Final Fantasy Hacktics

Projects => Completed Patches => Celdia's Complete Patch => Topic started by: Celdia on June 24, 2011, 06:41:55 PM

Title: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on June 24, 2011, 06:41:55 PM
For those of you that just want to leave comments or talk about this patch, this is the place to do it as I will be locking the old main thread eventually.

Want to rave about something you love? Want to rant about something you hate? Do it here. I want any and all feedback I can get to help improve this patch to be as fun as I can make it.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: S_Hawkeye on June 25, 2011, 09:41:05 PM
I was looking at your master guide, and i notice that there are 3 stealabe guns but only one battle with balk (without the endgame ones)in the nomal game, that means we need to fight balk 2 more times in 1.93, or that those 2 guns are unobtanaible without playing the endgame part?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on June 25, 2011, 10:52:11 PM
Those two guns are obtainable in the end-game right now. I think they may also be on one or two of the Enchanters in the Beowulf sidequest but I haven't doublechecked those. For right now though they're only in the end-game which is technically a hold-over from an earlier version. I will make them available before end-game in a later release I'm sure.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Durbs on June 28, 2011, 03:08:51 PM
So have you changed any special characters in any major way? Mostly referring to their abilities/movesets?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on June 28, 2011, 07:33:02 PM
Yes, Durbs. Agrias has gained some Champion skills to her base skillset and a few swordskills have been removed while others are slightly modified. Mustadio has a trio of new skills inspired by a character from another game. Rafa and Malak have new skillsets that focus on White and Black magic respectively and each has a unique spell to compliment those skills. Orlandu's skillset is very much changed and focuses on his title as Thunder God more specifically. Reis' Holy Breath skill has been modified to no longer involve random hits. Meliadoul retains her original skillset but now possesses the ability to learn a handful of monster skills in addition to those. Worker 8, Beowulf and Cloud are currently unchanged but my get changes in future updates. I had intended to give Gafgarion some of the Bandit skills but honestly I just keep forgetting to make those changes when I update. >.>
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on June 29, 2011, 11:42:18 PM
So, I've gotten more than a little negative feedback over the Training Vest and its Innate: Gain EXP Up support. I'm officially taking suggestions for other things you might like to see on a low-tier clothing equip like that. Anyone can feel free to just toss out ideas.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Wasabi on July 02, 2011, 04:32:23 AM
The Innate: Gain EXP Up support on equipment sounds like a nifty idea, but I wouldn't want to make it available early game. It sounds like a decent late game, stat-underrated item to get when the player wants to buy a soldier from the Soldier Office and needs an item to get them up to snuff with the rest of the party.

Regarding Cloud, I have a few ideas in mind on what I'd like to see modified in his skillset, since I was sort of nit-picky about what to do with him in my custom patch. :P I tried to keep his 'Limit' skillset close to FF7, but also kept in mind the intriguing changes made in the PSP games "Dissidia: Final Fantasy" and "Dissidia 012: Duodecim." When you get around to him, we should talk over irc Celdia.

And about Worker 8: It is imperative that he knows how to Fly. His jetpack animation is just too good to pass up. :v
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Kagebunji on July 03, 2011, 10:40:13 AM
I was wondering if you gave some special enemies steal-only equipment. I unlocked Bandit, but I have no idea if he is worth keeping if there is nothing special to steal(other than Elmdor, I presume).
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on July 03, 2011, 12:13:40 PM
In the early game the only thing unique to steal is the sword Gaffy brings in his last fight. Later on however there are more than a few unique pieces of gear to be grabbed so having a Bandit trained is a good idea. Elmdor of course still has a full set of stealable uniques as well(I couldn't take that aspect out of the fight at Limberry).
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: sutebenukun on July 05, 2011, 02:58:40 PM
For the Homemaker's Boil, it states that it has continuous damage, does that mean it will randomly hit more than once or that it delivers damage over time? Either way for some reason boil hasn't done so and I've cast it around ten fifteen times by now...
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Eternal on July 05, 2011, 03:00:02 PM
IIRC, Boil acts like the Dances/Songs, in that it'll go off every few turns.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: sutebenukun on July 05, 2011, 03:01:30 PM
That doesn't show up in the AT list does it? (at least I didn't see it there since that was what I had originally thought would happen)
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Eternal on July 05, 2011, 03:02:18 PM
It should, but Celdie may have removed the Persevere and simply forgotten to change the description.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: sutebenukun on July 05, 2011, 03:14:34 PM
I just looked into it (which I admit I should have done in the first place -_-;) and you are right, the Persevere box has been unchecked so it will not do continuous damage.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Kagebunji on July 05, 2011, 08:10:50 PM
Small tip for those starting Lionel battle. Hide your battle team in a corner, when you are deploying them, cause you will likely get half-dead in first turn. I had to restart twice, after third time, I hidden my team in a corner and then killed them off when I got a turn. Also make sure to steal Gaffy's sword, heh. And small note, Queklain is very annoying with his Nightmare stuff, but I managed to beat him once he started charging Bio 3.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on July 06, 2011, 02:01:29 AM
Boil not having Persevere is likely from when I was testing fixes for the targeting display error and I forgot to re-check it. I suppose the sad part about that is I was testing fixes of that before 1.9 and only now is it getting noticed. No one likes Boil. ;_;
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: sutebenukun on July 06, 2011, 03:19:21 AM
Well since you used Aerith's sprite for Homemaker I kind of wanted to keep one in my party, lol. If that is the case I will go back and re-check it. Now I won't feel bad for doing so. ^-^
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: ggx2rking on July 06, 2011, 04:28:09 PM
I don't know if this was a error or if done intentionally but you have the red cape as a shield.
Makes me think of a matador.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Kagebunji on July 06, 2011, 04:31:51 PM
It is intentional.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: ggx2rking on July 06, 2011, 04:40:17 PM
Ah thats cool I just thought that with both the red cape and another cape accessory the evasion rate of the equipped unit would be ridiculously high.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: ggx2rking on July 06, 2011, 06:42:36 PM
Has anyone played the updated patch? I was wondering if anyone is having trouble with the tactician class?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on July 06, 2011, 08:08:43 PM
TigerKnee also reported an issue with the Tactician class. I have to assume there is some conflict in ASM hacks that I need to work out. I haven't had a chance to go over it all yet but my initial appraisal of it shows that it should be working correctly. Sadly in the world of game hacking that means nothing. -_-
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: ggx2rking on July 06, 2011, 09:03:48 PM
Would you like me to test the classes to the best of my abilities?  To see if their are any other problems (but I think its just that class).  I love the tactician class. It was after I applied the new patch that I started having trouble with tactician. I used a clean iso.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on July 09, 2011, 04:36:27 AM
Hey gang, quick question to those that have played: Should the Nomad's Updraft ability lose its CT so there isn't the bug of setting the skill to charge, moving, and then losing the action? In an attempt to balance this, the MP cost may go up and the hit% would likely drop. Thoughts?

Edit: @gg2rking - I'm working out the issues with Tactician currently as best I can. Looks like ALMA and the ARH don't play well together. Hopefully I'll have an answer for it soon.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: RavenOfRazgriz on July 09, 2011, 05:40:05 AM
Hey gang, quick question to those that have played: Should the Nomad's Updraft ability lose its CT so there isn't the bug of setting the skill to charge, moving, and then losing the action? In an attempt to balance this, the MP cost may go up and the hit% would likely drop. Thoughts?

Quote
[01:39] ravenofrazgriz: To your QQ on Nomad, I'd say yes solely because leaving it in the current state leaves a bug in the game, and that makes the game look sloppy.
[01:39] Celdia: *nods*
[01:39] Celdia: Post as such then.

So let it be written, so let it be done.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: ggx2rking on July 09, 2011, 07:47:07 PM
Ah I didn't mean to seem like I was complaining. I just wanted to see if you needed a tester for the classes. I have no issues concerning the new patch anyway. Anything done on this site is better than what I could imagine anyway lol.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: TigerKnee on July 12, 2011, 04:49:17 AM
I might be going into the colliery with the the unique characters maybe, although I'll have to savefile edit JP for them since I don't want to grind them up.

Anyway, my Mustadio analysis from a bit of testing and theory.

Mustadio: Well, first off, the new skill formulas means if you want to use Holy/Dark/Flame Kick you can't quite use the Alchemist as main class effectively, since it has gimpy stats. You can't use it on Gunslinger since it also has gimpy stats but then again, if you do try Gunslinging/Engineers you'll have a bit of redundant moves. Let's see... Enchanters... well, they have gimpy stats too.

This is a bit of a problem. Mustadio REALLY wants Two Guns in his Support ability slots. If you put Item secondary with Engineer main there's no space to slap on Throw Item unless you want to gimp your HP with Heavy Coat and not be able to use Rogue Camoflauge.

With the old formula, you could just go Alchemist to get Innate Throw Item and then slap on Two Guns on the class but yeah, can't do that anymore.

