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Steam Job Wheel Discussion  (Read 5236 times)
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Xifanie (Webmistress) [Posts: 4398]
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  • [February 17, 2016, 02:31:10 PM]
Steam Job Wheel Discussion
« on: February 17, 2016, 02:31:10 PM »

You might have heard that I'm making a job wheel hack, allowing to replace any generic job with a special job under given conditions, and even forbid them.
The hack currently allows making Bard/Dancer not gender restricted anymore if you wish, and auto-masters any job that replaces Mime (because there is not RAM allocation for the learnt abilities flags).

I'm also considering adding the option to have more auto-mastered jobs past Mime. Of course, they would have no requirement, which is a downside (it would be possible, but I'd rather not use a lot of precious SCUS space). I'm reluctant to add this because of all the trouble involved, and its usability into regular mods.

I also wish to add the ability for monsters to change job, but I want to hear people's opinions about this. My wife and I thought about it; it could be job level based, yes, but also plain regular level based... for example: Chocobo (lvl 1), Black Chocobo (lvl 25), Red Chocobo (lvl 60). It might not be possible to please everyone, but I want to find a good middle ground. So everyone's opinion would be welcome.

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  • <R999> My target market is not FFT mod players
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    French Maid
    Xifanie (Webmistress) [Posts: 4398]
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    • [February 17, 2016, 02:45:37 PM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #1 on: February 17, 2016, 02:45:37 PM »
    placeholder

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  • <R999> My target market is not FFT mod players
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    CONMAN [Posts: 307]
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    • [February 17, 2016, 05:40:12 PM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #2 on: February 17, 2016, 05:40:12 PM »
    This is freaking incredible Xifanie!

    I'm curious, If the special job replaced say bard/dancer, would they have automatically get get job levels gained as if they were bard/dancer or stay the same as if squire replacement?

    Quote
    I also wish to add the ability for monsters to change job, but I want to hear people's opinions about this. My wife and I thought about it; it could be job level based, yes, but also plain regular level based... for example: Chocobo (lvl 1), Black Chocobo (lvl 25), Red Chocobo (lvl 60). It might not be possible to please everyone, but I want to find a good middle ground. So everyone's opinion would be welcome.

    Jaw-dropping- I feel like this is something many have pined after for a while!  I think I would have to vote for job levels.  I very much love the idea of recruiting a scrub-low level monster early into a game and training/leveling them up!  ...I could ramble on but I'll stop here!
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    Jumza [Posts: 1518]
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    • [February 17, 2016, 05:59:55 PM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #3 on: February 17, 2016, 05:59:55 PM »
    I do like the level idea for monster job changing (as a toggle-able option of course, but I'll bet you'd do that anyway :P), that's very creative! I totally love everything about this hack :o

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    Xifanie (Webmistress) [Posts: 4398]
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    • [February 17, 2016, 07:14:57 PM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #4 on: February 17, 2016, 07:14:57 PM »
    I'm curious, If the special job replaced say bard/dancer, would they have automatically get get job levels gained as if they were bard/dancer or stay the same as if squire replacement?
    They already had their own slots and ability flags to start with... all I needed to do was remove the gender requirement for each. Plus, with my hack, you can technically just build 2 completely different job trees with male/female generics... 20 jobs for males, 20 completely different jobs for females, but unfortunately, using the same job requirements (which really isn't that big of a deal if you tackle the problem intelligently).

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    Emmy [Posts: 231]
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    • [February 17, 2016, 08:55:55 PM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #5 on: February 17, 2016, 08:55:55 PM »
    Would it be possible to job change monsters upon plot progression instead of levels?  Such as first tier ch 1, second tier ch 3, third tier ch 4?  Or a way to hook up the auto learn classes as secondary skillset options for monsters that use regular primary sets (like the demons/apandas)?

    In any case this looks great!  Thank you. :)
    Guru [Posts: 195]
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    • [February 17, 2016, 09:27:07 PM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #6 on: February 17, 2016, 09:27:07 PM »
     :shock: This looks like it's coming along nicely! changing monster jobs! That sounds awesome! I think I'd prefer job level based for the monster classes. Course if it's not much of a code change to switch them, you could just release two different versions to give people the choice.

    Quote
    I'm also considering adding the option to have more auto-mastered jobs past Mime. Of course, they would have no requirement, which is a downside (it would be possible, but I'd rather not use a lot of precious SCUS space). I'm reluctant to add this because of all the trouble involved, and its usability into regular mods.

    This I'd rather not see if it's going to cause issues in regular mods. I don't think I would use it much anyways, but I'm sure other people might like this though. If you decide to do this can you release a version without it as well?

    Awesome stuff xif!!!
    Event Kid, Mr. Peanut
    Jumza [Posts: 1518]
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    • [February 18, 2016, 12:30:27 AM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #7 on: February 18, 2016, 12:30:27 AM »
    Is there a plan to do something about the Bard / Dancer sprites for both genders if they can both be both? Like, will female Bards just look like male Bards? Dancers? Is that something you could fix? (Maybe some of those unused sprites before the generics could be removed for 2 more sprite spaces? But then there's Unit / Wldface space to worry about...)
    « Last Edit: February 18, 2016, 12:46:13 AM by Jumza »
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    Xifanie (Webmistress) [Posts: 4398]
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    • [February 18, 2016, 01:30:21 AM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #8 on: February 18, 2016, 01:30:21 AM »
    Oh, I'm sure I can fix it... I'll probably just allow people to choose the UNIT.BIN slots they want or something.

