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  - [May 11, 2012, 11:04:25 PM]
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« Reply #454 on: May 11, 2012, 11:04:25 PM »
(Man, I'd be pretty livid that this didn't post before I left after all the time I spent on it. Good thing I properly backed-up. Not sure if that's the fault of the forum or Firefox or myself. Probably all three.) I am returned from my real life failures to address more virtual ones. From what little testing I remember doing, the AI didn't exactly use MP-only damaging weapons well. Of course, it's been a year or two if I even did test.... Still, I think "we" should avoid that, as much as I would actually like to see that tested. Unless Shintroy (or who ever else supports it) can come up with multiple compelling reasons as to why "we" need yet more things to screw mages over when a lot of magic is still kinda dubious, then I too don't really see a point. whats so bad about confuse?
To elaborate more on what RavenofRazgriz said, it tends to make the AI ignore the Confused unit unless the AI can do 50% or more in one hit, and even that's kinda...iffy sometimes. Given that Confusion also has infinite duration (and traps in ARENA are removed, not that every map had damaging traps to begin with), this would pretty much mean stalemates in quite a few instances, especially for more tanky or less damage-oriented teams. Collected Changes (updated with the problems Barren pointed out): Would you mind terribly telling us what exactly these "problems" were? I ask this especially since, as I've noticed, you removed your original post some time during my almost-week-long hiatus given the conspicuous gap Gaignun's posts of April 28th and May 5th. Regardless, I'll break down my thoughts on this list as I going to do when I initially saw it before/as I left; I stayed my hand given I had stuff to (finally) do (horribly). I'll be breaking it into "Stuff I More or Less Agree With", "Stuff I Could Hesitantly Agree With Even Without Changes", and "Stuff I Outright Reject At Present Unless It Changes". Such concise titles will be the heading of appropriate spoilers. I'll be separating equipment and job (and status) stuff as well. EQUIPMENT COMMENTS GO HEREThis part will be the most sparse in commentary, though perhaps that's not saying much coming from me:
1. Throwing Knife (Gain +33% Death Sentence) - Although, in my nigh-worthless opinion, this weapon isn't quite as bad some people seem to think it currently is, it and Assassin Dagger would definitely better and still fair combined. Right now, they're both just "there".
2. Dual Cutters (Gain +1 WP) - Agreed. At least, unlike Bow Gun, this can already be strengthened in various ways so maybe it will finally see some use.
3. Mage Masher (Change proc to 50% Bizen Boat) - Kinda rubs me the wrong way, but given that pretty much all the Knife-wielding classes have lower MA and the fact that it fits the weapon design on top of the fact that I do think we need a weapon that drains MP, I'm ultimately fine with. Probably.
4. Assassin Dagger => Katar (12 WP, no2S, no2H, +1 Move, 15% W-EV, +1 PA) - I approve of the name change. I'm still not sure it and Orichalcum can compete with Main Gauche, though.
5. Spell Edge (Change +1 MA to 50% Spell Absorb) - I guess....
6. All Knight Swords (+1 WP) - I suppose I can see why due to Forced. Not sure how necessary, though.
7. Healing Staff (+1 WP) - Agreed.
8. Blaze Gun (12-13 WP, Change proc to 100% Fire3) - Agreed I guess; I'm not sure what the typical damage out from the actual gun would become, but it definitely needs WP drop. I'd prefer the lower end on all three of these.
9. Glacier Gun (11-12 WP, Change proc to 100% Ice3) - See above.
10. Blast Gun (10-11 WP, Change proc to 100% Bolt3) - See above.
11. Cross Bow => Silencer (10 WP, +50% Silence, 4 Range, 0% W-EV) - A much needed improvement.
12. Poison Bow (+2 WP) - I suppose I can see why this is merited.
13. Silver Bow (Proc: 19% Holy) - Seems fine, even if 19% is odd...; it vaguely seems like a reference to something, but that may just be my imagination.
14. Ice Bow (Change all effects to Proc: 25% Stop) - I am guessing you mean the status and not the spell, correct?
15. Lightning Bow (Change all effects to Proc: 25% Don't Act) - Meh. Definitely an improvement.
16. Ultimus Bow (+1 PA) - Agreed.
17. Monster Dictionary (Change proc to Magic Ruin) - Sinkhole is pretty much never going to work as a proc, so this changing is necessary. Changing it to something non-HP-damaging is "safe".
18. Mythril Shield (Change to 15 / 15) - Seems fine.
19. Ice Shield (Change to 20 / 10) - Agreed.
20. Flame Shield (Change to 20 / 10) - Agreed.
21. Diamond Shield (Change to 15 / 15) - Agreed.
22. Platina Shield (Change to 15 / 15) - Agreed.
23. Gold Helmet (Change Null: Chicken to Null: Don't Move) - Agreed given Chicken can't even be inflicted anymore.
24. N-Kai Armlet (Change Null: Confuse to Undead) - Agreed since Confuse can't even be inflicted anymore.
25. Reflect Ring (Change Null: Silence to Berserk) - Agreed, even as unsure as I am about wanting Magic Ring "back" and the fact that it blocks what's arguably Defense Ring's most useful immunity.