As a level 42 Engineer, Mustadio has 9 PA and 7 MA (assume equipment is twinking for speed). Holy/Dark seems to be using the Elemental formula which uses both PA and MA and deals like 70 damage.

The best storebought gun is 7 WP, meaning 49 damage. Balk battle gives you Inferno for 9 WP and a generic Gunslinger has a Stone Flintlock for 8 WP respectively, meaning 81 and 64 damage respectively.

So while it does deal more damage than Rifles, once you get Inferno/S Flintlock, unless you have someone throwing Ambrosias at Mustadio, using Holy and Dark Shot will... more of less give you the same damage, since Holy weakness is hard to take advantage of and is there any monsters even weak to Dark? You'll really only use Dark Shot if you're fighting the rare enemy immune or resistant to Holy (which means... Ultima Demons I guess) and it's not much of a difference from just shooting them.

Of course this is from my Chapter 4 save game. I have no idea how it is for Chapter 2 when Mustadio first joins you. Thinking about it, the Speed twinks equipment come pretty late (and Balk is the only guy who has the best Speed hat in the game... twice), and Mustadio can't Equip Armor in Engineer, which means your "best" option for early game is to twink for Magic with Bishop Miter and Dried Herbs. Necklace of J would probably be nice but I never did get it (is it even possible?)

As mentioned above, Engineering doesn't quite work as a secondary because a lot of classes either has gimpy stats or can't use guns so no Two Guns. The fact that Two Guns basically doubles the damage just about every skill that isn't called Flame Kick means you pretty much want it in your support slot.

On the rare class with both decent/good PA/MA multipliers who can't use Guns such as Vanquisher, well... I don't think they'll outdamage two guns. Eh.

So what secondary to give Musty as Engineer? If you use Item you're going to have to accept having only a 1 panel throw range. Blitz probably isn't worth carrying with 110 PA multiplier without Attack Up. If you're going speed twinking I guess he could be your Bandit but without propositions it pretty annoying to train said class. Engrave could be fine if you go twink for MA... maybe.

My verdict is that Holy/Dark/Flame Kick is... still rather niche and asks a lot of hard questions to answer and I still don't know what the optimal setup is.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: TigerKnee on July 13, 2011, 05:29:03 AM
Out of curiousity, does Cloud have the limitations on his Limit skillset removed, or is it completely untouched meaning he has to equip whatever replaced the Materia Blade in the original game code (Well, Executioner Axe is the item you find in the volcano but...)
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on July 13, 2011, 05:33:04 AM
I think I have him set to be like the other Swordskill classes so any sword should do.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Dome on July 20, 2011, 11:38:43 AM
So, is this the final version of the patch?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: MysticKnightFF5 on July 20, 2011, 03:26:16 PM
Nope! It'll keep going for eternity. CCP is awesome like that; you'll always have something new to play the next day you get on the boards. :P
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on July 20, 2011, 04:53:21 PM
I'm told there's enough of it here to call it a completed patch. Mostly at this point I'm just fixing problems as they arise. The recent additions were more of an experiment than something I'd planned to change. I do have one more unique character idea in the works but other than that and some rebalancing, this is pretty much complete.

Who knows, if I get the drive to do it I might just change up the monsters some before I hit v2.0. Once I get to there though I will likely stop working on it and post the patch to other game hack sites. No idea what I'm going to do after that, really...
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Dome on July 20, 2011, 05:46:20 PM
Posting a "Complete" hack will give you more attention* :-)
Also, the news section of our site should advertise completed patches when the work is finished*

*IMHO
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on September 06, 2011, 05:50:57 PM
I've been working on getting the old Cloud events removed/remodeled to better fit Cyan's entry to CCP. Thanks to the awesomeness that is Raven's new EasyVent Editor I've already got one such event edit running perfectly. You can see the new event on my youtube channel or just hop right over to Raven's editor thread here where its in a post on the first page: http://ffhacktics.com/smf/index.php?topic=7706.0

Just to note: the new event is not in the patch yet. When I post the next update it should be. I'll note it in the update log when it is.

Yeah, those new events are in the v1.951 release. Go check it out.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Stretch on September 21, 2011, 07:09:40 AM
The skill Hamstring when done by someone with a gun equipped is amazing. The character flies across the map approaching the speed of sound!
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Stretch on September 22, 2011, 12:28:30 AM
Poor Wiegraf; he simply isn't attacking me. Thank you Stonestance! I guess he doesn't have the right secondary skills to do anything to me.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Stretch on September 24, 2011, 02:55:24 AM
What effect does Faith have on Malak's abilities? Will more Faith make his unique abilities less powerful while making the generic abilities in his skillset more powerful?

EDIT: Also, what do you think about Ice Step vs. Windwalker? Walk on Water and Absorb Ice just isn't as good as Wind and Float. Float allows you to walk over water and more no problem. I think Ice Step needs something else added to it to make it a bit better, maybe just add some MP.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on September 24, 2011, 12:56:01 PM
The UnFaith formula has been removed from the patch so never will low Faith be of use in raising damage. Someone reported a while back that Malak was still joining with low Faith but I'm pretty sure I balanced him out.

I'll think about that for Ice Step. I haven't done a +MP skill anywhere...though with the rework I intend to do of Warlock it may end up there. I was just making up different elemental move skills and Ice Step just ended up being rather vanilla in terms of style.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Stretch on September 24, 2011, 06:07:44 PM
Malak joined me with 31 Faith. I remember when making my own light variations to patches that fixing Malak's faith was harder than I thought it should be.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on September 24, 2011, 06:32:12 PM
Yeah that appears to be a running problem here, too.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Lockeadon on September 29, 2011, 07:21:39 PM
is this patch for psp or psx, or both?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on September 30, 2011, 05:45:39 AM
Just for PSX. There have been some attempts to make it function as a PSP eboot but I don't think anyone has produced something that works 100%.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 01, 2011, 05:01:36 PM
Story playable characters keep their innate jobs? I mean, Mustadio mechanich, Agrias holy knight, Orlandou holy swordman, Meliadoul divine knight, Beowulf temple knight, Cloud soldier?

Byblos and Worker 8 still there? Are there any new nice pets? :D

Thanks for answering :)
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on October 01, 2011, 05:26:20 PM
Mustadio is still an Engineer and Agrias is a Holy Knight but the jobs are changed some. Orlandu is titled as a Thunder God now and gets some magic-based skills to go with the new title, though he has lost most of his swordskills. Meliadoul is an Azure Knight now, she keeps her equipment smash skills but they no longer require a sword to use and in addition to those she can learn monster skills when hit with them. Beowulf is actually unchanged. Cloud has been removed entirely and replaced by Cyan. Byblos and Worker 8 are mostly unchanged. Byblos' Energy skill I think it is heals MP instead of HP now due to a formula change. As for 'pets' I'll assume you mean monsters. I haven't gotten around to modifying those seriously yet, though some have been changed a small bit to keep up with the other changes to skills in the game. They're still close to vanilla monsters for the most part right now, but an update on them is in the works.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 01, 2011, 06:01:02 PM
You patch is awesome :D Congratulations Celdia :D
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 01, 2011, 06:10:19 PM
Rapha, Malak, Reis? And what's Cyan's job? :)
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on October 01, 2011, 06:24:07 PM
Thank you. ^_^

I always forget about the Wonder Twins. Rafa and Malak mostly make use of the Red Magic skills in their skillsets but each gets a new, unique skill as well as access to an enemy only skill each. Malak is a little nerfed because I can't get his Faith to start higher than 31 despite changing it in the ENTD he joins on. Reis is mostly unchanged, but her Holy Breath shouldn't be random hits anymore making it a more reliable skill.

Cyan's class is 'Retainer' and his skills mostly mimic what he could do in FF6. He also gets unique access to the Golem skill, reflavored as True Knight for CCP though it functions just as Golem did in vanilla.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Stretch on October 01, 2011, 07:31:27 PM
Looking at the ENTD, I see that Malak should have 69 faith, at least that's what it says on the Riovanes Rooftop 1B1 event. However, the 132 Chapter 4 Start event shows Malak with 31 faith. I'll try making that change in 132 and I'll see if changes anything... it'll be a while until I get there though.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on October 01, 2011, 08:23:16 PM
I'll go ahead and change him there in my patch file just in case that is the place its loading from. Certainly can't hurt.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 03, 2011, 03:10:45 AM
You update patch often. Do I need to restart my game everytime I patch again? Should I patch a new unpatched Final fantasy iso every new patch or I can patch the already patched iso?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Eternal on October 03, 2011, 03:11:57 AM
Patch a clean ISO, but your saves will carry over.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 03, 2011, 03:19:28 AM
Thank you so much :)
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on October 03, 2011, 03:19:34 AM
Thank you, Eternal.