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  • <R999> My target market is not FFT mod players
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    Kaijyuu [Posts: 1336]
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    • [February 18, 2016, 01:48:33 AM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #9 on: February 18, 2016, 01:48:33 AM »
    I always wanted a chocobo chemist. They'd be so cute with a hat and saddlebags.

    More seriously, the three monster tiers being separate switchable jobs would be pretty neat actually.
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    Xifanie (Webmistress) [Posts: 4398]
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    • [February 18, 2016, 10:47:05 AM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #10 on: February 18, 2016, 10:47:05 AM »
    I admit I wasn't too thrilled with Emmy's suggestion at first, but now I can see a bigger picture:
    Story Progression requirements for ALL jobs, not just monsters!

    This would allow for these as well:
    • Samurai only accessible when katanas become available in shops
    • A special character automatically unlocking a secret job once a certain story point has been reached

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    • [February 18, 2016, 10:58:31 AM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #11 on: February 18, 2016, 10:58:31 AM »
    I'm gonna need a bigger cup D:

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    • [February 18, 2016, 11:47:02 AM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #12 on: February 18, 2016, 11:47:02 AM »
    Story progression unlock is sexy as hell, I gotta say. I'm gonna switch my vote to that, for sure. FFIII pioneered the job system, FFV made it awesome, and FFT refined it to brilliance. Story progression unlock is a wonderful throwback to FFV, and I am in love with that prospect.

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    Jumza [Posts: 1518]
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    • [February 18, 2016, 12:36:47 PM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #13 on: February 18, 2016, 12:36:47 PM »
    I agree with Story Progression all the way~ Go Xifi go!

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    Xifanie (Webmistress) [Posts: 4398]
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    • [February 18, 2016, 03:43:41 PM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #14 on: February 18, 2016, 03:43:41 PM »
    Bad news everyone. While the story progression requirement was a piece of cake to add, and managed to enable the job wheel for monsters...

    I don't have the foggiest clue why this is happening, but it does happen for all monster sprites (both 48x48 and 24x40). So, um. I don't know what to do.

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  • <R999> My target market is not FFT mod players
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    DeJ [Posts: 40]
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    • [February 18, 2016, 03:48:01 PM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #15 on: February 18, 2016, 03:48:01 PM »
    I agree with most posts here!

    Story based job-unlock would be epic and allow for a different FFT experience. Could also allow you to create hidden events/side-quests that allow certain characters to gain secret jobs.

    I am a fan of using monsters. For Vanilla play it's fun to plug them in here and there. I have also been playing Emmy's Monster Quest game to much delight. However, the main downfall to using monsters in general is the absence of JP/job-changing. Making this possible by either exp level/jp level based class changing for all monsters would be absolutely epic! Perhaps you can give them all a skill set in which you use JP to purchase skills like with human characters? And perhaps even allow a secondary skillset? Basically, make monsters fully customizable from a skill standpoint (like humans in vanilla are). Not sure if this is feasible but the idea is exciting.

    Great thread, keep it up!
    LastingDawn [Posts: 3452]
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    • [February 18, 2016, 04:00:45 PM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #16 on: February 18, 2016, 04:00:45 PM »
    This concept is beyond amazing! Like the others I would vote for job unlocks by Story Progression! It does seem like adding monsters to the mix is going to be quite a hurdle though.

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    Xifanie (Webmistress) [Posts: 4398]
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    • [February 18, 2016, 05:57:06 PM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #17 on: February 18, 2016, 05:57:06 PM »
    I'm not quite sure why everyone's voting for story progression...
    A) The feature was already implemented (seriously, it took like 10min)
    B) The feature affects everything by job ID, so it wouldn't be exclusive to monsters... and monsters would already be affected.

    Basically it's like you're voting to not have anything else BUT story progression for monsters... idunno.

    Took a while, but I managed to change the UNIT.BIN links for male dancer and female bard (you can change those to whatever you like in the spreadsheet if they don't suit your needs):

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    • [February 18, 2016, 08:20:37 PM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #18 on: February 18, 2016, 08:20:37 PM »
    I personally prefer level progression. The fact that is when the story progresses you get new monsters, I dunno. Leveling them up would be similar to a Pokemon like evolution system. However the hack is looking great. You are tapping into some of the things I wanted to do initially, I can't wait to actually have some fun with this, and the fact that Females and Males can have their own Jobs and what have you was something I was going to do in a different way >:3

    Thank you so much for all of this!
    « Last Edit: February 18, 2016, 08:34:16 PM by Valkirst »
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    • [February 18, 2016, 08:35:49 PM]
    Re: Steam Job Wheel Discussion
    « Reply #19 on: February 18, 2016, 08:35:49 PM »
    This is fantastic, Xif. Thanks for the hard work on it.
    I love pretty much everything about this thus far.

    Here are my bullet points:

    -Having the separate male/female bard and dancer is one of my dreams. Love it.

    -Having maybe one post Mime job slot with auto mastery would be useful to me.

    -Monster jobs sound like a lot of fun. I vote for level progression though. I feel it would give me more of a reason to use the monsters in general.

    -As for the monster job wheel issue, I imagine it's treating the monsters like a normal job and is perhaps treating it like all job requirements are met because there aren't any at all. Just my uneducated guess.

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