26. Defense Armlet (+Absorb: Fire) - Agreed.
27. Defense Ring (+8/8) - Agreed. Not sure it will help though, at least .... |
This stuff will also be rather sparse on commentary, mostly asking for clarifications.
1. Longbow (+2 Range) - +2 Range seems a bit much, especially since the other Longbows already don't really see use in most instances. I understand you want to make it compete with Romanada Gun and I appreciate that sentiment, but given that it can extend its range already unlike Romanda Gun, I think that +1 Range alone is fine or, at least, is a decent starting point that errs on the side of caution. It getting +2 range might not be that bad though....
2. Windslash Bow (Proc: 19% Hurricane) - I am only hesitant here at present because I have no idea what Hurricane's formula is, especially in ARENA terms. The Master Guide needs to explain what some of procs do (read: show the formula) for those abilities that are only procs.[/b] *looks at all the "Bracelets"/Breaths and Climhazzard* Other that, 19% is again strange, so I'm guessing it's supposed to be "strong".
3. Gold Shield (Change to 25 / 5) - I'm really not sure why this has such a "funky" distribution compared to its partner Mythril Shield, especially when immunity to Earth is easier to come by compared to Lightning and when you went out of your way to make the other paired shields equal in P-EV and M-EV. Please explain.
4. Crystal Shield (Change to 20 / 20, halve/weak: all elements) - I'd argue that the P-EV and M-EV should be 15% like your changes to Diamond Shield and Platina Shield given stuff like P Bag and Light Robe are (still) around. Otherwise, I suppose it's fine.
5. Genji Shield (Change to 10 / 5) - Seems a bit low, especially since Cancel: Dead is kinda "meh". I suppose I can agree though because of +1 PA, but even with that and the 20% P-EV it has now it hardly sees much use. While that's more for other reasons besides some of the other shields being outright "better", maybe compromise with 10% M-EV or even 15% P-EV? I don't really care; it just strikes me as a bit odd.
6. Venetian Plate => Glitter Shield (+1 SPD, 5 / 5) - I can "dig" the concept. I just really don't like the name. Sorry. Please just call it "Buckler". I was going to suggest even just calling it Escutcheon, but that might confuse some newbs who ignore the "II" that 25/25 one has, so....
7. Genji Helmet (Chance Null: Don't Move to Initial: Berserk) - Pretty meh, but more because Berserk itself is currently meh as a positive status since despite being a "neutral" status, it is decidedly treated as negative one by the AI and it's definitely one when applied to the AI as Berserk status itself is now. Meaning that if you're going to try to use it, you don't get the benefit of using Esuna or Stigma Magic. Still, this does need something else besides Don't Move if Gold Helmet is getting that. Of course, if this gets Initial: Berserk, then Salty Rage becomes even worse.... Still, let's worry about that later. If you're going to give this Initial: Berserk, then I'd argue it needs a bit more HP; HP +5 seems "enough" since it doesn't step on Grand Helmet's toes, though I suppose you give this HP +10 and then boost Grand Helmet by HP +5.
8. Jade Armlet (Change Null: Chicken to Ice) - I agree that this needs to change since Chicken doesn't even exist anymore. However, I'm curious as to why you would want this to only Null Ice rather than Absorb it, especially when Ice is the weaker element (usage-wise at least) and you want yet another Fire-absorbing piece of equipment in Defense Armlet. Please explain.
9. Small Mantle (10 / 20, Null: Holy/Earth) - I guess this is fine. While I can understand upping the P-EV and M-EV values for all of the mantles since the 0% never made much sense to me, I think these have perhaps a bit too much, if only because Abandon and technically Caution/Defend/Defending status are still around alongside an increasingly common Blind between just Kagesougi and Grand Cross alone. This one is...fine I guess, even if I still think that the nullification of Holy and Earth should be something slightly different. However, there's only so much Item Attribute Space....
10. Wizard Mantle (15 / 25, Null: Don't Act) - See above.
11. Leather Mantle (20 / 30) - See above.
12. Vanish Mantle (20 / 10, Null: Wind/Water) - See above. |
I'll try to remain polite here. I say that not because I think your ideas are horrible or anything, sans Pain Knife. It's just kinda of a heads up since this week/month/year/life has been especially crappy and I'm not going to bed anytime soon, so I might come off (a lot) harsher than I mean to.
Also, I'm going to underline what I think the chief problem is or problems are since I'm already using the bold function to separate things.
