as vanilla or 1.3 outside of the necessary balance issues? You don't have to answer since I'm sure you'll reveal what you've done to them in time.

[RavenOfRazgriz]

I'll be posting the exact breakdowns of Item / Geomancy / Jump / Throw / Iaido once I've posted all the generic classes.  It is the same basic ideas as Vanilla Draw Out, except with properly tweaked values, Will influence, probably mixed up Effect Areas and Magic Evadable.

But yeah, usually, skills of certain Elements usually have a consistent idea behind them.  Wind focuses mostly on Knocking things around and hitting MP, Lightning on being hard to evade or deflect, Fire is basically a nuke, etc.  There'e exceptions to every rule but it's not too inconsistent.

[The Damned]

I see. It would appear that we're doing different things with element consistency, but, hey, as long as they're consistent.

[RavenOfRazgriz]

Yep.

Newest updates: Thief Job, Blindness Status!  Don't miss it!

Also, Knight's Shatter Helmet was renamed Shatter Headgear, because, well, because.

[The Damned]

Hmmm...so your Thief has innate Two Swords as well and I was pondering both that Mug and "Pocket Sand" thing. Interesting.

I similarly find it interesting that your Thief is not only devoid of Steal Armor (though I can understand that one of course), but also Steal Weapon. Felt it was overpowering? Or just felt that it stepped on Knights' toes too much?

I've been considering using that particular Blindness hack amount as well, but I feel like 50% might ultimately be too much. How has it been working out for you?

[RavenOfRazgriz]

Pocket Sand! B)

Knight can't Weapon Break either.  Both have Take/Shatter Shield, Headgear, Accessory.  My scaling makes the other two OP.

I intend for Blindness itself to be a fairly crippling but easily healed status, so that hack pretty much does exactly what I want it to.  At worst, you can have Item without even giving up your secondary skillset... if you don't realize you maybe should bring some Remedies to a battle full of Thieves and Oracles, it's not my problem. 

[The Damned]

Dale is the only good part of King of the Hill.

With regards to the other things, fair enough.

*ponders this*

[RavenOfRazgriz]

That took more updating than I thought it would to post.  Argh.

Anyway, today's update is done.  Priest Job, Regen Status!  Don't miss it!

[The Damned]

Not sure how I feel about Priests having the ability to restore MP--at least, I'm guessing that what's Sooth does by the description--or Move-HP Up being available so early. Is Sooth self-targeting?

There isn't anything to say about Regen since it's exactly the same (and it's not like it really needed to be changed).

[MysticKnightFF5]

Aside from Regen sucking horribly, yes, it doesn't need changing at all. I'm using it as an "add on" to a bunch of skills, and even considering making it innate for all.

[The Damned]

Eh. Never said Regen wasn't underwhelming. Just saying that it didn't need change because what makes it underwhelming has nothing to do with it and more having to do with the ease of getting range and damage. Regen hardly helps in a game where you can't really retreat and every decent set-up probably at least 2HKO's a unit. With RavenofRazgriz at least reducing range, that somewhat eases part of the problem.

[RavenOfRazgriz]

On Priest and MP restoration: Note they lost Holy and multiple tiers of everything besides Cure. Every skill in the game besides those in Basic Skill (which I may change to be included as well) also has an MP cost now, and most non-magical units only have an MP multiplier of around 40-60, so means of restoring MP, boosting maxMP, and proper MP management are all quite a bit more important now.  Part of Move-HP being available early is that your damage vs maxHP schema is actually at its highest at the early game and very few defensive abilities are available without grinding, so that's when Move-HP is arguably the most worthless.  Move-MP far outclasses it at that point of the game, and unless I figure out a workaround you can't use both at the same time.

On Regen, it no longer expires.  It's main source is from a Vanilla Summon-Area Spell that always hits the caster in a game where your average Move is... 3.  At end game, your average damage against a non-buffed unit with a non-buffed unit that you haven't set up to be a giant glass cannon is... 200ish, give or take. Your lowest maxHP is 345 and your average HP can be from 350-400.  Armored units can be upward of 500-600+..  There are about 3 Reactions that mitigate damage, 3-4 Support Abilities, and the Protect status, as well as C-Ev, Weapon Guard innate all, and Shields being more common, and Move-HP UP.  Regen in this instance heals around 50-60+ damage a turn, and applying it often means you've applied it to 2-3 units at a time.  This means by itself it drops the damage you can expect to be on the wrong end of by a quarter, on top of all the other ways you can potentially build a tank.  Basically, 2HKO is your optimal setup, your average is going to be 3+, usually more.  Note that it also negates Poison, which can be very dangerous due to buffing your long-term damage against heavy armored units respectably and only having a few sources of removal (as well as persisting after Death).  If I get the modification to Poison I want made, it'll be even more dangerous.  As in, Pokemon's Toxic levels of dangerous over time.

tl;dr: Trust in me, I didn't buff Regen status because the numbers did it for me.  Buffing Regen directly more than I did would only make it broken.

...Anyway.

