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FFT Arena Beta Tournament - Discussion and videos here!

Started by FFMaster, January 14, 2011, 04:19:22 pm

Eternal

Indeed we will! I'm kind of afraid we'll get some map with wonky terrain. My Paladins don't like that too much.
  • Modding version: PSX & WotL
"You, no less human than we? Ha! Now there's a beastly thought. You've been less than we from the moment your baseborn father fell upon your mother in whatever gutter saw you sired! You've been chattel since you came into the world drenched in common blood!"
  • Discord username: eternal248#1817

Skip Sandwich

I'm a little worried about my match with dommieV, from what i'm seeing, it will probably hinge upon two things

A) if I can break the paladin's shield so as to discourage him from grand crossing

B) if i can take his ninja down and keep him down (he's got an angel ring so I can't just blind and evasion tank him)
"Dave?  Are you there?"
"Yeah.  I can't get you through the cell now."
"You have to talk through the bratwurst from now on. I'm sorry. I didn't know it would do that."
http://www.johndiesattheend.com

DomieV

Looks like i'm up against Skip Sandwich, hopefully my elemental healing without charging can help me out, GL Skip

The Damned

January 16, 2011, 07:53:57 pm #43 Last Edit: January 16, 2011, 10:11:18 pm by The Damned
It would appear that you need to relink to Round 3 of philsov vs. Otabo on the front page again, FFMaster.

I find it funny that this match had so much better AI than my own, but I'll gripe about that in a bit. Anyway, it would seem that Shuriken, like Katon, Raiton and Suiton, has a bit too much range. At least compared to the latter three, it's able to be dodged, even if it's more difficult than it should be due to going off of M-EV for...some reason.

Probably the most even round so far, which is saying a bit. Not much to say here outside of Otabo's Mime's AI being better than my entire team's.


And this is why Lich is both far superior to Demi, Demi 2, Death AND Odin at present.


Again, not much to say. I feel like we should fight at Volcano more, at least if it doesn't encumber either team that much.


With regards to my match, god damn the AI is stupid between constantly bunching for AoE and then not using AoE themselves; Mateus didn't even Fly to the top the castle like he could have multiple times in the Round 1. Doesn't help that I just had even worse luck--completely unnecessarily--between getting one of the few long-range maps where LoS was unable to be established (and my Samurai was being an idiot) and, due to Fly and the Summoners being stupid, my team got split up; also got hit with 26% Mimic Daravon thrice in a row, though I guess that's payback for beating Standstill (with Concentrate) in a similar manner (though at least Fuijin's had 36% chances to hit) and it's not like it ultimately mattered.

Sigh. At least I learned some things, like the fact that Summoners on this team should probably NOT have Ice 4 given they weren't using anything else they had (like Shiva or Cyclops). Also that, Mateus really should have gotten Float over Fly, Protect and Shell (and would have gotten it had I been thinking when I came back that night).

Anyway, I don't want to this sound self-important, but given how little damage my team was doing, even with the worst compatibility issues and the halving issues on top of that, I think it's pretty clear that the Faith floor needs to be raised when a 70 Faith female Summoner with an Ice Rod can't even break 100 damage against someone, much less is hitting people for 20.

Meh. I knew I should have gone with that all Serpentarius status team, especially since the Bard there had Float. That or....

*grumbles*
"Sorrow cannot be abolished. It is meaningless to try." - FFX's Yunalesca

"Good and evil are relative, but being a dick cannot be allowed." - Oglaf's Thaumaturge in "The Abyss"

"Well, see, the real magic isn't believing in yourself. The real magic is manipulating people by telling them to believe in themselves. The more you believe, the less you check facts."  - Oglaf's Vanka in "Conviction"

Barren

Hey it happens Damned, we all learn from our mistakes.....this is actually a great place to learn about team building, CT5Holy already did a guide on it
  • Modding version: Other/Unknown
You dare cross blades with me?

Skip Sandwich

I'm of the opinion that faith needs to be hacked so as to perform more like fury, going from say +/- 50% base damage/accuracy instead of the way it does currently,  going from 0% to 100% effectiveness.
"Dave?  Are you there?"
"Yeah.  I can't get you through the cell now."
"You have to talk through the bratwurst from now on. I'm sorry. I didn't know it would do that."
http://www.johndiesattheend.com

FFMaster

Quote from: Skip Sandwich on January 16, 2011, 08:09:26 pm
I'm of the opinion that faith needs to be hacked so as to perform more like fury, going from say +/- 50% base damage/accuracy instead of the way it does currently,  going from 0% to 100% effectiveness.

I agree with this. It can be done easily, I'm sure, but it would take a while for me to rebalance the spells again.

As for Damned vs Melancthon, I think Damned got the worst matchup out of all the other competitors, as well as a horrible map. Just bad luck from the RNG all round.