1. Blind Knife => Pain Knife (9 WP, 2S, no2H, +1 Move, 15% W-EV, +5% Crystal) - I literally rolled my eyes at this when I saw it before I left because I couldn't fathom what made you think letting something add Crystal (or Treasure) of all things made it a good idea. I still can't, especially since you're letting it be used with Two Swords...in a patch where classes that can use a Ninja Sword innately--all the same classes that can also use Knives--currently have 100% accuracy with whatever "2S-Yes" other weapon they want due to Hidden Knife. A weapon such as this one, that will hit you and might make a unit deader than dead 5% of the time...yeah.
As such, I can't get behind it at all, especially since it kinda screws over the proposed changes to Assassin's Throwing Knife. If you feel it must exist in some capacity, then please make it add Dead at 5%-10% since, as much as I hate items like that, they're so much more fair than adding Crystal. If you insist on keeping as Two Swords compatible, then please drop its WP a bit as well Otherwise, get rid of & maybe up its WP. Maybe go the extra mile and just name it Tonberrian and allow it to be Two-Handed, as silly as that will look.
2. Koutetsu (Add: +1 PA) - I have less a problem with this, hence no underlining, and more a problem with (certain) Katana as they are in general. That said, while I can understand why +1 PA would go here with Heaven's Cloud needing something more, I still say that "we" just go with what someone suggested forever ago; this admittedly might have been me, I forget, in which case this unintentionally comes off as narcissism. That suggestion would be to make it so that Kotetsu Strengthens Fire while Asura Strengthens Dark, even if "we" have to drop Asura's WP a bit to do so, especially with the innate Two Hands ARENA Samurai have and with Darkn being a stronger element. Or would that be even worse? Regardless, I don't think +1 PA is "the answer", though it's hardly overpowered or anything.
3. Heaven's Cloud (Change +1 PA to Proc: 50% Slow) - Much like Kotetsu above, this is more a problem with (certain) Katana than with this proposal, though 50% Slow is bit powerful given the high damage and the literal halving of Speed on top of that. I can't really see this being more than a 33% chance. Otherwise, I suppose that would be fine, especially since Wind is still a rather crappy attacking element, Fuuton's currently unavoidable aspect aside.
4. Rainbow Staff (-1 WP, Remove: All Elements) - While I can understand removing the All Elements aspect that largely hurts its already slim chances of use, it doesn't seem necessary to drop its WP. It's not like mages are really going to use Two Swords or Two Hands with Staves, especially when Rods and Poles still exist, respectively. Please put the WP back and leave it alone.
5. Bow Gun (Change proc to 50% Armorbreak) - While Bow Gun definitely needs a change, this seems a bit...much. Wouldn't Armorbreak also do extra damage when they had no armor? While I can understand trying to fix Bow Gun by essentially making it into "Super Bow Gun" by allowing to break Armor and then still double hit, that seems a bit overzealous. I'll detail an idea I just had for this below, but needless to say I can't get behind this; a nice attempt though, especially since it tried to stay true to FFMaster's original intentions.
6. Elf Mantle (25 / 25) - As I mentioned under the less dubious mantles, it seems like the P-EV and M-EV are getting too high, even if I just now remembered that Abandon has been nerfed from double evasion to 1.5 evasion. This is the least problematic one of the three mantles that I don't agree with, though.
7. Feather Mantle (30 / 20) - See above, only with more P-EV problems that cause this to be the mantle I'm the most wary of.
8. Dracula Mantle (25 / 15, Null: Berserk) - See above, only going back to the still potentially problematic 25% P-EV while also adding in more potential overemphasis on blocking Berserk on accessories when Defense Ring is already still dubious with "only" 8% P-EV and 8% M-EV added to it. |
**** JOB (AND STATUS) COMMENTS GO HEREI'll honestly try to keep this section concise. Must admit that I'm surprised you suggested no Mediator changes, though, given what you said earlier.
1. Squire: Change: Bullrush (Change to Null: Haste) - Agreed, even if it might convince the AI to kill itself even more despite already being so careful.
2. Squire: Add: Alacrity (10 MP, +1 MA, Self, 200 JP) - Agreed, since it is so very needed, though I'd probably make it cost a bit more MP considering. Anyway, as much as I like "Alacrity" (and "Celerity") as a word, please just call this "Focus".
3. Paladin: Add: Reraise (Add: Reraise, 3 Range, 3 Vert, 16 MP, 200 JP) - Agreed.
4. Archer: Remove: Greased Bolt & Change: Hawkseye (+Proc: Poison/Oil) - Pretty much the same thing. Otherwise, I guess this is fine.
5. Archer: Change: Cover Fire (Change damage to (PA * 2 + 60) * RNG{1..3}) - Given what you said earlier, this rather needs to change.
6. Monk: Add: Warpath (+3 Fury at end of the turn if moved, 300 JP) - Should be interesting to see, especially since it has quite the potential to backfire.
