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Thread for people to complain about the Master Guide

Started by FFMaster, January 03, 2011, 05:03:43 pm

FFMaster

Firstly, I don't want people to post in the Master Guide at all to keep it as clean as possible, compared to say, the 1.3 Master Guide.

If anyone sees problems on it, or if some information is missing, then please tell me. Is it too early to put in a Credits section?

Finally, I need a team building guide, and I don't feel like I would be the right person to do this. If possible, I would want it so that a newer person to Arena can read it. If someone can do this, it would be great.
  • Modding version: Other/Unknown
☢ CAUTION CAUTION ☢ CAUTION CAUTION ☢

CT5Holy

It'd be nice to show whether AUP or MAUP boosts damage for the new skills (like how Shuriken was boosted by MAUP - confusing!).

I would like to try and write a team building guide, but other people are welcome to write their own, if they want.
Winner of the 1st FFT 1.3 AI Tourney

The Damned

January 03, 2011, 09:24:25 pm #2 Last Edit: January 04, 2011, 01:01:46 am by The Damned
(First and foremost, thanks for adding the Fury explanation and excising Concentrate from the Archer list, FFM.)

What a team building guide even entail, though? I'm asking this because a stringent one kind of gives people the ideal that they're ideas are automatically limited rather than testing them out and it being without a somewhat stable format would be kind of pointless.

The best thing I could think of be to inform people what the AI prioritizes and how to go from there.  That may just be me, though.

For the record, I also don't think that the AUP and MAUP thing is necessary since the formulas are already there.

As for what I think needs to be added, they should probably be a line under Items to tell/remind (newer) people that Longbows are the only Indirect weapons. Similarly, you might want to mark what physical techniques, if any, are Indirect. Other than that (and realizing that Kikuichimoji has no room to say that it's Linear), all I'm seeing "problem"-wise are typo-related or arguable changes about abilities.

EDIT: Oh, and the Status Effect part is down now. (Also, Crystal was misspelled the first time around.)

EDIT II: As something of a compromise to what CT5Holy wanted, it would probably benefit a bit to say which weapons benefit from Attack UP/are physical and which ones benefit from Magic Attack UP/are magical for those are less aware or are forgetful or are unsure. I know that one person, at least, accidentally ended up using Two Swords Flails with PA Save, which effectively was a waste of a reaction slot.

Similarly, it would be beneficial to put a few reminders about Jump's odd qualities, such as not being affected by Martial Arts despite being physical and being elementally neutral regardless of the weapons that's used (unless you fixed that with the sword skill elemental carryover thing). That's all I can think of at present.
"Sorrow cannot be abolished. It is meaningless to try." - FFX's Yunalesca

"Good and evil are relative, but being a dick cannot be allowed." - Oglaf's Thaumaturge in "The Abyss"

"Well, see, the real magic isn't believing in yourself. The real magic is manipulating people by telling them to believe in themselves. The more you believe, the less you check facts."  - Oglaf's Vanka in "Conviction"

FFMaster

Yes, I think the best idea for a guide would be to talk about what the AI prioritises. I would maybe also include a few strong strategies that the team builder should watch out for when building teams.

As for Shuriken, I'm trying to fix that issue, and hopefully, it will be AUP based and P-EV next version.

Fixed status tables and added line about Longbows being indirect. Can someone give me all the Weapon Formulae as well? May as well put them all there, so people don't have to look at the Master Guide so much.
  • Modding version: Other/Unknown
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The Damned

January 04, 2011, 01:14:21 am #4 Last Edit: January 04, 2011, 01:15:42 am by The Damned
Whoops, I edited that above post before I saw were you posting here.

Anyway, here are the (original) weapon formulas--I'm not sure what you changed outside of taking the Brave/Fury out of Katana and Knight Swords (?) and making Flails WP*WP:


  • DAGGERS: [(PA + Sp) / 2] * WP

  • NINJA SWORDS: [(PA + Sp) / 2] * WP

  • SWORDS: PA * WP

  • KNIGHT SWORDS: [PA * Br/100] * WP

  • KATANA: [PA * Br/100] * WP

  • AXES: WP * F | F = (1..PA)

  • RODS: PA * WP

  • STAVES: MA * WP

  • HAMMERS: WP * F | F = (1..PA)

  • GUNS, PHYSICAL: WP * WP

  • GUNS, MAGICAL: [CFa/100 * TFa/100 * Q * WP]; Q = 14 : 60% of the time; Q = 18 : 30% of the time; Q = 24 : 10% of the time; Works as a magic spell with MA = WP

  • CROSSBOWS: PA * WP

  • LONGBOWS: [(PA + Sp) / 2] * WP

  • INSTRUMENTS: [(PA + MA) / 2] * WP

  • DICTIONARIES: [(PA + MA) / 2] * WP

  • SPEARS: PA * WP

  • STICKS: MA * WP

  • BAGS: F * WP | F = (1..PA)

  • CLOTHS: [(PA + MA) / 2] * WP




For the record, using/showing the formula for weapons kills two birds with one stone with regards to that physical/AUP and/or magical/MAUP weapon thing I just edited in as a question.