Dragoon Job, the main tank, along with Reraise Status!  Don't miss it!

Also, minor plotbased spoilers: Subquests will be available as soon as beating the shit out of Zalmo in Chapter 3, possibly sooner.  Many subquests (mostly the new ones, as well as the Cloud Subquest) will actually rely on you retrieving certain artifacts from Propositions as part of their unlock conditions, giving players reasons to actually do those outside of grinding.

[The Damned]

With regards to Priest, MP Restoration and Move-HP Up: I see. I was more asking with regards to confirmation on the Soothe thing then commenting that it would be overpowering if it could target itself. I understand now why you're doing the Move-HP Up now, even if it I'm still rather weary about it.

With regards to Regen status: I thought as much. Hmmm...maybe I won't have to buff Priest's Regen given we're doing similar things....

With regards to Dragoon: Hunh. It seems like basically had the same moveset before I killed it to give them Jump back outside of Luna, which I had considered but figured it might end up too overpowered. I guess you're doing planning to do something with Berserk, so....

With regards to Reraise: Any reason Reflect blocks it now? I mean, I'm actually all for that due to Reflect Mail Dragon Spirit Lancer's being kind of...powerful, but I doubt that's (the only reason) why you did it.

With regards to Propositions: That's an excellent idea and an excellent point to allow the Quests to open. I thought we couldn't control the rewards from propositions, though, like how we still can't control some shop stuff. Then again, it's been forever since I looked into that, much less actually done a proposition.

[RavenOfRazgriz]

If Move-HP UP somehow ends up overpowering it can be moved after some testing.  It'll likely be a staple Support Ability early game, but considering the Support Abilites are basically Item, Move-HP UP, Move-MP UP, and various Equip X functions with a few other random bits tossed in at that point, I don't have an outright problem with that.  I'll likely shuffle things around once all the classes are posted.  Right now I'm just keeping to the 2R2S setup to make sure each class gets a fair grab at R/S initially, then am going to fill in the ones who didn't get as many Reactions with extra Supports and move a few around to get the game scaling where I want it more.

Berserk will share a CT Timer with Sleep and Confusion.  This also means Sleep, Confusion, and Berserk all cancel each other.  Berserked units will also still be able to React.  Those are the extent of my plans for it for now though.

Reflect blocks all positive status.  I had forgotten to list it until making this update, but it also blocks Regen.  It will also block Protect, Shell, Float, Haste, etc.

I don't need to manipulate the proposition rewards really, just shuffle a few things around so that they open when I want them to and do a check that specific propositions were completed, since you always get the item on completion.

[The Damned]

Ah, I see. So you have Sleep canceling Berserk as well. Good to see that decision makes sense.

With regards to Reflect, hmmm...does this mean that MBarrier/Aegis is dead in your patch then? Otherwise, I can see why you would do it this way.

I suppose I should look into the proposition thing now that this I'm thinking about it. I honestly hadn't considered at all, especially since no patch really talked about it outside of, what, Complete? I forget. Can't you not re-do the failed propositions?

[RavenOfRazgriz]

Reflect is how it is because it's an easy magic-cheese that you likely won't be able to access outside of gear.  This means your gear that makes you pseudo-immune to (some) magic now costs you all your buffs.  Huge risk for huge reward, considering how much broader the definition of "magic" is here as well, though every set will have a few skills that bypass Reflect.

Not sure. If you can't re-do them, don't fail, since the propositions themselves won't be different from those in Vanilla.

Speaking of, today's update is done.  Priests got a range buff on a number of skills, Fortitude got renamed to Focus Defense, and introducing Wizard Job and Protect Status!  Don't miss it!

I know I'm going to be shuffling a number of Reaction and Support Commands around once I have everything posted and have the first tier or two of the Job Wheel sorted though, ugh.  This mostly means Oracle's likely to lose all its current R/S for more powerful ones because it has all ones I want available early on the Job Tree.

[The Damned]

I see, with regards to reflect.

And, yes, I don't think you can redo propositions at present, but I'll have to check.

I kind of weird to see that Water isn't considered an offensive element, though I can understand why. I'm guessing it's reserved for "washing off" things. Darkness seems kind of...powerful; I'm guessing that Lucavi are still immune to Dark in his patch like in 1.3.

[RavenOfRazgriz]

Water no longer exists as an Element.  I merged it with Ice because so few things use Water and it was a waste to try and define both when simple merging gave one usable and defined element.  "Water" is now what I use determine whether skills can affect Lucavi and other ??? units or not, meaning they don't need to Absorb: Dark by default anymore.

Also, see here for all further Job Discussion because I somehow broke the character limit despite my best efforts to save every character possible while maintaining highly detailed notes.  I'll continue all other forms of discussion (Status, Equipment, etc.) here unless this situation rises again.

Click the new thread to see the Dimensionalist Job and the OP here to see the Shell status!  Don't miss it!

[The Damned]

I see. Even though I'm sure how I feel about merging Ice and Water, at least that element space is getting some use still.

Not much else to say right now.