And I don't update too terribly often I don't think, I just tend to update once with a big series of changes and then in the following days there are frequently a bunch of smaller ones. Unless you're chomping at the bit to get to playing, its sometimes a good idea to wait a couple days to grab my patch as there will likely be some minor updates along the way. After that you won't see much here for a month or more.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: paminen on October 03, 2011, 08:44:58 AM
Wow, this mod looks really fun and cool! I have a question though and forgive me if its a dumb one: does this patch work with the psp-script patch? Can I apply both of them or does that break things?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on October 03, 2011, 09:14:27 AM
Generally applying two patches to the same ISO causes all kinds of issues unless they're specifically built to work together. I've never tried to apply the WotL script to CCP but I can't imagine it would go too well. But then I could be wrong. You could give it a shot and let us know. I expect there will be a problem with the events where Cloud normally joins since I've changed those though.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Stretch on October 03, 2011, 05:57:21 PM
I would patch the psp script first, then CCP. Let us know what happens!
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 04, 2011, 06:25:30 PM
I think Pummel is kind of odd and makes the Brawler a too easy-to-win job. I hit like 100% damage half of the times, much over than 100% damage almost the other half of the times and a very little bit less than 100% damage almost never; ah! and it's formula is 100% hit rate, plus it's power it more than normal attack and I've never been countered to it. I think Pummer is overpowered, but that's only my opinion. It makes Brawlers go easy...
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on October 04, 2011, 08:30:04 PM
I think that's the first time anyone has said their Brawler was OP. Usually I get complaints that player Brawlers are weak and AI Brawlers are OP which never made a lot of sense to me. I may reduce the power on Pummel though since it can't be evaded. I'll take it under consideration for the next update.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Stretch on October 04, 2011, 09:26:59 PM
Pummel and Bum Rush are very similar, I think weaken/make Pummel evadable to differentiate them. But I wouldn't say Pummel makes them over powered.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on October 04, 2011, 09:30:35 PM
Actually, making it evadable could do for that. I was making unevadable originally because Cook had the very similar Dice skill which was evadable. That was the major difference between the two...but since there's no Cook or Dice anymore...
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: CT5Holy on October 05, 2011, 06:48:02 AM
Loremasters are cool. So are Gunslingers. I also like the Ele-absorb movement abilities.

I'm kinda tempted to FFTastic tons of JP for everyone -> experiment -> get an idea of what to use and etc for the CCP AI battles. >_>
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 05, 2011, 06:52:51 PM
You could try Pummel a little less often to make great damage. BTW, At Fort Zeakden, at the battle against Algus, Delita still guest. I don't you if you made it like that 'cause you wanted it to be guest, or you skipped it accidentally as is the 1st time I see guests in your patch, but I wanted to tell you in case you didn't know :)

I still thinking your patch is awesome :d
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 05, 2011, 07:14:48 PM
And Rad has Ramza's 1st chapter picture Xd
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on October 05, 2011, 08:48:08 PM
Rad's misplaced portrait is an unfortunate error I haven't looked into fixing yet. Delita being a Guest at Zeakden is intentional though. As has been done in other patches, I was trying to reflect how Delita really isn't under anyone's control at that point, nor if he listening to reason. He only wants to kill Algus. Maybe I'll make him immune to Critical to that battle so he fights to the death instead of ever running away at low HP.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: TigerKnee on October 06, 2011, 05:59:51 AM
I think that's the first time anyone has said their Brawler was OP. Usually I get complaints that player Brawlers are weak and AI Brawlers are OP which never made a lot of sense to me.

Pummel's still luck-based formula skill, isn't it?

As far as personal experiences go, people always seem to remember when random-damage skills fail for them while simultaneously remembering how many times the AI lucks out and slaughters them in 1 hit.

I think that's the best explanation for it, really.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 06, 2011, 05:45:27 PM
You could make Delita go berserk :D
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 07, 2011, 06:38:23 AM
"Save Ovelia" mission at chapter 2 it's impossible :d Demagogues kills Ovelia before I can't even move. Only Delita but he can't kill 3 of them in 1 turn XD
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Stretch on October 08, 2011, 02:21:06 AM
Just keep trying; are you overlevelled? I usually steamroll that battle, what with two swordskill users.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Kalas on October 08, 2011, 02:59:03 PM
Loremasters are cool. So are Gunslingers. I also like the Ele-absorb movement abilities.

I'm kinda tempted to FFTastic tons of JP for everyone -> experiment -> get an idea of what to use and etc for the CCP AI battles. >_>

This is what I did so don't feel bad about it. :)
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 09, 2011, 01:07:51 PM
Just keep trying; are you overlevelled? I usually steamroll that battle, what with two swordskill users.

I'm less leveled! Enemies are lvl 24~ and my party is like 15 XD but I already finished the battle  changing to faster jobs (:
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on October 09, 2011, 02:16:33 PM
That's the kind of detail I need to know about. It sounds like something's glitched there because the Demagogues at Zirekile Falls are all set for Party Level +1. Gafgarion is only +2. There shouldn't be a nine level disparity between your party and the enemy. Something is VERY wrong with that. Its possible to come in leveled over Ovelia and Delita though since I left them with preset levels, 9 and 11 respectively.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 09, 2011, 05:36:11 PM
Celdia: I think the levels are not quite right but not that wrong. I liked the match because it was a challenge. I think you should do 1 of 2 things:

1.- Make AI enemies only 4 or 5 leves higher than party instead of 9 or 10
2.- Change AI enemies a little lower jobs so they don't kill Ovelia that fast XD

Take in mind that Delita had 4th turn and he's got 12 levels less than Gafgarion :) The battle was ok, I enjoyed the battle, but I'm kind of a good tactician, just make it a little bit easier, not much. I've been playing all patch with half level than AI and it's been very easy I must say, with exception of 2 or 3 battles that were a fun challenge :d

I still thinking your patch is sooooo great :D!
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 09, 2011, 05:40:53 PM
There are a couple of things more, like there was a "Pearl I don't remember what" monster that has an ability with no name and little stuff like that, but nothing that serious :p
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: CCM on October 10, 2011, 01:08:36 PM
I'm really enjoying this patch and the weird changes in strategy I have to make for it. One question, though: I can understand the usefulness of Lapidary somewhat, even though they seem to break the ring every single time, but what is the appeal of Tactician? It seems of pretty dubious usefulness, having to spend several turns giving itself a status effect just to use its skills.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: CT5Holy on October 10, 2011, 02:56:14 PM
Someone with Tactician's Shoes -> Haste your whole party at fairly high percentages is nice. (granted, I've only used that in one battle so far) Similarly, Transparent + Float (both easy statuses to start out with) -> Slow all the enemies.
They make you jump through some hoops, but they can be useful. There was an item (Phantom Vial or something like that) that gave a bunch of statuses necessary for Tactician skills to work.
They just seem like a fun class to use, at any rate. I definitely plan on experimenting with them some more.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 10, 2011, 07:29:41 PM
"Save Ovelia" battle was a joke! This was the real big shit!
(http://img847.imageshack.us/img847/1801/zomgr.png)
All 8 enemies were lvl 29+! xD

There was an item (Phantom Vial or something like that) that gave a bunch of statuses necessary for Tactician skills to work.
They just seem like a fun class to use, at any rate. I definitely plan on experimenting with them some more.

Phantom vial still not appear on stores ):
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on October 10, 2011, 08:10:06 PM
If everyone was 29 or higher that means someone in your party, active or not, was level 28. You'll need to keep your units' levels balanced if you don't want to run into a level difference like that. Though admittedly, Golgorand is one of the hardest fights in CCP...and I made it easier in v1.96x.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 10, 2011, 09:19:51 PM
Ramza was a couple of levels higher, 26, just because it started with the training somewhat clothes :p

Btw: I always use the lowest levels to battle, so they keep balanced :? That could be a reason why battles are kind of hard, Agroias still lvl 13 :0 But I find it funnier than having only 5 or 6 favorite supr strong characters. It offers better variety on jobs and entertaining battles :D

Btw2: Is there any unique hit-learnable hability like Serpentaurus and Ultima in the original Final Fantasy Tactics? :O+

Another btw: You'll find a very interesting misspelling in Waterflying cloth description :)
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on October 12, 2011, 02:12:17 AM
The WFC typo was reported already, but thank you all the same. :P

Ultima and Zodiac are both still learn on hit, the first learnable by Ramza and the latter only being learnable by Meliadoul since most of her new skillset is based around learning monster skills.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 12, 2011, 02:25:32 AM
Ramza was a couple of levels higher, 26, just because it started with the training somewhat Btw2: Is there any unique hit-learnable hability like Serpentaurus and Ultima in the original Final Fantasy Tactics? :O

Ultima and Zodiac are both still learn on hit...

Oops, I mean Zodiac xD Hahaha, thanks! :D

-----

There in your Master guide it says Royal tome is obtained by Ovelia. I don't really remember if Ovelia has it or if you can take it 'cause I didn't see Ovelia's equipment there ('cause I didn't noticed there was a Master guide!), but I recently got it from Alma :)

I wanted to ask you: in original Final Fantasy, you used to get a Phoenix down in Deep dungeon when you find an item but you had a high faith and I recently found one at Zeklaus desert? Did I just lost a super nice item? XD
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on October 12, 2011, 05:00:08 AM
Yeah, both Ovelia and Alma currently have the Royal Tome equipped when they show up as guests. Technically Alma having it was an oversight on my part but its not such a powerful item that having two is a problem. I may leave that as-is.