7. Priest: Remove: Reraise - Rather necessary for Paladin to obtain it.
8. Priest: Add: Holy March (+3 Faith at end of the turn if moved, 300 JP) - I was going to say that this should go to another mage given what Priest is already one of the strong ones, but basically ever mage in ARENA has a movement already surprising sans Priest, Summoner and Scholar. Between the two, I must begrudgingly conclude that Priest would be less dangerous with it. Maybe.
9. Wizard: (+15 MAM) - Sure...even if I'm admittedly not sure what that actually ultimately adds. Plus +1 MA I'm assuming? I really need to get better at this stats stuff....
10. Wizard: Change: Fire 2 (+19% Oil) - I guess.
11. Wizard: Change: Ice 2 (+19% Slow) - See above.
12. Change: Bolt 2 (+19% Don't Move) - See above.
13. Time Mage: Change: Don't Move (AoE +1, Vert +2) - Yes please.
14. Summoner: Change: All spells CT > 4 take M-EV. - Seems more than reasonable. I may steal this for Embargo, especially since I was already letting some Summon Magick be avoidable. However, I digress....
15. Summoner: Change: Lich (Change Y = 65) - Uh, sure.
16. Thief: Change: Spellbreaker (+5 MP, MA * WP, 50% RemoveAll: Re-Raise, Haste, Regen, Protect, Shell) - Agreed. Wonder if it will end up being abusable though....
17. Geomancer: Change Carve Model to +Don't Move - By the Occuria, yes! Yes. A thousand times yes. I'm not even going to ask for all Elementals to actually be...elemental now as long as you're getting rid of that damn stupid Instant Kill option that also applies on reaction via Counter Flood.
18. Geomancer: Change Quicksand to +Zombie - Interesting. I can get behind interesting.
19. Geomancer: Change Sandstorm to +Berserk - Sand is pretty damn irritating, so agreed.
20. Samurai: Change: Koutetsu (+1 Range, -1 AoE, NoSelf) - Uh, sure. I hadn't even realized this was AoE 3 until now.
21. Samurai: Change: Masamune (+1 Range Linear, Self) - I suppose. I'd much rather it change to something else, but I honestly can't think of what still. But, yeah, it needs to not be able to hit more than two people max, even if that doesn't change much....
22. Ninja: Remove: Doku no Kyoukai & Change: Kagesougi (Change 100% blind to Random Add: Blind, Silence, Poison, Don't Move, Don't Act) - Agreed, especially now that I've remembered/been reminded that Separate literally quarters the application changes. That said, maybe it would be for the best to get rid of Don't Act and restrict it to close range.
23. Ninja: Change: -ton (Now subject to M-EV) - They definitely need to be subject to some type of evade.
24. Ninja: Change: Tsumazuku (+5 MP, SP * WP, -25 CT, No other effects) - This should be fine with only 4 units and range of 1. Perhaps only -20 CT is best, though.
25. Status: Oil: Dispel by all elements except holy/dark & Weak to all elements except holy/dark - Given these go hand-in-hand, I'll say yes to both now. It should be interesting testing. These won't be dispelled by elemental weapons, right? (I actually wouldn't mind if they were, just recall that they probably won't be.)
26. Status: Dead: Cancel: Oil - Essentially just fixes a glitch; something I realized forever ago. Rather necessary with the above too.
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...Okay, I'll honestly try to be more concise here.
1. Squire: Remove: Cheer Up - Okay. I suppose I could see why you might get rid of this, though it honestly doesn't seem to overly pressing compared to something like Yell. Shrug.
2. Paladin: Remove: Iron Will, Remove: Magic Ward & Change: Nurse (Add: Defend/Regen) - Since these are all basically the same thing. I guess I need more clarification about this new Nurse. Does it only add Defending and Regen? Or does it still heal somewhat as well? I doubt it still heals, at least 33%, but I wish to be sure.
3. Paladin: Add: Prepare (Add: Protect/Shell, 6 MP, Self, 200 JP) - I can get behind this. Or, rather, I could if Paladin didn't have clear means of healing itself through Grand Cross, which is what it's probably going to do in most instances if it doesn't just outright go for Nurse. As such, while the sentiment is nice, I'm not entirely sure the AI will use it unfortunately.
4. Paladin: Add: Wretched Blade (Weapon Element, PA * WP, 6 MP, +Poison, 1 AoE, Vert 1, NoSelf, 250 JP) - So...basically a lesser Grand Cross that Poisons and can't heal the user. 'Kay. The only reason it is here at "maybe" section is because I'm so apathetic about it and because it's so off-theme for a "Paladin", especially if "we" are going out of the way to not call them Knights.
