VK patch job tree discussions

[VincentCraven]

Story battles - yes (but see below)

Random battles - idk

The only catch is I don't know how to make an event that says "IF Chocobo is present THEN Ramza mount Chocobo" or anything of that nature. Now if we figure out how to do THAT, then we're in business.

[NeedsMoreNoise]

Which reminds me, perhaps we should make Chocobo appear later so that you will be equipped (with Boco) to take them down?

Chocobos are one of the things that made random battles harder, though. Swarms of them Choco Curing = longer battles.

Is there a way to slow down the birthrate of monsters, though? That would make some of the rarer "species's" poach drops more special.

[Asmo X]

Good point about trying to catch up to Chocobos. And I totally forgot about Ninjas Throw. Geez.

At any rate, I posted the accessory list in the weapons/items thread with updates to a few entries. There IS one item with mv+2, but see what you think anyway. I was trying to go for balance and 0 redundancy.

[VincentCraven]

I don't see why you'd be worried about needing to have longer battles if that was the problem with the move gap. In chapter1, strong monsters w/o the ability to heal will still prove a problem, since you only have a limited amount of money and a small amount of MP during that time.

Slowing down monster birthrate is good, but it probably would just make players walk on the world map longer.

[VincentCraven]

I've been thinking about trying to balance all the classes. If you think some class doesn't have enough love, let me know:

Code Select Expand

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Squire      10   100   13   075   100   100   50   100   50   080   3   3   05
Equip: ALL

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Knight      09   150   15   070   100   100   35   120   60   075   3   3   10
Equip: Sword, KnSword, Axe, Shield, Helmet, Armor, [Shoes, Gauntlet, Ring, Mantle]

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Archer      10   100   16   050   085   115   40   110   60   060   3   4   10
Equip: Crossbow, Longbow, Hat, Clothes, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Concentrate

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Monk        09   150   13   080   100   110   40   120   55   090   3   4   20
Equip: Clothes, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Martial Arts

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Thief       10   090   16   050   075   125   45   100   60   060   4   4   25
Equip: Knife, NjSword, Hat, Clothes, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Geomancer   10   110   11   095   100   100   45   110   50   105   4   3   10
Equip: Sword, Axe, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Move on Lava, Half Earth damage

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Lancer      10   120   16   050   090   110   40   110   60   060   3   4   15
Equip: Spear, Helmet, Armor, [Shoes, Gauntlet, Ring, Mantle]
Innate: Ignore Height

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Samurai     10   075   13   090   100   100   45   125   50   100   3   3   20
Equip: Katana, Helmet, Armor, Robe, [Shoes, Gauntlet, Ring, Mantle]
Innate: Two Hands

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Ninja       12   070   16   050   080   120   50   100   60   075   4   4   30
Equip: NjSword, Flail, Hat, Clothes, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Two Swords



........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Chemist     11   080   12   075   100   100   60   075   50   090   4   3   05
Equip: Knife, Gun, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Throw Item, Maintenance

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Priest      10   090   10   120   100   110   50   090   45   105   3   3   05
Equip: Staff, Flail, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Wizard      12   075   09   120   100   100   60   070   40   130   3   3   05
Equip: Rod, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Oracle      11   080   10   110   100   100   50   090   45   110   3   3   15
Equip: Staff, Book, Stick, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Move in Water, Any Weather

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Time Mage   12   075   10   120   100   100   65   050   42   115   1   1   05
Equip: Staff, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Teleport

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Blue Mage   10   100   11   095   100   100   50   090   42   110   3   3   10
Equip: Sword, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Monster Skill, Train

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Summoner    13   070   07   150   100   090   70   050   40   120   3   3   05
Equip: Rod, Staff, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Red Mage    10   105   11   105   100   100   48   095   48   100   3   3   10
Equip: Sword, Rod, Staff, Helmet, Armor, Robe, [Shoes, Gauntlet, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Innate: Short Charge



.......    HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Bard        13   075   11   095   100   100   55   075   50   115   4   4   05
Equip: Harp, Hat, Clothes, Robe, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Immune: Silence

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Dancer      13   080   14   070   100   100   50   110   50   090   4   4   05
Equip: Cloth, Hat, Clothes, [Shoes, Ring, Armlet, Mantle]
Immune: Don't Move

........   HPC...HPM...MPC..MPM...SpC...SpM...PAC..PAM...MAC..MAM.Mov..Jum..CEv
Mime        06   200   20   050   100   120   35   120   40   115   4   4   05
Equip: (nothing)
Innate: Concentrate, Martial Arts, Monster Skill
Immune: Berserk, Don't Act

Skillsets will be posted later and item stats may be changed, so not everything about the classes is here.

[karsten]

looks good, i'm still wondering on squire having just 3 move... also i think that time mage should have at least 2 move... you can't have them moving 4 squares at 25% chance... and 2 at 50%...

[VincentCraven]

Well, according to the BMG it's -10% for each square out of range. That means 2 = 90%, 4 = 70% though I haven't tested it.