The only thing on the same panel as a P.Down @ Zeklaus Desert is a Gilded Dagger which I think is a fairly low-tier weapon.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Stretch on October 13, 2011, 12:48:24 AM
What's up with Agrias in 1.962? She has ranged weapon only abilities? Or are they for any weapon?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on October 13, 2011, 01:44:37 AM
Agrias' abilities haven't changed since like 1.90 except for one addition I think. Stasis Sword, Crush Punch an Holy Explosion are all still sword-only skills. The rest of her skillset are things pulled from the Champion class which don't require any specific weapon equipped. Ice Step is a unique move skill for her and I think that's the only change since 1.90.

I have no idea if this answers your question though.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Stretch on October 13, 2011, 01:59:39 AM
Check this out:
(http://i.imgur.com/6iTeu.png)

The rom was cleanly patched, but the saves were from another version; but before Agrias officially joins.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on October 13, 2011, 02:06:02 AM
Ah, alright. Now I see the problem. That's an oversight on my end. I moved skills around but didn't fix her skillset. Those are some of the new Nomad skills taking up old slots that were on Champion. Forgot to reset her skillset to reflect the changes.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: darthbane126 on October 15, 2011, 12:41:23 AM
Perhaps you could change the animation of Quadra Slice? It takes awhile to sit through it, especially if a unit dies on the second or third hit :X
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on October 15, 2011, 02:56:21 AM
I'll look into it. I don't even remember which animation I left on that...
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: darthbane126 on October 15, 2011, 09:00:08 PM
I think its the Finishing Touch limit from vanilla.

EDIT: Also, Quadra Slam takes awhile to go through as well. Quadra Slam is Blade Beam methinks
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 16, 2011, 05:43:40 PM
I think you should rewrite the location for the "how to get" items in your Master guide... :) Many of them are already wrong, like you can find Running shoes and Titan guard on store, Ox pole is not a Porky's poach 'cause I already got like one thousand and there was no Crown of glory as War trophy at Bevernia...
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 17, 2011, 05:11:13 PM
What ENTD means? ):
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Eternal on October 17, 2011, 05:16:42 PM
ENTD is basically the formation for each battle. Where enemies are, what they have equipped, etc.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Stretch on October 17, 2011, 07:12:43 PM
But what does it stand for, I've been wondering. Enemy Now To Die?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Eternal on October 17, 2011, 07:16:10 PM
I heard a rumor a long time ago it was some theatrical term, though I'd never heard it myself before.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: BizzMar on October 18, 2011, 04:02:00 AM
ENTD is basically the formation for each battle. Where enemies are, what they have equipped, etc.

Thanks Eternal :)
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: CCM on October 18, 2011, 05:26:30 PM
Argh, the end of chapter 1 is destroying me. All my clothes-wearing units are stuck with Peasant Frocks, since I don't want to give them Training Vests and have them soar ahead of everyone else in level, causing the enemies to scale equally.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Eternal on October 18, 2011, 06:49:10 PM
Celdie, PLEASE remove Training Vests. I beg of you! ;_;
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Stretch on October 18, 2011, 07:14:13 PM
I think Training Vests should have Gained JP Up, and Laborers Clothes should have EXP up. The small HP upgrades and more JP are most important in the early game, and Laborers Clothes can be skipped without too much penalty.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: dis astranagant on December 13, 2011, 11:18:37 PM
Golgorand is getting on my nerves.  Rainbow Armor just came into fashion and thus everything takes days to kill.  Meanwhile, the Demagogues wander up and start spamming sadomasochism and zealotry, pretty much ruining any hope I had of doing anything.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on December 14, 2011, 04:21:03 AM
Golgorand can be a bit of a pain. Definitely one of the hardest fights in the patch. If you can get access to an Enchanter, I'd recommend the Quiet skill for dealing with the Demagogues. Silence should shut them down instantly. With the guns that become available at Goug, you can do this from 8 panels away meaning you'll never need to get into their AoE to do it.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: dis astranagant on December 14, 2011, 05:19:56 AM
I think Agrias is my only possible Enchanter, and I need her damage.  I think part of my problem is that I don't really have a 5th character at the moment since one went nomad and bandit, another rushed Ghaele and immediately regretted it and the last option is Musty being a forgetful asshole after he rejoined (I always forget that).  I haven't been terribly impressed with Ramza in Torero, so maybe I'll just get him Bull Rush and go back to brawling.

My team's level 13-15, maybe if I level a little that damnable Rainbow Mail will go out of style and I can get back to doing some damage.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on December 14, 2011, 05:28:12 AM
Enemies should be capped on equipment by what is available in shops. I don't know that leveling will help with their gear at all. Have you done the props between Goug and Warjilis? Maybe you can unlock Enchanter for the Ghaele. That unit already has the requisite levels in Champion obviously. Red Mage 3 isn't too hard to get and then its just a few points into Enchanter for Quiet.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: dis astranagant on December 14, 2011, 06:03:17 AM
Right now, the general theory is getting arm aim for Mustadio, Lay on Hands for Agrias and either bull rush or the berserk skill for Ramza.  Try and get both status bitches disabled at the start then get Gafgarog to run off while hoping not too many people bring rainbow mail since all of my offense is elemental.  The team red mage is just about ready for to give lore master a go.


Am I supposed to have 1 mp in Torero, no matter what I equip?  Kinda renders a fair bit of the skillset useless.


Finally pulled it off.  This time around most of the enemies wore ceramic instead of rainbow.  Had Mustadio arm aim one of the demagogues, which was the only time it procced any status effects.  Ramza and my other brawler mowed down Gafgarog in one turn each while Agrias tied down the other demagogue with a lucky stop.  One vanquisher procced reraise on a demagogue, which was slightly irritating, though that was the only thing it meaningful any of them actually did.  The 2 warriors near Ramza's team ate a fireball and the rest of the fight was mostly mop up.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: dis astranagant on December 14, 2011, 06:06:26 PM
Could you post monster and special character data in the guide thread?  I want to know what this flaming kick business is about, among other things.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: TigerKnee on December 15, 2011, 05:17:29 AM
I did a write up of Mustadio in an earlier version in the Battle Logs topic, I don't know if it still holds up though, it was quite an old version.

Flame Kick is a strange PA based move which I almost never use because it generally doesn't out-damage a gun, Engineer doesn't have great stats, and you generally try not to let enemies near unless it's a compact map.

http://ffhacktics.com/smf/index.php?topic=7363.msg149771#msg149771

It's at the end of this message (I hope the link works)

Edit: Oops, found another one of my old post that's more detailed I think.

http://ffhacktics.com/smf/index.php?topic=7360.msg150482#msg150482
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: dis astranagant on December 15, 2011, 08:29:10 AM
I second your sentiment on not being able to figure out a secondary for him, though right now (on the way to riovanes) dark/light shot are among my top damaging effects.  Their range plus his speed made UBS a lot easier.  Not sure I like the way the aims work now, the status effect is just a random side effect on top of a normal attack instead of being the reason for the action.

Right now my team is Ramza in brawler with heroics, brave up, equip shield (lantern shield) and bull rush; a generic brawler with Valiance and otherwise setup as ramza other than move+1; a generic loremaster with red magic, faith up, microwave and dark step; Agrias in champion with holy sword and not much else; and Musty with item, gunkata and hotfoot (used the throw item clothes for most of chapters 2 and 3 but defense up clothes and +1 speed clothes are too good to pass up).

Difficulty has been all over the map but generally pretty easy since killing Gafgarog.  Wiegraf in UBS ended up needing the loremaster to suicide bomb him with stone strike, but that was mostly from him lucking out and stopping 2 characters before I got a turn.  Haven't really had much need for the spells out of the books because fireball is way too good (the range on it is ridiculous).  The brawlers have been been consistent area damage for pretty much the entire game, mostly spamming air slash until problems go away.  Agrias has been lagging behind as usual with her fairly pathetic damage output and abysmal movement (chicks not getting move+1 really hurts).


