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Parted Ways Redux  (Read 2016 times)
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Mediator
Eternal [Posts: 3069]
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  • [July 07, 2012, 09:17:47 PM]
Parted Ways Redux
« on: July 07, 2012, 09:17:47 PM »
For those wondering why there hasn't been an update in ages, it's because I'm redoing PW from the ground up using fewer ASMs so that it runs more smoothly on more emulators and so there won't be as many bugs. Fear not though, progress is being made!

PW Redux will have a scaled item system (same as Vanilla's, and it'll be less overwhelming for new players). Pride, Elric, and I have been discussing event and ASM changes, so don't think there won't be new events!

I'm also considering replacing Snipers with Gamblers, since Snipers are kinda gimmicky right now and the AI is dumb as bricks with them. Thoughts?

    • Modding version: PSX & WotL
    • Discord username: eternal248#1817
  • "You, no less human than we? Ha! Now there's a beastly thought. You've been less than we from the moment your baseborn father fell upon your mother in whatever gutter saw you sired! You've been chattel since you came into the world drenched in common blood!"
    Unreliable as a Mime.
    The Damned [Posts: 2168]
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    • [July 07, 2012, 11:01:24 PM]
    Re: Parted Ways Redux
    « Reply #1 on: July 07, 2012, 11:01:24 PM »
    (I know that I'm hardly one to talk, but....)

    It would be helpful if you reminded people what Sniper actually does given your Master Guide isn't up-to-date. Similarly, it might be helpful to explain what problems the AI was having with them, even if it seems obvious, especially for those of us who had problems getting the game to play at all, such as myself.

    Other than that, when it comes to suggestions, I'm guessing "we" should keep your PSP version in mind also? Or are you redoing that as well?

    "Sorrow cannot be abolished. It is meaningless to try." - FFX's Yunalesca

    "Good and evil are relative, but being a dick cannot be allowed." - Oglaf's Thaumaturge in "The Abyss"

    "Well, see, the real magic isn't believing in yourself. The real magic is manipulating people by telling them to believe in themselves. The more you believe, the less you check facts."  - Oglaf's Vanka in "Conviction"
    Mediator
    Eternal [Posts: 3069]
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    • [July 07, 2012, 11:13:14 PM]
    Re: Parted Ways Redux
    « Reply #2 on: July 07, 2012, 11:13:14 PM »
    The PSP version's really on the backburner until the PSX version is redone.

    Snipers used "Snares" to attack enemies. Persevering Earth attacks that could each inflict Immobilize to continue snaring foes if they didn't have Earth or Immobilize protection. Their intended use was to create non-entry zones and cutoff narrow paths, but the AI barely used them at all.

    • Modding version: PSX & WotL
    • Discord username: eternal248#1817
  • "You, no less human than we? Ha! Now there's a beastly thought. You've been less than we from the moment your baseborn father fell upon your mother in whatever gutter saw you sired! You've been chattel since you came into the world drenched in common blood!"
    Unreliable as a Mime.
    The Damned [Posts: 2168]
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    • [July 08, 2012, 12:01:58 AM]
    Re: Parted Ways Redux
    « Reply #3 on: July 08, 2012, 12:01:58 AM »
    (Oh, I see.)

    I had suspected that the Ensnare skillset was theirs, but to be honest, the complete overhaul of skillset names still throws me off.

    Anyway, not to condescend, but you made sure the "Used by AI" flag and the (only) appropriate behavioral flags were checked off, correct? I'm asking more because I'm not sure what skills you used rather than thinking that you didn't do it after all this time, though it's definitely possible to miss some small things for a long while.

    Maybe it's just Persevering combined with those long CTs and single-target that dissuaded the AI from using them? Those skills still work if the user moves while Performing, right? Also, the AI has used them some of the time, just not as much as you think they should?