5. Monk: Change: Secret Fist (Change Y to 65) - Not really sure why this is necessary either, but sure....
6. Wizard: Remove: Fire1 & Add: Fire 2 Back (Same as old Fire2 except replace (Fa + 35)% with (145 - Fury)%) - Sure, why not? Does "UnFury" mean that it's utterly independent of Faith, though? Or is that just the target's "UnFury"? being considered? Also, percentage? Is that percentage to hit then?
7. Wizard: Remove: Ice1 & Add: Ice 2 Back (Same as old Ice2 except replace (Fa + 35)% with (145 - Fury)%) - See above.
8. Wizard: Remove: Bolt1 & Add: Bolt 2 Back (Same as old Bolt2 except replace (Fa + 35)% with (145 - Fury)%) - See above.
9. Wizard: Change: Poison (AoE +1, Vert +1) - Not exactly what I had in mind for Poison, but it definitely improves it.
10. Summoner: Change: Odin (Dmg_F * MA * 9, Darkness elemental, 30% +Dead, 35 MP, 6 CT) - A standard 25% chance of Dead seems more fair since it's actually doing damage now and can thus kill through that too. Maybe raise its CT to 7 as well, but otherwise I concur.
11. Geomancer: (+20 MPM, +10 PAM, +10 MAM) - As I said with the Wizard gains, I'm not entirely sure how this stuff directly translates, so I'm rather hesitant, especially since it's Geomancer.
12. Geomancer: Change Gusty Wind to +Sleep - I kinda want to change this and Kamaitachi around, but otherwise fine.
13. Change Kamaitachi to +Don't Act - See above.
14. Change Demon Fire to +Oil - Demon Fire seems a bit "common" to add Oil, but considering Oil dissipates in one go, I guess it's not too bad. Might want to change Demon Fire to Dark elemental so it doesn't strength itself with the Oil its procing as currently does. Up to "you" though.
15. Geomancer: Change Blizzard to +Silence/Blind - This is mostly a clarification issue. Does this mean random Silence or Blind? Or All Silence and Blind? Or that you're just unsure? Regardless, I just now decided that All Silence & Blind would be "fair" considering how rare terrain for Blizzard is. Alternately, due to its rarity, this is pretty much the only one besides Lava Ball that I'd be comfortable with adding Stop.
16. Status: Dead: Cancel: Frog - I'm only wary of this because it kinda undermines Frog status and, more importantly, the one thing that Wizard do effectively besides "damage!" However, given that you're trying to implement Wizard otherwise changes and Frog really does need to change, especially if it's still on Water Ball, since it's a fate worse than death, I can get behind this ultimately. Might steal this for Embargo too.
17. Status: De-Cancel: Regen - First and foremost, since it took me a while to (maybe) realize this: By "de-cancel", you mean that Dead will no longer cancel Regen, correct? Regardless, under this interpretation, this is only a "maybe" partly because I'm wary of Light Robe and P Bag. It's even more a "maybe", though, because I'm currently going to have say "no" to your request to "de-cancel" Poison. I'll explain why that is in a bit. That said, I do think its a novel, potentially interesting idea. |
Again, my apologies if this comes out harsher than I intended.
Also again, I'll underline the troublesome spots if there's anything to underline in particular.
1. Squire: Add: Wild Blow (Weapon Elemental/Range, RN{XA / 2...XA * 3 / 2} * WP, unevadable, 5 MP, 100 JP) - I may be reading this incorrectly, especially given the time of morning and that I've been up basically 20+ hours combined with the day I've had, but you basically want to make a lesser version of the troublesome Kagesougi that currently plagues the game? Except that it actually takes the element of the weapon (read: magical gun) being used, correct? Yeah...I can't really get behind that, at least with such a cheap cost, being able to readily do more than normal power and being unavoidable & instant. Please change at least two of those aspects, especially if you're not going to advocate changing Kagesougi to close-range only.
2. Squire: Add: Concentrate (400 JP) - No. It's as simple as that, at least until you explain what you're doing with Concentrate to make it fair. Otherwise, you cannot fault me or anyone else for assuming we're talking about vanilla/1.3 Concentrate, in which case I invoke the power of Will Smith and say "Oh hell no" (followed by then then humming the Fresh Prince of Bel Air). A simple "Blind/Darkness blocks it now though!" isn't going to convince me to back its return either. That said, it being on Squire is more fair than it being on Archer, as I think you initially advocated, but it is only slightly more so.
3. Paladin: Remove: Dia & Priest: Add: Dia (See old Paladin) - Again, "oh hell no." Priest is not getting Dia, at least as it is straight from Paladin without any modification. Priest already has a bunch going for it without you giving it access to an instant, mini-Holy that's literally only a fifth of what the "real" Holy costs yet almost half as powerful.. Honestly, Dia just needs to die, especially since you'd have to change it so much to make it fair for Priest to have that you might as well be creating something almost from whole-cloth. Additionally, all that said, as much as Paladin is horrible at using it, I'm not entirely sure it (or White Staff) should lose Dia, my "Dia should die" aside. I'd certainly rather see Paladin keep Dia and be relatively mediocre about using it than seeing Priest run rampant abusing it.