As always, thanks for the quick work.
"Sorrow cannot be abolished. It is meaningless to try." - FFX's Yunalesca

"Good and evil are relative, but being a dick cannot be allowed." - Oglaf's Thaumaturge in "The Abyss"

"Well, see, the real magic isn't believing in yourself. The real magic is manipulating people by telling them to believe in themselves. The more you believe, the less you check facts."  - Oglaf's Vanka in "Conviction"

FFMaster

Added a bit on unit action priorities in the Base Mechanics.
  • Modding version: Other/Unknown
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The Damned

I think I might of forgotten something since I didn't want to double post, but the one I did want to ask you is it would be possible to say which healing effects still heal the Undead and which healing effects hurt them. You know, stuff like Chakra & Life Song vs. White Magic & Item.

Thanks regardless.
"Sorrow cannot be abolished. It is meaningless to try." - FFX's Yunalesca

"Good and evil are relative, but being a dick cannot be allowed." - Oglaf's Thaumaturge in "The Abyss"

"Well, see, the real magic isn't believing in yourself. The real magic is manipulating people by telling them to believe in themselves. The more you believe, the less you check facts."  - Oglaf's Vanka in "Conviction"

LordBobBree

The damage formulas for Meiton, Fuuton, and Suiton seem to be incorrect.

Soleil

This isn't a complaint, but a question. I'm thinking I should post it here, because I don't want to create an entire thread for one single question.

What are the rules for items in your inventory? I'm rather new to this, but say I had a Ninja with Throw, what items could I have in the inventory for him to Throw?

Eternal

Well, Ninja don't have throw anymore, but each player has infinite amounts of items to use.
  • Modding version: PSX & WotL
"You, no less human than we? Ha! Now there's a beastly thought. You've been less than we from the moment your baseborn father fell upon your mother in whatever gutter saw you sired! You've been chattel since you came into the world drenched in common blood!"
  • Discord username: eternal248#1817

Soleil

Thank you! I didn't know about Ninja's losing throw, guess I have a lot to learn. New fangled patches are a strain on my poor mind.
Cheers man.

Eternal

Haha, it can be a lot at first. Check the Arena Master Guide to get acquainted with the new changes. :)
  • Modding version: PSX & WotL
"You, no less human than we? Ha! Now there's a beastly thought. You've been less than we from the moment your baseborn father fell upon your mother in whatever gutter saw you sired! You've been chattel since you came into the world drenched in common blood!"
  • Discord username: eternal248#1817

Barren

And Welcome to FFH Soleil where all your dreams come true!
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You dare cross blades with me?

Soleil

Thanks to both of you for the warm welcomes! I've been playing quite a lot of FFT on my Playstation recently, just found this whole community of fans, I had no idea it had a following like this.

I've been reading lots of tutorials and watching lots of videos, but it's yet to sink in if you know what I mean. Who knows, maybe I'll be able to participate in the next season!

Eternal

Even if your team isn't amazing, it's still the process of making one that's fun. Don't be afraid to try it out! Barren here records test matches, so you can see how to improve your team over time.
  • Modding version: PSX & WotL
"You, no less human than we? Ha! Now there's a beastly thought. You've been less than we from the moment your baseborn father fell upon your mother in whatever gutter saw you sired! You've been chattel since you came into the world drenched in common blood!"
  • Discord username: eternal248#1817

Reks

Heh... Just do what I did: throw a team together, request some matches, and change accordingly. Works better than you'd think, and you can always ask for help if you think you'll need it!

And for the Master Guide, can't quite think of anything wrong with it atm.
  • Modding version: Other/Unknown
  • Discord username: Reks#0128

Soleil

Yeah, you all have great point. I'm still downloading Excel (I own it, but never bothered to install it), but then I'll start messing around ASAP. While it's loading I've been watching a bucketload of recorded matches, so I've got a strategy or two in mind. I'm also a force to be reckoned with when it comes to vanilla, so hopefully those skills will transfer over.

Avalanche

i think plus the magic attack up and attack up. It would be nice to see what abilities and weapons are actualy faith or brave (or fury) bases.

Eternal

I'm fairly sure everything that uses the Attack command uses Fury, regardless of what weapon type it is.
  • Modding version: PSX & WotL
"You, no less human than we? Ha! Now there's a beastly thought. You've been less than we from the moment your baseborn father fell upon your mother in whatever gutter saw you sired! You've been chattel since you came into the world drenched in common blood!"
  • Discord username: eternal248#1817

Avalanche

I had magic-guns in mind but i think their formula is added.But  is grand cross fury based?