[Austin]

I think teleport works by every square out of your move range= -10%, so 4 spaces is still 70%. If I remember correctly that is.

Edit: You ninja'd me!

Also I noticed archer was missing innate concentrate. I hope you aren't taking it off them, it made the game a lot more challenging/better.
And I think chemists are okay w/o innate maintenence, knights should be entitled to beat their guns off them if they want to.

[VincentCraven]

Really? Innate Concentrate?

Karsten, double-check the list and see if you have any problems with it. I haven't changed anything since the last time you saw it, but knowing that Teleport only removes 10% each square is 1 Move still a problem? And if Squire can use every item, is losing 1 Move a problem?

Oh, and should Archer have Concentrate or Chemist have Maintenance? No one else has said anything, so I think everything else is fine.

[Austin]

Really? Innate Concentrate?

You didn't like it? I thought it did a lot of good for the archer class, seeing as I actually bothered to use one for some fights. Plus, now that squires get bows AND armor who in their right mind is going to use one unless it has some kind of perk?

[VincentCraven]

Archers are faster and stronger...

[Austin]

Would it be enough for people to pick the speed and attack boost over the hp boost you could get from wearing armor though? If so then that's fine, but if not I think they should keep concentrate so they can have that advantage over the squire.

[Prinygod]

Should anyone get MgDef Up or Def Up? Probably not. There was a problem with Secret Hunt, someone please refresh my memory. I think Monk may be okay with 2nd best HP (excluding the soft and squishy Mimes) unless we jack up HP bonuses for armor real high.

I believe the problem you are referring to is the fact that the poaching shops do not work unless you have secret hunt equipped, in other words the shop owner will not talk to you if you only have innate secret hunt.

Which reminds me, perhaps we should make Chocobo appear later so that you will be equipped (with Boco) to take them down?

Chocobos are one of the things that made random battles harder, though. Swarms of them Choco Curing = longer battles.

Is there a way to slow down the birthrate of monsters, though? That would make some of the rarer "species's" poach drops more special.

I disagree, if anything births should be more common because i find nothing more annoying than wasting 30 min. moving between 2 blue dots because i want some stronger monsters.

[gomtuu]

I believe the problem you are referring to is the fact that the poaching shops do not work unless you have secret hunt equipped, in other words the shop owner will not talk to you if you only have innate secret hunt.

Did they change that for the PSP version, then? Luso has innate Poach, and I don't remember having to equip it to get the shops to work. It has been a while, though.

-Don

[karsten]

so:

Squire - can equip everything
Chemist - equip: Robe
Knight - equip: Axe, Spear; cannot equip Robe
Archer - Concentrate
Priest - equip: Flail
Time Mage - Teleport
Thief - equip: Ninja Sword
Red Mage - Short Charge; equip: Sword, Rod, Staff, Shield, Robe, Armor, Helmet...
Oracle - Move in Water, Any Weather
Geomancer - Move on Lava, Half: Earth
Lancer - Ignore Height, cannot equip Shield, Robe
Samurai - Two Hands
Ninja - cannot equip Knife
Blue Mage - Monster Talk, Monster Skill; equip: Sword, Hat, Clothes, Robe...
Bard - immune: Silence, equip: Robe

all is fine by me with the innates. i'm still questioning mysefla bout squires using guns too, but beside that everything's cool.

[trickstardude7]

hm I really don't like the idea of guns or even knight swords on squires because those weapons are the perks of having "EQUIP GUNS" support abillity and changing your job to knight to use a "KNIGHTS" sword

[Austin]

I'm starting to wonder if maybe it would be a good idea to let squires only wear clothes. After all they are getting to wear perfumes right? A squire with a knight sword or gun, some armor, and chantage would tear the enemies up. Or maybe it would be better to only let them equip all close range weapons. That would make it fine for them to have armor, perfume and such, plus archers wouldn't have any competition so they wouldn't need something like innate concentrate to balance things out.

[VincentCraven]

So karsten, you prefer the original list of innates as opposed to the newer list?

I just need to know so that we can finalize the attributes of each class. If there is something you are still debating we can change it later.

Actually, I'll just add Concentrate back, but I still strongly believe Squire should be able to equip EVERYTHING.
If anything, I'd lower their stats more.

[NeedsMoreNoise]

If Red Mage is taking the place of Calculator, don't you think that's less of a 'reward-class' (that is, Math Skill is the result of grinding on several Mage classes, and emcompasses/improves on the skills already learned)? Being able to equip swords is nice, but it'll never be nearly as unique as the Calculator was. Blue Magic, when you think about it, is pretty much the same set of skills are Red. Both have fire/ice/lightning/healing skills, both equip swords, etc.

I'm not saying Red Mage wouldn't be a good class, but I'm just not sure how well it'd replace Calculator.

[Sen]

I think Red Mage would replace mediator and Blue Mage will replace Calculator.