4. Change: Transfusion (Remove MP Cost) - No. Transfusion is fine and needs that (meager) MP cost with the wide AoE it has. This would be the second easiest of my objections to convince me otherwise on if you are so inclined, though.
5. Archer: Change: Execute (Change damage to 40% of maxHP) - I can see what you're doing by making it hover between Demi and Demi 2, but those two (and Death...and Lich) already have difficulty enough seeing use as it is without having to deal with weapon-range (read: at least range 6) Demi 1.5 that's independent of Faith. Much like Dia (and Death), Execute probably just needs to die.
6. Geomancer: Change Hell Ivy to +Stop - Really not sure why you want to make the second most common Geomancy there is inflict something as detrimental as Stop. Really not sure. Geomancy is supposedly weaker than it was before, but it's not nearly weak enough to justify that, especially with Counter Flood still around. This goes back to being Slow.
7. Geomancer: Change Local Quake to +Petrify - Similarly, given that you had gotten rid of Petrify from Carve Model, I had hoped you had gotten rid of it entirely from Geomancy given what BS it is to have a Counter Flood be able to proc what's essentially instant death from what's an essentially very common set of terrain; outside of two really rare maps that are the only places you can use Lava Ball on, that shouldn't fly. Local Quake is a lesser evil, but let's get rid of Geomancy's evil once and for all and just tell Petrify to fuck off. Make this either proc Silence or, if you make Demon Fire proc Silence, proc Oil.
8. Geomancer: Change Pitfall to +Slow - With Hell Ivy going back to Slow, this can go back to being Blind. Still not sure why you changed it, but meh; not nearly as bad an idea as Hell Ivy inflicting Stop seems like it would be.
9. Bard & Dancer stuff: I can't really agree with any of these four changes. I can't see the computer using the Regen-adding Song or Poison adding Dance that well if at all, especially with such lower percentages. I can definitely still see them misusing Nameless Dance if it still has Slow in it and the enemy AI not curing the other status because it just feels that it's going to keep getting added, though I'm not sure there's a way to ever fix that unfortunately. And Nameless Song getting a much greater chance of adding Reraise and to multiple units regardless of range just sits quite wrong with me.
Just up the HP that Life Song and Wiznaibus can restore and damage respectively and make them unable to be Mimed; the other Dances would and should still be able to be Mimed (sans maybe Cheer Song and Slow Dance, but meh). Then make Nameless Song like how you want, except replace Reraise with Regen. Finally, for Nameless Dance, replace Poison with Slow, even if that doesn't entirely solve the problem there.
10. Status: De-Cancel: Poison - I sort of want to agree with this on a novelty level for the sake of "de-cancelling Regen" as well given the parity between them. However, as it stands now, I must refuse purely for one reason: Poison still has infinite duration whereas Regen does not. If Poison goes back to having finite (but lengthy) duration, then I would be more than willing to accept this for a "test run". |
With all that finally said, given how long I've been typing and the fact that I need to do other things besides proofread this, I'll quickly (read: very tediously) ramble off about 10 or so changes relating to equipment and jobs (& status), each, that I didn't see. These will kinda be in order since they're coming off the top of my head, but they're hardly bound to that, especially since it's not like I (ever) know what I'm talking about with regards to ARENA (and everything else). Outside of the obvious when it comes to suggestions of formerdeathcorps I've rejected, unless I explicitly say that I'm contradicting him, please assume that my suggested changes are being considered in tandem with his: EQUIPMENT COMMENTS GO HERE1. Hidden Knife needs to lose Always: Transparent, turn into Ninja version of Defender - I don't care whether it gets Initial: Transparent and a bunch other of crap to ensure that the Ninja can hit like immunity to Blind or Don't Act, but it needs to lose Always: Transparent. At present, Ninja (and far less often, Thief) gets away with being the only class to essentially have access to (innate) Concentrate. This in addition to having access to innate Two Hands and thus free reign both of whatever other weapon they want to smack someone with at 100% and of yet another Support to choose from. It may not be outright broken in and of itself, but I feel like it's been egregious for a while and that no one has mentioned simply because there's been so much other unavoidable BS that happens from a longer distance, much it also coming from Ninja's ARENA skill set. Anyway, beyond the dubious and obnoxious nature of Always: Transparent, with Hidden Knife also having +1 Speed it both ensures the Ninja gets more unmerited hits and that it completely obviates Sasuke Knife. Seriously, there is literally no reason to ever use Sasuke Knife at present. None. Nada. Zip. That too needs to change. So please just kill two annoying birds with one huge boulder and strip Hidden Knife of its current properties and let it share Defender's immunity to Don't Act, which people can hardly complain is a completely horrible trade-off, given that Item Attribute is miserly mistress. 