Will switching to the new version mess anything up?  I'd kinda like to give Torero a go and Rad's uniqueness wasn't doing much for me anyway.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on December 15, 2011, 10:57:26 AM
New update will actually keep Rad's uniqueness since you got him as a Mercenary. He won't be MP gimped anymore though. Nothing should stop working because of the fix.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Tea on December 15, 2011, 11:43:42 AM
There are only little ways to get higher brave (ambrosia, brave up), even less for faith (faith up), but I never encountered a way to lower faith. Is this intended, did I miss it somewhere, or what? I don't mind high faith, but one off my guys got high enough faith that I get a warning after the battle, and it's slightly annoying.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on December 15, 2011, 12:25:04 PM
I don't think there is any Faith lowering effect in the game currently, no. I could add to my notes to add one if you think its needed. Wouldn't be hard.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: dis astranagant on December 15, 2011, 03:33:37 PM
Brawler skills don't see to actually be doing weapon damage.  I have Ramza (a Capricorn) with 13 pa, attack up and a Morningstar consistently doing 220 damage vs Wiegraf and Velius instead of the random numbers between 100 and 160   I would expect from the formula given. Even if something screwy was going on and modifiers were applied to both PA terms I'd still only expect to see up to 195 damage (e: this seems to actually be the case), and not consistently.  2 vigors later and I'm at 286, seems to be some version of the standard punch formula.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on December 15, 2011, 04:32:58 PM
The formula on Brawler skills is odd. Its a modified Formula 01 (Dmg_[Weapon]) which is supposed to take your normal attack damage and apply it to the skill. You can see it functioning on other skills as well like the Gunslinger's Aim skills or a couple of the Nomad's skills and last I checked those worked fine. Normally you can't use Formula 01 for skills but its been so long since I applied that hack I'm not even sure why anymore. I'm wondering if you've run into a conflict with the new Whip formula dealing with the new Formula 01, but I honestly couldn't say. Try running the numbers you're getting against the basic Barefisted formula and see what that gives you.

At the very least it sounds like you're not getting UNDER the promised output. That's technically a good thing, right? >_>
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: dis astranagant on December 15, 2011, 06:12:09 PM
Looks to be exactly the bare handed formula.  I'll just chalk up the slight discrepancies I had earlier to me misapplying the million bonuses I was getting vs Wiegraf.

Ramza with a morning star, lantern shield, the latest helmet, rainbow mail/noble's outfit and a titan guard is pretty fun with blitz and attack up.  Gonna patch up and try something similar my other brawler in torero.


By the way: what's with all this gear labeled ALMA in the guide?

Do Vanquishers really have 100 pa growth?  that seems really, really bad.

Another set of oddities:  Bum Rush seems to prevent you from poaching.  Meanwhile, you can poach skeletons on the first hit even when soul shield triggers.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: TigerKnee on December 16, 2011, 02:24:56 AM
ALMA is an ASM hack that allows you to make equipment grant skills like Defense Up (as opposed to base FFT equipment bonus like PA/MA only)
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: MogGuy on December 18, 2011, 04:19:41 AM
I'm having a blast with this hack. It's very nice to see that basic class abilities (Like the Homemaker set in particular) are still useful beyond the first part of the game (I just started Chapter 3). I'm loving all the original classes. It's all really well done. There are so many things I never thought I'd find useful, but have pulled my ass out of the fire. And the Zodiac Demons finall feel like a real threat. For the first time in forever I didn't kill Queklain in 1 or 2 rounds. It was a nice challenge. It took some planning because I couldn't find any Death Sentence protection, but then I remembered the Immunity abilities. Bravo.

One quick question. Do the gems used in the Lapidary class break everytime you use them? Or am I just incredibly unlucky?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on December 18, 2011, 04:36:39 AM
Glad you like it. ^_^ I've got some pretty big restructuring in the works right now but I don't think it will affect the feel of the game too much. Its more to make things more balanced and less annoying in some places.

Gems are like Items and break every time. The Ruby is supposed to never break but I've been having a problem getting it to work separately. It can only be found in the DD though so its not something you need to worry about for the regular section of the game.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: dis astranagant on December 19, 2011, 04:03:31 AM
I think I'm hitting a bit of endgame fatigue.  I'm on the way to Bethla Garrison but it feels like I could mow through everything with just 3 characters.  My 2 blitz users and the loremaster do pretty much all the work while Mustadio and Agrias stand around doing nothing.  Air Slash and Meteor Strike (Chirijiraden but even stronger and with a LONG range? yes please!) are just so powerful.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on December 19, 2011, 04:17:49 AM
I recently watched Laggy run my patch from start to Altima, skipping the side quest stuff. He managed Chapters 3 and 4 by abusing a single Tactician skill that shut down every single enemy formation before they could move, and then he proceeded to drop meteors on everybody. It was a little disheartening to see half of the game so easily bypassed but it did give me some good feedback about how to change what. Suffice to say Loremaster will be getting the rebalancing it so desperately needs.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: dis astranagant on December 19, 2011, 04:28:03 AM
I recently watched Laggy run my patch from start to Altima, skipping the side quest stuff. He managed Chapters 3 and 4 by abusing a single Tactician skill that shut down every single enemy formation before they could move, and then he proceeded to drop meteors on everybody. It was a little disheartening to see half of the game so easily bypassed but it did give me some good feedback about how to change what. Suffice to say Loremaster will be getting the rebalancing it so desperately needs.

They don't even need the mass crippling since short charge is well on the way to getting there. 


I've managed chapters 1-4 with 2 guys doing Air Slash, occasionally punctuated by dropping fireballs and now meteors on assassination targets.  For a brief moment Mustadio was a significant part of my offense before being relegated to phoenix down bitch.  Meanwhile Agrias again proves that swordskills alone do not a unit make.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on December 19, 2011, 04:52:42 AM
Would you believe a lot of the comments I got about the changes to swordskills were pretty much 'OMG Agrias is so OP now'? Because I got a LOT of that through the development of this patch. Mind, I haven't changed her one bit. Just made Holy Swordskills function off MA instead of PA which is like a 1 point difference on her for most of the game I think. Oh, and Stasis Sword got Lightning Stab's range but she always had access to L. Stab so that's not really a change to her.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: dis astranagant on December 19, 2011, 01:47:46 PM
Would you believe a lot of the comments I got about the changes to swordskills were pretty much 'OMG Agrias is so OP now'? Because I got a LOT of that through the development of this patch. Mind, I haven't changed her one bit. Just made Holy Swordskills function off MA instead of PA which is like a 1 point difference on her for most of the game I think. Oh, and Stasis Sword got Lightning Stab's range but she always had access to L. Stab so that's not really a change to her.

Wish that was documented somewhere, I've been building her way wrong, then.  I still doubt she'll be doing much over 100 damage with it, while Ramza and generic torero/brawler are swinging for 150-200 with Air Slash.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: MogGuy on December 22, 2011, 08:50:17 PM
Phew, this is getting interesting. I blew through Velius, thanks to a couple of lucky Crush Punches. I've had a great old time turning Agrias into a complete machine (she was my cornerstone in getting Elmdors equipment, and now wears his hat proudly). I think she's much better in this version, once Orlandu came along in the original there was no reason to keep her around, unless you REALLY wanted a Holy Knight who could equip a Ribbon.

Right now she's a Ghaele with Holy Sword secondary, with most of the Divine Magic learned, just the Reraise skill and Ruby Light left to learn. She is tearing things apart and is my back-up healer, after Rafa. Remove Disease saved my ass against Elmdor. until I got his stuff.

Hell, I haven't even bothered with Orlandu yet (or Reis, for that matter. I remember her growth in the original being godly, is it the same here?).

The only thing I'm having a problem with is Zalera. Everything is moving before I can get a turn and is completely disabling my team. I'm working on it right now, but did you intened to make him so fast? He'll either Nightmare my people repeatedly, or Flare 2 them repeatedly and I can't even keep up enough to move.

EDIT: Beat him. Thank god for Beowulf. I forgot all about the Drain spells taking of a percent. I'm kinda excited about Meliadoul. I really wanna put her to the test, see what she can learn. How many skills can she learn? Just so I can know when to stop hunting.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Tea on December 22, 2011, 10:49:52 PM
In the formation screen, check her learned skills. Skills unlearned and unknown show up as "-----" there.

Also, Zalera can be slowed, which is a good move.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: MogGuy on December 22, 2011, 11:21:01 PM
Thnaks. I can't believe I forgot about that. I hadn't used that feature since my first time playing Vanilla.

Also, he can be slowed? I was so used to boss characters being immune to most everything that I didn't even bother to check! That would've helped a bunch! Thanks.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on December 27, 2011, 02:36:48 AM
Glad you figured a way past Zalera. There are a few different methods for getting past that fight, damage% attacks definitely being one of the more effective ones.

Reis is mostly unchanged. As far as stats go I believe she is still using her Vanilla values there.

Meliadoul should be able to learn the following skills from monsters: Explosion (Fire Elemental), Dark Wave (Darkest Knight), Slavery Song (Siren), Critical Rush (Tortoise), Flare 2 (Zalera), Zodiac. Note that she is now the only character that can learn Zodiac.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Hunter4242 on December 28, 2011, 11:52:11 PM
Right so I picked this up again in the last week after getting it working a while ago.

