Final Fantasy Hacktics

General => Archives => Topic started by: Argg0 on December 02, 2007, 02:47:02 pm

Title: Making AI Better - Indirectly
Post by: Argg0 on December 02, 2007, 02:47:02 pm
So, as we all know, AI doesn't usually buy Phoenix Down.

They usually get Potion and Antidote/Eye Drop. Why?

Most enemies have level 1 Chemist (unless they are mages, thus, having lvl 2). So they only have 100-199 Jp. They ALWAYS buy potion, so that leaves us with 70-179 Jp.

With that Jp, sometimes they won't even have Jp to buy PD... and will always be able to buy Antidote.

This is just one example of my stuffs that AI does.

So, for a start:
Decrese PD Jp cost to 50 (yes 50) and increase Antidote/Eye Drop to 120. This will make enemies, most likely, have it a lot more (untested)... and 40 Jp difference won't effect us at all.

There might have others skills like that, so we could take a look...

So, what you guys think?
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Post by: huthutchuck on December 02, 2007, 03:30:23 pm
Fine by me, who uses eyedrop?
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Post by: VincentCraven on December 02, 2007, 03:49:21 pm
Quote from: "huthutchuck"Fine by me, who uses eyedrop?

Delita used one on me when I got struck by Blind Knife...

But yeah, I've sorta corrected for this already by making Phoenix Down 70JP. I think I may have also decreased some of the other skills too, but now if a unit has the bare minimum, he can still get both PD and Potion. An alternative would be to make Eyedrop and Antidote 0JP, considering they are next to useless.

Argg0: Mages need lv3 chemist in this version. I hope that's not a problem for you...
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Post by: Argg0 on December 02, 2007, 08:06:55 pm
Yeah, dropping they to 0 would work too.

And why would lvl 3 chemist be a problem for me?
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Post by: VincentCraven on December 02, 2007, 08:37:06 pm
It shouldn't, I just established the +1JLv a while ago and wanted to remind you in an inoffensive way.
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Post by: Christopher Robin on December 03, 2007, 12:23:04 am
Couldn't you just change the learn percentage?  It seems like that would be easier.
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Post by: VincentCraven on December 03, 2007, 05:53:28 am
Eh? Chance to learn skills by picking up crystal applies to chance to for enemies to buy skills?
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Post by: Christopher Robin on December 03, 2007, 07:05:58 am
I'm pretty sure.  And it's also the blue magic percent, because Ultima is set to 100%.
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Post by: VincentCraven on December 03, 2007, 07:19:21 am
Your logic does make sense, which is always a good sign. I'll test it next time I'm working on it.
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Post by: Prinygod on December 03, 2007, 08:38:24 am
I don't think it is, other wise bm in chap 1 could have level 4 spells and such. Also wouldn't story characters would some times come with there abilities unlearned.
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Post by: VincentCraven on December 03, 2007, 09:21:10 am
Have you checked the percentages? Skills like Night Sword are 100%, so they would always have that skill learned. Skills like Potion are 100%, so units always learn that. Skills like Fire4 are 25%, cost a lot of JP, and are rarely learned.
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Post by: Prinygod on December 03, 2007, 11:30:42 am
As many times a i played the game i would think that would have seen fire4 in chap 1 at 25%. I wasn't referring to the skills that had 100%. What about Izlude's jump? He always has learned level8 and vert 8. I dont see how jp cost has anything to do with this particular theory but these 2 skills are also expensive
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Post by: ronan on December 03, 2007, 01:33:59 pm
If I guess correctly , this is because :
- generics need enough JP in order to be able to learn a skill
- Izlude is not a generic, his skills are fixed
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Post by: VincentCraven on December 04, 2007, 12:40:09 am
Yeah, certain skills, like Wish, are learned without costing JP. Replacing Wish with Invitation causes Ramza to learn Invitation without losing his 100JP. A similar event probably causes Izlude to learn the skills in the Level Jump 8 and Vertical Jump 8 slots.