Lich, I agree is strong. It has been that way since 1.3 tournaments, it's just that people have neglected it for other better things. With Steal Heart nerfed and Throw non-existant, Lich can finally show off what it does. Demi and Demi 2 have always been terrible imo, and needs a good boost. Odin will probably always be a gimmick I think.
  • Modding version: Other/Unknown
☢ CAUTION CAUTION ☢ CAUTION CAUTION ☢

The Damned

Even if it's a gimmick, Odin still seems better than Death does. However, I suppose I have an idea of how I can test this out....

And, yeah, Demis have always been bad for some reason. Not sure how to fix that, though perhaps it will be a bit easier since Skeletons aren't likely going to have (free) Demi in Arena.

Quote from: Barren on January 16, 2011, 08:01:25 pm
Hey it happens Damned, we all learn from our mistakes.....this is actually a great place to learn about team building, CT5Holy already did a guide on it


I appear to never learn from my mistakes since I really should have seen a lot of this coming given all the testing I did with the AI when I was working on my patch.

Quote from: Skip Sandwich on January 16, 2011, 08:09:26 pm
I'm of the opinion that faith needs to be hacked so as to perform more like fury, going from say +/- 50% base damage/accuracy instead of the way it does currently,  going from 0% to 100% effectiveness.


I also concur with this, though re-balancing all magic, especially the magic that no one has really used so far. (I'm counting things like the Yin-Yan Magic that isn't Paralyze or Life Drain or Sleep, Lore spells that aren't the hit everyone ones, non-damaging Summon Magic, etc.)

I also suppose I concur with lowering the amount/significance of Best and Worst compatibility. Were we talking about lowering Good and Bad as well? I forget.
"Sorrow cannot be abolished. It is meaningless to try." - FFX's Yunalesca

"Good and evil are relative, but being a dick cannot be allowed." - Oglaf's Thaumaturge in "The Abyss"

"Well, see, the real magic isn't believing in yourself. The real magic is manipulating people by telling them to believe in themselves. The more you believe, the less you check facts."  - Oglaf's Vanka in "Conviction"

Skip Sandwich

January 16, 2011, 10:36:40 pm #48 Last Edit: January 16, 2011, 10:37:05 pm by Skip Sandwich
I believe FFMaster said he was working on capping good/bad compat at +/- 12.5% and Best/worst at +/- 25% or somesuch
"Dave?  Are you there?"
"Yeah.  I can't get you through the cell now."
"You have to talk through the bratwurst from now on. I'm sorry. I didn't know it would do that."
http://www.johndiesattheend.com

FFMaster

The hack already exists. I just haven't posted it on the forums or implemented it.
  • Modding version: Other/Unknown
☢ CAUTION CAUTION ☢ CAUTION CAUTION ☢

Celdia

Round 2 is the greatest thing I've seen in a while from the AI Tournaments. The was epic.


For the record, I'm actually getting a little nervous about my upcoming match. >_< Excited too, though. ^_^
  • Modding version: PSX
  • Discord username: Celdia#0

FFMaster

  • Modding version: Other/Unknown
☢ CAUTION CAUTION ☢ CAUTION CAUTION ☢

Barren

good matches by gotwald, earth dragon spam really proved to be effective in sandbagging and damage
  • Modding version: Other/Unknown
You dare cross blades with me?

dinosaur

Whoa. Strong sages. I guess if Lore is strong enough speed save doesn't really matter.

Melancthon

Great fights so far!  I'm loving what I'm seeing for teams, too.  A lot of variety and some very interesting set-ups (that Secret-Fisting Priest might be the coolest thing I've ever seen).  Can't wait to see how it all plays out.

GG The Damned!
Just a collaborator plotting collaboration.
"WHATS ST AJORA'S DEAL DUDE!?"

FFMaster

  • Modding version: Other/Unknown
☢ CAUTION CAUTION ☢ CAUTION CAUTION ☢

Eternal

Well, evasion totally owned me. Evasion and enemies who refused to stay dead. I wish my Scholar wasn't such an idiot with his Bio spells. Good game, Barren!
  • Modding version: PSX & WotL
"You, no less human than we? Ha! Now there's a beastly thought. You've been less than we from the moment your baseborn father fell upon your mother in whatever gutter saw you sired! You've been chattel since you came into the world drenched in common blood!"
  • Discord username: eternal248#1817

Barren

that was a good fight Eternal :) we all shared the love...lol....anyways GG Eternal
  • Modding version: Other/Unknown
You dare cross blades with me?

dinosaur

OMG Barren's team was SO physically weak, it was the high evade that help barren win. Also, I think the AI for Eternal was stupid

Barren

Quote from: dinosaur on January 18, 2011, 07:51:33 pm
OMG Barren's team was SO physically weak, it was the high evade that help barren win. Also, I think the AI for Eternal was stupid


thats because i was going for more evade tanking and status instead of dps.....worked so far
  • Modding version: Other/Unknown
You dare cross blades with me?