I've gone through to reaching Lionel for the first time, and here are some observations I had:

-Holy crap I can control guests! Awesomesauce!
-Oh crap story battles scale with me! This gave me a bit of trouble with Zeakden and Bariaus Hill, the latter mostly because of Lapidaries.
-Speaking of Lapidaries, they seem way more powerful on the enemy side, simply because they have infinite items. I know there's nothing to be done about it, but still.
-Vanquisher. Ramza Belmont. Hell Yes.
-What do I pair with Demagogue? I want to use one, cause the female sprite for it is so awesome, but it has no MP. Alchemy maybe?
-For that matter, there's too much awesome stuff I want to make use of between all the classes, especially now that I have a decent choice of equipment available. Here's what I'm currently running with:

Ramza Belmont
Vanquisher
Valiance

Midori
Toereo
Pillage

Sile
Loremaster
Red Magic

Priere
Alchemist
Imbue

Gai
Brawler
Valiance

Also, I love Valiance for the free heals and revives, saved my butt more than once in Chapter 1.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on December 29, 2011, 03:10:22 AM
Quote
What do I pair with Demagogue? I want to use one, cause the female sprite for it is so awesome, but it has no MP.
This statement has me worried that you might not be using the 1.967 patch most recently posted. The No MP thing wasn't supposed to affect anyone but Rad in his base job but a few oversights made it affect other jobs/units in ways I didn't want it to. You might try patching a clean ISO with the latest version of the patch. That should give you the option of MP on the Demagogue. On the Torero, too, if that unit is showing No MP as well.

If you're certain you're on the latest update then I think there are bigger problems with the patch than I'm aware of currently. >_<
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Hunter4242 on December 29, 2011, 12:59:53 PM
This statement has me worried that you might not be using the 1.967 patch most recently posted. The No MP thing wasn't supposed to affect anyone but Rad in his base job but a few oversights made it affect other jobs/units in ways I didn't want it to. You might try patching a clean ISO with the latest version of the patch. That should give you the option of MP on the Demagogue. On the Torero, too, if that unit is showing No MP as well.

If you're certain you're on the latest update then I think there are bigger problems with the patch than I'm aware of currently. >_<

Ah, I may not be. Hopefully it won't mess up my save too badly when I try to patch it, I had enough problems getting it to work right the first time. I don't know if the Torero has no MP, I wasn't really paying attention to it on her since she doesn't use it at all. But I will give it shot tonight and see what results I get thanks!

UPDATE: I was able to patch just fine and it seems fixed. She only has 19 mp as a Demagogue, but it's a far sight better than 1!
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Neophyte Ronin on February 04, 2012, 03:12:00 AM
Okay, maybe it's just me, or is it reprehensible or downright horrifying if Lamias replace Coeurls?

I noticed these creatures inhabiting Mandalia Plains and possessing a nightmarish Discord Skill that poisons and polymorphs if it hits.  They can also Silence and Charm units, making even the Esuna Spell worthless unless everyone has it and uses it swiftly.  The fact that Lamias exist on the very first random battlefield requires you to sneak through (saving first at Igros) before hitting a random encounter which is outright impossible given the early game resources available to units.  Frog is not supposed to be something you encounter until there are fair and reliable countermeasures, and that includes a reliable curing agent for Silence as well, so the Red Mage with Esuna has a shot at curing the froggies.

Practically every random encounter featuring Lamias during Chapter One (the blue kind) made my eyes glaze over and compelled me to pitch the controller at the monitor.  This is the same feeling that flows over a young man's mind when he tries to beat Haunted Castle, the arcade game.  At least I ain't spitting quarters at those #%*&^ Lamias.  Either I patched it wrong or this is actually a major balance issue.  Without appropriate and accessible countermeasures, none of the early creatures should have access to disabling status effects of the same magnitude as Frog.  The answer for upping the challenge rating should not be "Giant Frog," Celdia!

Edit: Other fights are simple.  It's just those damned Lamias.  It's disconcerting to go up against those freaks in the early game.  There is early access to Immunity, but Butlers don't hit hard enough.  In any case, everything else is looking okay so far, although DD was complaining about a fight where infinite-range revive spells and lore-masters were making his eyes bleed.  Looks like more fun than automatic silent frog fights.

Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: yexus on April 03, 2012, 02:58:59 PM
I am not sure I see this anywhere but, can I CCP patch War of the Lion? or is this "strictly" for psx ?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on April 03, 2012, 07:49:39 PM
Strictly PSX I'm sorry to say. WotL chokes to death on a lot of the ASM hacks used in my patch.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: yexus on April 04, 2012, 02:13:09 AM
Strictly PSX I'm sorry to say. WotL chokes to death on a lot of the ASM hacks used in my patch.

Ahh, K thanks. Also another question, If I patch FFT with ur patch, and then convert it to Eboot, it should run fine on the psp right?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on April 04, 2012, 02:26:16 AM
One of our users has spent countless hours trying to make CCP into a functional e-boot. To my knowledge he never got a properly working product out of that as it would always crash somewhere or the data got mixed up and things just glitched out in strange ways. The short answer is that my patch generally does not like being made mobile in any form, but you're welcome to try. Maybe you'll have success where others have failed.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: yexus on April 05, 2012, 04:00:50 AM
One of our users has spent countless hours trying to make CCP into a functional e-boot. To my knowledge he never got a properly working product out of that as it would always crash somewhere or the data got mixed up and things just glitched out in strange ways. The short answer is that my patch generally does not like being made mobile in any form, but you're welcome to try. Maybe you'll have success where others have failed.

Lol I tried and fail too.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: SWFFT on April 22, 2012, 03:29:00 AM
Super excited about playing this, but I have a question -- do you recommend patching this to vanilla FFT or patching it on top of "FFT: Complete"?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Pride on April 22, 2012, 03:30:38 AM
NEVER patch on top of another patched ISO, you'll get an absurd amount of bugs. Always a clean, vanilla FFT ISO.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: SWFFT on April 22, 2012, 04:03:17 AM
Is there a proper FFT image size or file format needed for this patch? For some reason ppf-o-matic keeps crashing (well, after 5 minutes it's still trying to apply the patch, so I'm guessing it's not responding...) when I try to patch my .bin/.cue :/

EDIT: Got it working! Guess it just takes a REALLY long time on my computer...
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Pride on April 22, 2012, 04:09:07 AM
Sometimes it can take a long time to patch, other then that... I'm not sure.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Ciato on May 25, 2012, 09:28:01 PM
I'm in Chapter 3 right now, and I was just wondering if I should just blitz the game in its current form or should I wait for a new patch.. how long might that take?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Eternal on May 25, 2012, 09:30:22 PM
CCP 2.0's going to take a while to finish, so you may as well finish it up.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Otabo on May 28, 2012, 08:29:55 PM
After milling through FFT+'s DD for a good while, I decided to try this patch.

And I love it!

It's been a total blast. Seriously, I'm loving all of the changes to the classes and items and etc. It's like playing an entirely different game. At some points, I had a hard time deciding what classes to use for some of the story battles, because they're all good in one way or another. But I, like others here, was also stuck at Golgorand for a little while (damn demagogues), but I managed to beat it eventually. My guys are kinda powerlevelled, though (they're all around 35-36), and I'm at the end of Chapter 2. Is that bad?

Got a question though, and I don't know if it's been already answered, but when do Phantom Vials show up in shops? I've been meaning to try one of my generics as a Tactician. I'm guessing they show up in Chapter 3?

tl;dr version: CCP is quickly turning into one of my favorite patches.  :)

EDIT: Answered my own question, heh.

Oh, and one more thing - is it me, or is Terminar stupidly OP for Chapter 3? Went into UBS and 4/5 of my team got dropped by two Terminars before I could even move.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Ciato on May 29, 2012, 03:49:12 PM
Just finished Zalera. Zalera's very very hard! Stupidly fast and has a lot of fast tricks up his sleeve. Definitely the toughest battle so far. I'm not sure how I would have won without Slow. I'm enjoying the classes, the art is great, although the battles do feel a little like rocket tag. USB2 is a good example there; half of my party died before I moved and then I killed the enemies with Fireball in like two turns. The Loremaster is definitely the MVP; I love the conceit of the class. I'm using a Ghaele, a Loremaster, a Gunspinner, a Brawler (because who doesn't love Sabin?), and a Mystic Knight. The high unlock prereqs were definitely worth getting for these classes. Brawler feels like the worst and it's the easy one to unlock which is fair. Also of note are the two people with Champion/Valiance secondary; it's a nice revival secondary. My level is 26-30.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Otabo on May 29, 2012, 05:20:30 PM
USB2 is a good example there; half of my party died before I moved and then I killed the enemies with Fireball in like two turns. The Loremaster is definitely the MVP; I love the conceit of the class. I'm using a Ghaele, a Loremaster, a Gunspinner, a Brawler (because who doesn't love Sabin?), and a Mystic Knight. The high unlock prereqs were definitely worth getting for these classes. Brawler feels like the worst and it's the easy one to unlock which is fair. Also of note are the two people with Champion/Valiance secondary; it's a nice revival secondary. My level is 26-30.