2. Muramasa needs to not add Faith just because it hits - Faith is a rather powerful status to be adding to people, especially on a weapon that's already rather powerful with more than double-digit WP. Considering you're building around it if you're using it, the risk of it back-firing is fairly minimal, especially with all the damage backing it. As such, it seems like the Faith status should happen, at most, 50% of the time. 33% may be since 25% is perhaps too low, but definitely not 100%. (Gokuu Rod probably similarly needs to change, if only for parity considering I don't anyone has ever used it given how horrible it still is and counter-intuitive to all the classes that equip it initially. That's probably for the best, though, given how horribly unfair towards most magical classes Innocent still is, but I digress.) But, yeah, there currently needs to be reason to use Katana besides Muramasa, Bizen Boat (fine), Asura (my comment about formerdeathcorp's Kotetsu), Chirijiraden and, maybe, Masamune. Doing this will slightly help, though admittedly the "problem" otherwise lies with the other Katana and I'm not sure how to fix any of those. 3. Either (most) Guns need be Forced Two Hands or Archers need to lose Shields innately - Given my choice between the two, I lean towards the former given the latter kinda screws with crossbows as well, though given that I agree with most of formerdeathcorps's changes for Crossbows, that might not be such a bit deal since they go a long way towards making those more usable. Still, these options aren't mutually exclusive. 4. Platina Dagger needs to trigger Climhazzard slighty less - My view of this maybe somewhat skewed due to Hidden Knife, but honestly, it seems like Climhazzard would be more fair triggering only 33% of the time despite the weapon's power given that a) the proc is unavoidable, b) the other weapon used is usually more powerful since almost no one ever uses this without Two Swords and c) the Climhazzard's damage depends more on the user's teammates than the meager WP holding its normal damage back, Ninja's speed causing Ninja to charge ahead aside. Not really a huge change, though don't think it needs one. 5. Main Gauche can probably stand to lose 1 WP and 5% W-EV - Self-explanatory given that 40% W-EV seems pretty damn ridiculous and that there's really no reason to use any of the other Knives/Daggers that can't be used with Two Swords at present. Formerdeathcorps' (and others') proposed change to combine Assassin Dagger & Throwing Dagger takes care of those two and this would go a decent way towards making the other two or three none-Two-Swords Daggers more usable. 6. Diversify the "Head-bands" more please - Decrease Ribbon's HP to 60 and decrease Barrete's HP to 70 while letting it block Sleep given that a) Ribbon doesn't and b) Confusion & Chicken don't exist anymore. I really can't remember the last time I ever saw anyone use Barette or Cachusha even before they became Monk-exclusive. Perhaps let Cachusha keep its 80 HP, lose a bit of its 80 MP and gain immunity to Undead, Charm, Innocent & Faith (basically sharing Item Attribute with Crystal Armor) since it honestly needs to block something if the other two block so much; meanwhile Ribbon loses both its immunities to Undead and Charm to stop the aforementioned monopoly of serious status. 7. Bow Gun becomes Burning Bow or Debilitator, a Crossbow that adds Oil - I'm not sure if Oil should be added 50% of the time. However, it seems like it should be at least 33% of the time, especially given that its dispersed on what hit and that I'm not asking for Bow Gun's WP to be increased. Not sure what you're going to do with Short Edge, but no one's ever really used that (well), especially once Hidden Knife became busted. 8. Do...something with Salty Rage - Add Initial: Reraise or Block: Poison & Blind or a ridiculous around of P-EV or...something in addition to its Initial: Berserk. I honestly don't care. All I know is that at present there is still no reason to use this and there hardly was in the first place, at least without Concentrate. Alternately, you could just kill it and do something else with its spot, which would probably a lot more worthwhile. I'd probably another Absorbing accessory, but I need more time to think about this.... 9. If Reflect Ring is to Block Berserk, then Defense Ring should Block Silence instead of Berserk - Given formerdeathcorps suggested two more Berserk-blocking accessory and that Defense Ring still sucks, this seems for the best. It gives mages another Silence-blocking accessory that doesn't outright obviate Magic Ring yet it is still usable, especially since it gives them P-EV and M-EV as well, which they normally have to outright eschew to block Silence. Please do this. 10. Let 108 Gems Block Oil instead of Blood Suck - Given that I'm kinda rattling these off the top of my head, that Blood Suck doesn't exist anymore and that no accessory currently blocks Oil...yeah. It's the least you can do considering pretty much no one has used it ever since ARENA started. JOB COMMENTS GO HERE1. Please make at least Raise 2 Holy Element - That way Cursed Ring, Consecration and Seal Evil can actually be worth using. I would suggest doing the same with Raise as well and slightly lowering the success rate of both now that they can be boosted with things such as Healing Staff or the aforementioned 108 Gems (or Faith Rod or formerdeathcorps' proposed Holy March). As also mentioned earlier in this thread (for different reasons), yes, this kinda screws over the two pieces of Holy-blocking equipment, but those are honestly used so rarely as to not really matter. 