And btw, if the generic character doesn't have enough JP to learn the skill, even if it chooses to by random chance, there isn't enough JP for it to happen anyway. None of the Wizards in Chapter1 use Fire4 because none of them have a high enough Job Level (JP to use). I am saying that the amount of JP a character has is allocated by this theory, I already know for a fact that generic enemies need the JP to learn the skills. Higher JLv = more skills.
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Post by: Christopher Robin on December 04, 2007, 05:50:08 am
Izlude always has Level 8 Jump because his is NOT using the Lancer skillset.  He's using a special Jump skillset containing ONLY the two level 8 skills.  Also, Jump skills are set to 50%, and with no other skills to learn... anyways, I've noticed that secondary skillsets don't work the same.  Secondary skills, such as Izlude's Jump are set in the Battle Events, so they might automatically have all those skills.  Wiegraf has a Punch Art skill, and it isn't the full Monk skillset, either, so I think this is true.

I've heard that when learning skills, the AI starts from the top.  So for say, Wizard the skill list goes:

Fire
Fire 2
Fire 3
Fire 4

It will try to learn Fire first at 90%, Fire 2 at 65%, Fire 3 at 40% and Fire 4 at 30%.

In other words, while it COULD learn Fire 4 in chapter one, it's really unlikely.  First it would have to have enough JP, which is 850... which is Job Level 5.  Second, it would have to not spend that JP on another skill, which means it would have to fail the 90% chance to learn Fire, and fail to learn Fire 2 and 3 first.  I've seen a Wizard with say, Fire 2 but not Fire before, but going down the list it because increasingly unlikely this sort of thing will happen.
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Post by: VincentCraven on December 04, 2007, 06:34:16 am
Chris, you are right: I set Night Sword to 0% and Gafgarion did not learn Night Sword.
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Post by: Kourama on December 04, 2007, 03:26:55 pm
To make the AI somewhat better you can always put take off "rare" off of some of the equipment. Sure then you'll have a chance to steal rarer items but then enemies are more likely to have that item equipped.

In my "version" of FFT I changed Cherce a little bit and in the first chapter when fighting Miluda both White Mages have Cherce equipped.
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Post by: VincentCraven on December 04, 2007, 08:15:15 pm
o_O Wait, you did give them Maintenance, right? Or are you allowing yourself to obtain Cherche in Chapter 1? I guess if it's really difficult to steal off them and stay alive, there is no problem, but....

Wait a minute, how did you change Cherche? Auto-Float and Auto-Reflect is quite useful to have access to before even reaching Chapter2 (especially if you haven't scaled the mages so that they aren't so powerful in the early game).

As for rare items, I let (am letting?) a few slide into the hands of high level enemies as well.
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Post by: Kuraudo Sutoraifu on December 04, 2007, 09:59:17 pm
I gonna hop down this rabbity trail.  I like the idea of giving people like Miluda, who have no unique skillset, something to make them special.  Giving them a special item and maintenance would be kewls.
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Post by: Kourama on December 04, 2007, 11:50:51 pm
I didn't give them Maintenance and wasn't really thinking about obtaining Cherche in Chapter 1. Its just recently that I've been trying out modifying FFT so Cherche was a suprise to me. And yes even if I tried to learn thief moves I boosted weapons so enemies and allies are much stronger. Miluda can 1 hit KO some of my members.

Anyway the Cherche thing pretty much taught me making an item "unrare" makes it appear in random battles and the enemy level refers to when they can randomly have it and what level Ninjas can throw it.

As for changing Cherche I have to check exactly what changes I made but it certainly wasn't enough to make it a rare item.
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Post by: Kourama on December 20, 2007, 01:51:39 am
Well I've messed around and made my own patch. So far biggest change that has made the game harder has been putting all story battle characters the same level as I am.

Add on to that, I've boosted all the weapons, and I've given every generic job innate abilities. Knights are huge pain since I let them equip spears, they have defense up and concentrate.

I've also added status changes to many of the monsters attacks as well as changed formulas. All the "soul" attacks have a chance of doing a status change.