Definetly agree that Loremaster is very very strong. Fireball/Ice Storm/Meteor just destroys everything. Torero is also pretty strong, especially w/Terminar. Personally, I'm using Ramza as a Vanquisher/Blitz, Loremaster/Divine Magic secondary, Torero/Pillage secondary, Alchemist/Strategy secondary, and Agrias as a Holy Knight/Mysticism secondary. I haven't had to change the Loremaster since Chapter 1, (and the Torero ever since learning Terminar), but everyone else I'm changing at times.

Just got Rafa and Malak myself. Rafa - just wow, she might just replace the healing duties of my Loremaster. Wild Healing is really fun to use. Haven't done any battles with Malak yet, though.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on May 29, 2012, 07:51:13 PM
Glad you're enjoying the patch, Otabo. Terminar is easily the most OP move in the game for generic units...maybe for anything, really. There's a reason it got abused in my AI battles. :D
Quote
Rafa - just wow, she might just replace the healing duties of my Loremaster. Wild Healing is really fun to use.
o_o Holy shit, mission fucking accomplished. Someone is using one of the Wonder Twins. \o/


@Ciato: Zalera was designed to require Slow to beat him in a normal run. Fun fact: If you collected a piece of Move-Findable equipment at Golgorand, you can actually SOLO that fight with Ramza using that and other gear you're awarded or can buy before then.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Otabo on May 29, 2012, 08:58:07 PM
Well, I've always been a big Rafa and Malak user (and Reis, too). Mainly for DD runs, but I use them for some storyline fights, too.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Ciato on May 29, 2012, 10:40:50 PM
I'm a pretty minimalist player, don't use MFI or poach or anything like that. I was just glad that my gunner happened to have Cripple.

Wondertwins seemed interesting, but I didn't use them due to disliking their plot stuff and thus having an auto-bias against them.

Adra down! He was pretty easy in comparison to Zalera. Giant bug thing FTW?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Kagebunji on June 02, 2012, 11:12:53 AM
Since you have gone away from chat, I will post it for you here. If you don't like it, tell me right away, and I will try to come up with different color schemes. Also, notice that the port got changed, so you will have to use two separate slots for both version.(unless there is a way to go around it which I don't know about)
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Taichii on June 02, 2012, 08:02:08 PM
when she is on her critical state she looks somewhat like ajora1 lol
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: beowulf on June 06, 2012, 04:53:55 PM
So I am extremely new to this forum and forums in general and this may have already been answered but I love your patch and would like it on my psp. Is there a PSP compatible version?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on June 06, 2012, 06:51:02 PM
Sadly, no. To my knowledge, every attempt to make a functional PSP eboot of it have failed in some form or another and most of the hacks I used for it work on the WotL version of the game.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: beowulf on June 07, 2012, 04:11:31 AM
Dang. Well I have almost played through the entire game on PC and its amazing! Props! :D
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Otabo on June 18, 2012, 11:34:11 PM
My masochistic side is itching to get out, so I'm now attempting War of the Gods with the patch. Wish me luck. I don't see me getting past Bariaus Hill, though. Those Lapidaries.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on June 19, 2012, 03:48:47 AM
Oh, that should be intetresting. Keep us updated in the Battle Logs thread! ^_^
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Lady Ladile on June 27, 2012, 06:30:02 PM
After taking a break for other games (ME3, Skyrim, D3) and RL (got married, moved), I'm back to playing around with CCP.  I'd previously made it to Chapter 4, but enough stuff has been changed with the last few patches that I decided to start over.  I'm only a few story battles into Chapter 1, but I gotta say that the new (to me) Siren and Adamantoise enemies definitely threw me for a loop at first.  Must recruit some of them soon >.>
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on June 27, 2012, 07:40:04 PM
Welcome back, Ladile!

Siren family is OP as hell, I'm told. >_> They're getting toned down a bit in the next version.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Lady Ladile on June 28, 2012, 02:35:26 PM
Yeeeeah, the Silence + Charm thing is annoying but can be worked around.  However, the Poison Frog thing makes my blood pressure go up.  At least it can hit the enemies as well as my guys...

Oh, and the changes to the Bomb class! "What the-oh. Well."

I have to admit that I -do- like that you're giving more monsters ranged attacks, which actually makes them a little more challenging to fight.

Otabo's post about doing War of the Gods got me to thinking about how challenges would work in CCP.  I'll probably play it normally once to get a better feel for the classes, but I'm tempted to try a Squad Challenge or some type of Magic User Challenge in the future.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on June 28, 2012, 06:17:24 PM
There's always the Homemaker SCC :P  I could post a more current version of that if you wanted. Or if anyone else wants something silly to do with CCP while waiting for the next version.

As for Otabo's WotG run, I've been following that and I find it highly entertaining. I'm not used to seeing those kinds of mods on FFT, let alone on my own work and everytime he comes up against something new that I expect to give him major trouble he deals with it like it was nothing. I'm always left a little :o after watching. Which reminds me...I'm gonna go post some links to his videos for that in the Battle Logs thread.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Lady Ladile on June 28, 2012, 10:43:50 PM
Hehe thanks, but I tend to avoid SCCs because I would get bored without having at least a little class variety to play with.  A squad challenge would be easy to formulate but it can be a pain getting all your guys to their classes.  The magic user challenge, uh...I guess pick from the classes that are MA-based?  Oh!  Limited skills might also be entertaining!  Such possibilities  :mrgreen:
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on June 28, 2012, 11:31:58 PM
If you've got a squad in mind for a challenge I could just magic up a memory card file you could use. Do the generic sort of thing and start you at Dorter 1 with the classes you want unlocked. Wouldn't be too much work.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Lady Ladile on June 29, 2012, 03:13:12 AM
I might just take you up on that in the near future; I'll need to figure out what sort of setups I'd want for my squads first though.  I'd probably do 3 groups of 4 + Ramza, so that'd be 12 generics. Thanks!  :)
Title: Just an unrelated comment!
Post by: Kantolin on October 31, 2012, 10:14:22 PM
The tactician is the most fun class I have ever played with in a tactical style game.

Celdia, you have utterly /ruined/ normal tactics for me due to how fun a tactician is to play with. ^_^ It's to the point where in D&D and other games, I call out "Wheel Formation!" when doing anything that makes people go faster.  Many of my rougher last-ditch battles have resulted in an in-critical and poisoned tactician who just quicked everyone, and now I have to either win the battle ore get him cured of poisoned or he'll be dead and a zombie which will give me a hard 3 counter to complete the stage.

Just /so much fun/, wow.  I haven't played any of the newer versions - I'm still on the one where Malak's faith is abysmal, and thus he's been getting some serious face-up nannying so he can do more than just his wild magic, but good lord am I enjoying this mod.  I'm standing outside of the final plunge into Murond Death City - I'll do the vicious deep dungeon later.  Or more likely, once I beat the game, I'll get the newest version and start from scratch, as I want to do more tacticianing from early on!

I sense one of my difficulty problems is that I'm too high level - I was doing some inviting of monsters without realizing the effect this would have on story battles, heh.  Too used to normal FFT.  Still, this is super fun - I really /LOVE/ that class, wow.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Otabo on November 01, 2012, 04:40:19 PM
That reminds me, I still need to beat Altima in my WotG run. Just need to find a good setup for her.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: dis astranagant on December 09, 2012, 06:19:07 AM
Welp, Zalera was a pain til I gave everyone heretic swords and stuck engrave on a couple people.  Worker 8 did most of the heavy lifting til I noticed Zalera's water weakness via dolphin kick.  Got kinda boring watching him spam void at mel all day and I didn't pick up flare2 but in the end it worked.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: dis astranagant on December 10, 2012, 05:41:41 PM
Not sure NOGIAS is even possible with float not working.  Thought I was figuring things out then out came the 999 titan.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on December 10, 2012, 06:28:47 PM
I don't know what's causing that for you, dis. I just went and tested the NOGIAS battle myself - put Winged Hats on everyone and even double-checked by trying to cast Stone Strike on my own party. Every single one of them Guarded it and the boss there never once tried to use Titan Call.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: dis astranagant on December 11, 2012, 04:59:59 AM
Well, he never did it again so idk.  Slogged through the DD (is it unfinished or did I just have bad luck drawing special fights past the Belmonts?) and finished the game.  Cyan is pure cheese, even with tacticians doing all the heavy lifting.  He broke Altima's brain so she only got one spell off the whole fight, wasting it on Alma.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on December 11, 2012, 07:30:50 AM
DD is technically unfinished. I only had a few ideas for battles to put in there that I could actually make work. There's the battle at Nogias, the Belmonts and the Chocobo Elite battle. Everything else is vanilla load-outs which with the new jobs makes for some odd combinations. Cyan is intended to be completely over the top since he is so completely optional to get. A kind of reward for wasting all the time and energy needed to get him at all.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: dis astranagant on December 11, 2012, 05:43:15 PM
Well, while he may be pure cheese, I only ever used 2 of his skills.  Stunner made the perfect finisher after a couple shots of spike pit trap and instant golem had all of its AI breaking fun.  Other than that he just stabbed people in the face for the only decent damage any of my guys could pull out besides terminar.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: TigerKnee on December 14, 2012, 06:05:51 AM
Hey people, I have a bit of free time and I decided to start another playthrough of CCP. Last time I've played, the Loremaster was instead a cheesy class whose name I can't remember that could OHKO everyone on the map and I feel that I might not have a proper view of the end-game because of it.