2. Please make something else Water Element - It was a bit...jarring to come back after like three or so months and see that Water is still horribly underrepresented in terms of being able to use it as an attack as well to absorb it. While I'm yet trying to work out absorption of it, at the very least you could make strengthening of it worthwhile, especially when at least one of the Bios could easily become Water or Earth Dragon easily could become that "Big Wave" I was suggesting.... 3. Give Poison to Oracle & Beguile to Wizard - You can potentially take formerdeathcorps' advice alongside this and also expand Poison's AoE. However, I would prefer they be mutually exclusive/competing ideas considering the amount of other changes going on/being suggested. Of course, given the amount of changes going on, perhaps it's best if Poison stays with Wizard for now just to see the new AoE works. If it doesn't (or "you" don't want to consider that change at all), then please consider this one. I honestly feel like they would better served in each other's jobs. Well, at least Poison would and it would kinda stupid for Poison and Beguile to be in the same set, so.... 4. Make Bad Luck Persevering - This was suggested by formerdeathcorps a bit ago and I agreed with it, which is why I'm surprised he didn't bring it up in his list above, but whatever. Might want to up the CT to 5 if that's the case, though. Not sure. 5. Make Demi 2 less damaging in exchange for being more usable - Demi 2 should perhaps at most do 49% considering that I'm slightly merciful if people want to use Light Robes and P Bags and not suffer instant death (like Cursed Ring units against the much more frequent Raise 2 currently have to). Regardless, making it deal 50% or less in exchange for giving it CT of 4 or 5, MP of 32, and changing its X to at least 70% seems like it would get it much more use. 6. Combine Insult and Solution? - Something else that formerdeathcorps had brought up a bit ago and that I agreed with given the computer's lack of use of Innocent status as it is. However, that's perhaps not a bad thing given that there's only one item that blocks against Innocent at present and that's freaking armor, which is not something that Mages would be wearing in most instances. As such, I suggest a solution...to Solution. Change it into "Hush" and just have it add Silence. Give it Insult's current hit-rate while Insult gets Solution's current hit rate; I would readily accept Insult's X becoming 40 given Berserk's infinite duration and denial of Reactions and certain Movements, though in that case, I would ask that Blackmail (or Persuade) be made slightly more accurate in return. (Preach can stay as is for now, if only because formerdeathcorps said he wanted to test something and I have no idea what the hell he's getting at. Same goes for Heretic.) 7. Slightly weaken Auto Potion - Although people tend to still be conflicted over what to do with Hi-Potion and X-Potion, I think that I've seen pretty much everyone agree that Auto Potion heals a bit too much. Can we just go back to it healing vanilla Hi-Potion levels of damage and thus only restoring 70 HP? Did "we" already try that? I honestly can't remember, but we should perhaps try again. 8. Slightly up Cyclops and Slyph's status procs - ...Cyclops is Holy now? Hunh. I...forgot? Or did I even know? That certainly makes me hold back on suggestion which might have spoiled somomething.... ...Regardless, it and Silf can probably stand to have their procs go up to about 33%, especially if you decide to use formerdeathcorps suggestion about Odin. 9. Slightly lower Bizen Boat and Murasame's X - They seem like regularly they deal a bit too much MP damage or heal a bit too much HP, especially since they do so instantly and, in the case of Bizen Boat (or Undead confronted with Murasame), aren't subject to M-EV. While I don't think Bizen Boat should become subject to M-EV, it could probably stand to become MA*8 rather easily; similarly, Murasame can probably stand to become MA*9. This is pretty low on the list, though. 10. Esuna and Stigma Magic should no longer cure Charm - As someone who likes status, it's really frustrating seeing a unit that is otherwise rightly suspectible to Charm often instantly break its own Charm status "accidentally" by using either of the aforementioned abilities on itself. That they are both multi-target, basically 100% accurate and, in the case of Stigma Magic, instant, just poor salt over those wounds. If you have to lessen Charm's duration slightly because of this, then I would understand. However, there's more than enough ways to block Charm already available without screwing it over further by making it trivialized by two really common techniques. If you feel like there should be an ability that gets rid of Charm (besides Refute) without damage, then I guess you could make it so Squire's Heal gets rid of it (though then I'd argue it shouldn't be self-targeting, which ultimately weakens it) or, better yet, just make a new ability to do. (Give it to, what, Paladin?) Ugh. My hands. My use of hours. My relative lack of sleep. I'll try to make more formal suggestions when I'm slightly less useless than I am now.
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