Thunder Soul - Don't Act
Wind Soul - Confuse
Aqua Soul - Frog
Ice Soul - Sleep

I've also changed the formula for the ghost moves and all the "touch" moves are 100% accurate.

Archers have also been changed. Bows do more damage and have greater range, they have innate concentrate and I did away with Charge. Instead now they have Leg Aim, Arm Aim, Seal Evil and Yell.

Mustadio was changed so that he has the same abilities as before but now he has all the steal abilities as well with a speed boost (this idea is pretty much from Balthier in the PSP Version.)

Theres several other changes but the game is much harder at least for me it is. Random battles can still be on the easier side but I need to do a lot more tweaking to make everything better.

By the way I've run into glitched sprites in my story battles on my version yet when I check my spreadsheet there doesn't seem to be anything wrong. Any idea what the problem might be?
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Post by: VincentCraven on December 20, 2007, 04:48:09 pm
Did you move around characters? That alone made a huge problem for me in the intro battle (glitch-wise). Also, any character that makes a 'unique' motion during a story battle event (turn head to side, sweeping motion with hand, etc.) will be kinda glitchy if his class is changed.
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Post by: Xifanie on December 20, 2007, 06:30:57 pm
Unless that sprite has the exact same palette. :/
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Post by: Kourama on December 21, 2007, 08:31:15 am
I didn't change any character positions just some jobs and I made sure not to change jobs for any character that had an extra motion.

Although I did change the knight in the fight you get Agrias back in to a bard and when he whistled he changed back to knight to do it.

The problems I was having was in that battle I put Mustadio in and his sprite was glitched although his character still worked exactly the way it was supposed to.

Some battles also have some of the characters glitched even with no changes yet they still work. The wierdest thing has to be when some battles had a crystal instead of a character, although when that happened I still hadn't tried adjusting anything in story battles.
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Post by: VincentCraven on December 24, 2007, 07:34:55 pm
Dang, that doesn't sound good. Sounds like I've got more problems yet to come. Nevertheless, I'm sure there is a logical solution to the problems. If you want, you could send me all the stuff you added to your patch and I will look at it sometime later. I really don't know offhand what could cause such problems.
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Post by: karsten on December 27, 2007, 05:00:43 am
looks like in the patching you killed some random bytes...
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Post by: Kourama on January 02, 2008, 12:56:41 pm
Well I've been busy with RL with the holidays. Also now that I have melonhead's new program I've kind of given up on the PSX version but I can still send you my patch if you want maybe it can help you answer some questions. Let me know.
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Post by: Xifanie on January 02, 2008, 03:45:17 pm
RL?
RuneLancer?
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Post by: Kourama on January 02, 2008, 04:53:02 pm
lol Real Life
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Post by: Xifanie on January 02, 2008, 06:06:13 pm
XD It's just that I always saw irl and not RL. Plus I know a guy from another forum that is a SNES romhacker & a coder that wants to become a barman and he uses the nick RuneLancer or simply RL.

Oh well, I'll know next time. :wink:
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Post by: Kourama on January 02, 2008, 08:54:08 pm
I'm so used to putting RL for real life from playing FFXI.
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Post by: VincentCraven on January 02, 2008, 09:09:56 pm
Nah, don't bother if you are done with it.
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Post by: Kourama on January 07, 2008, 09:54:41 pm
Summary of general way of making enemies stronger

Monsters - Higher HP, Possibly other higher stats depending on the monster, Have most monsters have 2-3 skills normally

Humans Characters - Equal or Higher levels than your strongest character, Higher Job levels, Random Equipment/Abilities based on level of strongest character, more battles with enemies with the more "powerful" jobs, take "rare" status off of more items

As for bosses I think that has to be a more detailed/specialized discussion.

Does anyone know if Samurais can only use Masamune and Chirijiaden abilities if both of the weapons aren't "rare"?
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Post by: Xifanie on January 07, 2008, 11:09:42 pm
Enemies have an infinite supply of every item... (just think of ninjas throwing Chaos Blades). They just don't have enough JP to learn those.

I think I did see a samurai use Masamune but I'm not sure...