    Regardless, I'm not sure Gambler is a much better idea, especially when it comes to getting the AI to use skills considering how they treat "Random Hit" and how Random is basically what Gambler is all about. I have had difficult enough times trying to think up a skill for a Gambler class on two occasions as it is even before that particular issue, though that's partly because of targeting issues; also, I'm not saying that it can't be done just because I couldn't do it or think that I could do it satisfactorily.

    I'll try to have an idea of...something by time I come back.

    "Sorrow cannot be abolished. It is meaningless to try." - FFX's Yunalesca

    "Good and evil are relative, but being a dick cannot be allowed." - Oglaf's Thaumaturge in "The Abyss"

    "Well, see, the real magic isn't believing in yourself. The real magic is manipulating people by telling them to believe in themselves. The more you believe, the less you check facts."  - Oglaf's Vanka in "Conviction"
    Mediator
    Eternal [Posts: 3069]
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    • [July 08, 2012, 12:03:27 AM]
    Re: Parted Ways Redux
    « Reply #4 on: July 08, 2012, 12:03:27 AM »
    Yeah, I double-checked their AI flags and everything. They were just being dumb. As for Gamblers, I'd be willing to hear other replacement ideas.

    • Modding version: PSX & WotL
    • Discord username: eternal248#1817
  • "You, no less human than we? Ha! Now there's a beastly thought. You've been less than we from the moment your baseborn father fell upon your mother in whatever gutter saw you sired! You've been chattel since you came into the world drenched in common blood!"
    Unreliable as a Mime.
    The Damned [Posts: 2168]
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    • [July 08, 2012, 02:14:49 AM]
    Re: Parted Ways Redux
    « Reply #5 on: July 08, 2012, 02:14:49 AM »
    (Back. Sorry for that initially typo'd post above. You posted before I could actually proofread what I had posted.)

    I suspected as much. Still, would you mind Print Screen'ing a couple? I'm...curious about something just in the general sense.

    Ultimately up to you though.

    Anyway, while on my walk, among other things, it occurred to me that I forgot to ask you something else that's moderately important: Given that you're planning to get rid of Sniper due to the above, I'm guessing you want its replacement to still be able to use a Longbow, correct? Actually, am I correct in thinking that Sniper is/was the primary Longbow user at all?

    Regardless, assuming that you do indeed want to keep Longbow use, I thought of about three different classes, none of them terribly original--two of them come directly from FFT:A, which you happen to be working on:


    1. Sniper: As in the FFT:A version, but decidedly less busted. So nothing like "Self: 100% Transparent" or "attack that damages as much as regular + 100% Poison", though I'm sure you've already encountered that with Grim Grimoire. This would be the most (physically) aggressive option.

    2. Animist/Hunter/Ranger: Basically combining FFT:A's Animist with FFT:A's Hunter and FFV's Ranger, the latter for its Animals command more than its quadruple shot. This would more middle of the road among the options, allowing for healing or attacking, physical or magick.

    3. Shaman: A more defensive, magickally-based version that limits lines of attacks and just happens to use a Longbow. Not taken from Final Fantasy history, but partly somewhere else. Could be more aggressive, I suppose, but I'm admittedly not terribly familiar with your abilities as it is, much less your magick and magickal divisions.


    All that said, I suppose I have thought of a potential way to go with Gambler if you really feel you must. It depends on how potentially "silly" you want to get, though it seems to have worked well for some people. Please take this as an example of a potential Gambler skill:


    Drinking Game: Rng 1, AoE 1, Linear 100% Poison with 1 Random Hit; Message Upon Success: "Guess you couldn't hold your liquor!"


    ...Yeah.

    I probably won't have anything else more definitive to suggest here before next Friday, especially since I want to finish updating Embargo by this weekend (finally).

    "Sorrow cannot be abolished. It is meaningless to try." - FFX's Yunalesca

    "Good and evil are relative, but being a dick cannot be allowed." - Oglaf's Thaumaturge in "The Abyss"

    "Well, see, the real magic isn't believing in yourself. The real magic is manipulating people by telling them to believe in themselves. The more you believe, the less you check facts."  - Oglaf's Vanka in "Conviction"
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