But now the class has changed and a bunch of other stuff as well, so let's begin.

Disclaimer: I'm not a very good FFT player, I suspect people might be a lot smarter and found more use for certain abilities compared to me.

Unfortunately, I have less free time in my life compared to the past, so while I was fond of doing things like draw out battles to eat crystals and get treasure chests, I will probably not do said strategies nowadays. Also I probably won't quite go into too much detail. Anyway let's begin/.

Chapter 1 always kind of felt like pulling teeth to me and in this current patch... it's better than the really old versions where enemy's equipment scaled to your level, but worse than the one after said patch.

I think one of the problems is that a lot of the early game classes have abilities that are really nice as supplementary options, but aren't exactly "workhorse" abilities to build a core strategy on. Also, a lot of classes don't have an easy way to build up JP the way Throw Stone did in Vanilla FFT. The Butler is one of the classes most hit by this IMO because he's too squishy to auto-attack but his abilities (that you can afford at chapter 1 anyway) are too niche to give him any useful actions to build JP. Homemaker gets off because Sugary Candy is like a reverse healing Throw Stone. I think some of their starting abilities really needs to be cheaper (and yes, I know 150 JP is pretty cheap in the grand scheme of things but with early level characters it feels like it takes forever only to receive a niche ability)

Also, randoms are a pain in this version. A battle with a Siren can basically wipe out your party in one action if you get unlucky and get 3 people frogged or something and stuff like Bombs seem to deal ridiculous damage with their new moveset to early game player characters. Ironically they aren't that great if you actually recruit them because in story battles the enemy always kind of seems to have a positioning advantage over you where monsters terrible average 3 move really hurts.

Now that being said, the change of being able to control guest AI now means that it's MUCH easier to just play through story missions without stopping to grind. Having control of Algus and Delita makes Dorter significantly easier and I love that because I hate having that stupid level wall me.

Once you get to Chapter 2, I find that propositions and the more interesting jobs opening up means the patch is a lot more fun to play.

Assorted early game stuff:
Charge is a pretty lame skillset in Vanilla and it's not particularly groundbreaking here... HOWEVER, most other early game abilities are so niche that Charge +4 actually ends up being quite exciting in comparison and quite possibly one of the few things that I would consider a "workhorse" ability for consistent damage (if you want to burst early, you'll have to go with Red Mage)

The skillset could honestly use some JP reductions though. Charge +4 or perhaps +5 is basically the only cost-efficient skill on the list. By the time you get something like Charge + 20 it doesn't work anymore.

Early Homemaker: Sugary Candy good for grinding, Boil is actually surprisingly good as a secondary skillset on the magic using classes early for picking off key targets (assassination missions, mostly).

Butler: Yucks. Silverware as a starting ability really doesn't work due to how the charge system in FFT works. Blackmail is solid though you can only really use it like 2 or 3 times before your MP runs out. I would basically just buy +1 Move and then not use this class until you can get over the hump using propositions.

Champion: The early game abilities aren't great. Healing Touch can't really heal very well but it's there to grind JP. Rejuv Touch is terrible until Heavy Armor actually becomes strong enough to provide enough HP to regenerate off.

Really in early game, this class basically just exists for 2-H sword beatdown, which has been nerfed compared to the past now that those swords don't provide their own element. Still, put Charge on this guy and you'll have a solid consistent attacking unit.

Red Mages: Workhorse for early game. It has a big list of abilities and if you don't want to grind, you really got to know which ones to pick.

With the free JP, definitely buy Jolt and Freeze. Jolt will always be useful because it has no charge time and Freeze is a solid ability and especially useful for killing goblins. Aura is optional but helpful if you need healing although I find Ramza and Delita bandages work fine.

After that, upgrade to Thunder by around the time of Sand Rat Cellar because the entrances are PERFECT for lining up enemies.

Then get Simoon at around Thieves fort. It's significantly better than Scorch which I never found any use for. The battlefields are set in such a way that the next few battles up to Fort Zeakdan has the enemy bunched up in such a way that Simoon deals a huge blow to them.

Wall is a nice splash for Red Mages who AREN'T you main for battles where you can afford to wait a little instead of having to rush strategic positions ASAP. I had Algus take up this duty for me.

Nomad: A niche unit overall that you really only pull out when you can gain access to a height advantage which... isn't often. Dorter and Zaland fort city comes to mind.

Niche niche abilities as usual. Updraft is probably the best one early and even then it's niche. Put Charge as a secondary and just use his access to bows as your advantage.

That 2 movement and inability to wear boots, I find to be kind of unbearable. Seeing as how Nomad gates Bandit, you almost have to make these guys male until you get propositions.

Loremaster: This really isn't an "early" game class IMO but somehow I managed to stick Ramza in Red long enough to access this.

I like the concept and it's definitely less overpowered compared to the previous incarnation. Fireball is hilariously good for all the early assassination missions and can one-shot (or close anyway) most of them but if you don't end the battle immediately then its MP cost makes it unfeasible so I won't consider it overpowered.

I was expecting the final Chapter 1 Algus fight to be a long slog but Algus just rolled over dead instantly when a fireball was dropped on him. Maybe I had good compatibility or something.

Tactician: Kind of want to make this class work for me, I remember the last time I played it, it was super buggy. Well they're fixed now but I think they're hard to use when guests are still being forced into your party all the time limiting your deploys to 4. We'll see I guess.

Question: How does dual elemental abilities work? If I cast boil on a Fire Bomb, what sort of damage would I do?
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Celdia on December 14, 2012, 06:23:15 AM
Glad to see there's still enough interest in the patch you make you come back for another pass, TigerKnee. Keep an eye out here for something new, hopefully before the end of the month.

Question: How does dual elemental abilities work? If I cast boil on a Fire Bomb, what sort of damage would I do?

It inverts the damage to healing and then it applies the normal Weak multiplier regardless of the fact that it's a healing effect now. So it becomes super-charged healing.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Reks on December 14, 2012, 06:54:33 AM
And i'm again reminded that I need to play CCP.





..... *again gets distracted by Etrian Odyssey*
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: TigerKnee on December 15, 2012, 04:03:35 AM
Got walled a bit by Execution Site which I kind of expected. Loremaster doesn't work because it's too squishy and enemies are too spread out/too many for a decisive Fireball victory.

Decided to use a tanky Demagogue/Engrave setup. Didn't even use any of the Demagogue skillset actually, just needed access to Heavy Armor + not terrible MA.

Adrenaline serves a hilarious double purpose against Chocobo Codex wielders. Not only do you stop them from using skills, they also helpfully provide you with free healing and reraise. Just awesome.

Tactician hasn't been that useful for me other than providing haste to 4 other people but that's about it.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: Otabo on December 15, 2012, 07:39:37 PM
Tactician hasn't been that useful for me other than providing haste to 4 other people but that's about it.

Just learn Spike Pit Trap + Take High Ground and you might be saying otherwise. They're both very useful and effective.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: dis astranagant on December 15, 2012, 09:04:10 PM
Definitely.  Spike pit trap is the best skill in the game by miles and a couple tacticians will shred any fight with it, while being untouchable half the time.  Once you get a couple dragon poles you don't even need time to set up.  Give them sunken state on top of that and anyone who does manage to attack them just got rid of a set up turn.
Title: Re: CCP - Discussion Topic
Post by: TigerKnee on December 16, 2012, 09:08:42 AM
Yeah, I just got access to Fresh Herbs and the only thing my Tacticians do now is lie down on the floor and then shred the map.

I feel kind of disappointed, because

1) it reminds me of old Loremaster (Actually, I think they were called Warlocks or something) which overfocused the battles on themselves... well, except the AI was better at using those guys because they're braindead simple and not that good at using Tacs and Warlock battles were at least challenging in a sense that you're going to have to fight a way to kill those guys fast.

2) Tacts have one of the bigger skillset in the patch and you basically just use 2 of them over and over.

Zalmo is slightly hard than I thought due to the fact that enemies get first strike because of level scaling and starting position is really terrible and his unique spells hit pretty hard.

I regret not stealing stuff from Wiegraf 2. His armor is pretty strong for where it is.

The deserters battle are somehow still using old sprites (Monk/Chemist/etc)... funny, I thought those sprites were replaced in the game but I'm not sure about the technical details of FFT hacking. Good stuff to steal here.

What's up with random battles and monsters? A lot of monsters seem to be missing attacks, such as the Squid family where only 1 of them have Mind Blast. For some reason I can't seem to breed the 3rd tier of certain monster classes (Sirens and Bombs, I managed to get a 3rd tier Skeleton) and also it seems like I never seen a single human unit appear in a random battle anymore (which is bad because I would like to save some money by stealing stuff off them. Equipment is expensive in this patch.)