Stacking Reaction Abilities

[formerdeathcorps]

I'm reviving a really old topic, but I figured this out.

1) Innates override set counters.

2) Any combination of innates work.  The problem some of you were having with weapon guard or abandon actually was because some of you were having innate weapon guard/abandon + any reaction ability that was set (from the equip change screen), but this would be true if your innate ability was blade grasp or counter as well.

3)

For example, if I have these innates in this priority order

Brave 100
innate4: Faith Up
innate3: MA Save
innate2: PA Save
innate1: SP Save

This would mean Faith Up proc 100% of the time, the rest never. But I am curious if anyone was able to test this and made sure that no MA/PA/SP are gained in the status screen, even though the reaction animation won't be shown explicitly.

Impossible unless the attack was physical (where Faith/MA UP would be nullified).


4)

Finally by overriding the reaction slot with an innate reaction, do you mean by completely disregarding the reaction in the reaction slot, rather than having it being a lower priority reaction?

For example,

Brave 100
innate4: Counter Magic
reaction slot: Blade Grasp

The character is being hit by a physical normal attack. Will Blade Grasp ever trigger?

No.

5) ASM fix for the override problem.
RAM 0x5B580 (OPEN.LZW, I think?)
00000000

[Vanya]

What's the ROM address?

[formerdeathcorps]

SCUS_9291
0x4BD80
00000000

[reyhan37]

I'm reviving a really old topic, but I figured this out.

1) Innates override set counters.

2) Any combination of innates work.  The problem some of you were having with weapon guard or abandon actually was because some of you were having innate weapon guard/abandon + any reaction ability that was set (from the equip change screen), but this would be true if your innate ability was blade grasp or counter as well.

3) Impossible unless the attack was physical (where Faith/MA UP would be nullified).


4)No.

5) ASM fix for the override problem.
RAM 0x5B580 (OPEN.LZW, I think?)
00000000

I know this is an old topic but I figured it was better to reply to this than just have someone refer me back to this thread.

For question 4, you gave a one-word answer "No." Is that "no" to the initial question? Or "no" to the example?

Here's my scenario:

Brave 94
Weapon Ev. 30%
Innate: Weapon Guard
Reaction (equipped in-game): Blade Grasp

My understanding is that if this character is attacked with a physical attack (no Concentrate),

• There's a 30% chance of weapon guard


• if weapon guard fails, a 94% chance of blade grasp

Is my understanding correct?

A thorough explanation would benefit all who are asking about Innate.

[Emmy]

Some innate reaction abilities don't seem to stack in the order that I'd like them to.  Counter and Counter Magic, for example, seem to be incompatible (Counter will trigger, Counter magic will not, regardless of the order I place them in).  Critical Quick works as intended when stacked with several abilities, but not when stacked with Speed Save (again, regardless of the order).  Some also will stack in one order always, regardless of the order I place them in (such as Brave up always stacking over Regenerator, but otherwise will work as intended.)  Anyone know why? 

**EDIT**  Found a typo in your hack.  It's 0x5b850, not 0x5b580.  Fixed version:

spoiler

  <Patch name="Fixed override problem">
    <Description>Can use additional reactions in entd</Description>
    <Location file="SCUS_942_21" offset="4C050">
      00000000
    </Location>
  </Patch>

[mcabel]

I tried using abilities that seemed unrelated or triggered by different things like:

Ability slot: Vanish (Brave 90)
innate4: Treasure Hunter
innate3: Poach
innate2: Catch
innate1:

Yet, Vanish from the equipped ability slot never activates...

+Is there an order I could use so Vanish gets a chance?
+ what would the ASM hack mentioned would accomplish?
  -Can this be changed/used/converted to a CWcheat to use in WotL/PSP?

[Emmy]

The ASM hack allows you to equip a reaction ability if you  have innate reactions.  Otherwise the innate ones will completely override it.  I have no clue what the code for it is on Wotl.

Also figured out what causes some abilities to not stack right with each other.  It's not the triggers, it's the way the game organizes them.  Anything within the same group here is incompatible with each other (in the sense that, if the game checks and you have one of the abilities on the list, it won't go back to the same list).  List 1 always outprioritizes list 2, and list 2 always outprioritizes list 3.

List 1:
Sunken State, Caution, Dragon Spirit, Brave Up, Face Up, Counter Tackle, Counter Flood, Absorb Used MP, Counter, Counter Magic
List 2:
MP Switch, Distribute, Damage Split
List 3:
PA Save, MA Save, Speed Save, Regenerator, HP Restore, MP Restore, Critical Quick, Meatbone Slash, Gilgame Heart, Auto Potion

So for example, you can have a unit that has Dragon Spirit, Damage Split, Speed Save.  Assuming all 3 are relevant, it'll check Dragon Spirit first regardless of what order you put them in on the innates list.  If it fails, the check for Damage Split is next.  A unit with 2 abilities from the same list will always use whatever is listed first, and will ignore the next one.  So for example, a unit with both Counter and Counter Magic will behave identical to a unit that only has Counter, since that's listed first on the same list.

[katsumottojp]

reliving this for one reason

i read here that if u have weapon guard, abandon and blade grasp, blade graps gets useless..., is that right? What about guard+abandon? do they stack if innate?

Also...., o got a celia with Hamedo on Innate, however Hamedo is appearing on the reaction Slot...., and if i take it out, i cant bring it back..., how does that work?

Thanks in advance ^^

[Kaijyuu]

I know guard+abadon works just fine. In fact I'm pretty sure they work with blade grasp too. Weapon Guard and Abandon are essentially passive support abilities (that merely modify your stats), while blade grasp is more of an actual reaction ability.

In the base game, it takes innates and literally copy/pastes them into the reaction slot, overwriting it. They did this entirely become of monsters (reactions in the passive slots do NOT show up in-battle along with predicted damage and success rates, only reactions in the reaction slot do). Monsters counter a lot (higher than their brave would imply) because they have two counters equipped.

There are some hacks higher in this thread that will remove the copy/pasting, though it'll have the downside of monster counters not show in battle as their reaction.

[katsumottojp]

hmmm i see! Thanks for the clarifications! , i will mess around with it again and see how it turns out!