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Monster Changes in Mercenaries (Assistance much appreciated)

Started by LastingDawn, September 20, 2009, 01:11:06 am

Draivyn

I'm not sure about what is possible in a hack, but what about a Counter: Berserk for the minotaur class of monsters. After all in mythology most the minotaur seems rather angry and berserkerish, and maybe some axe dependent skills maybe? Keeping the earth theme that they tend to have. Also considering you want to make equipment rarer so I doubt the player can just stack earth clothes on Ramza and Rad and just steamroll over the new and improved axe wielding maniacs.

LastingDawn

It's a thematic means, to make each piece of equipment truly seem to be worth its price. Part of Mercenaries theme is the feeling of Never having enough money and scraping by with hardly any thing. Believe me, it deals nothing with Steal itself being immoral.

As for Counter:Berserk... it would have to replace Regenerator. Which is something I'm not ready to separate from the player. I'll likely just end up giving him Fury Up and PA Save.
"Moment's anger can revert to joy,
sadness can be turned to delight.
A nation destroyed cannot be restored,
the dead brought back to life."

Art of War

Beta & Gretchen Forever!!!!

philsov

Posting this for now, I'll update here shortly.  Stars as for proposed blue mage skills.

Chocobo - These little warkables are fast and mobile, able to pick off weakened units and even cure allies of both HP and MP.
Equips: None
R/S/M: Counter, Ignore Height
Immunities: Don't Move, Slow, Stop
Elements: Neutral to all
Abilities:
Attack - standard PA * PA*Br/100
*Choco Cure - self-aoe 1 at MA*X
Choco Ball - PA * PA/2 damage, evadeable.  4 range, 0 AoE.
Choco Vitalize - single target MP restoration at MA*X.  

Goblin - Grunts of the monster world, specializing in melee-range combat.
Equips:  Hat, Clothing, Shoes, Rings, and Armlets
R/S/M:  ????
Immunities: They have accessories for status immunity.
Elements:  Weak to ice.  Absorb earth.  Half darkness.
Abilities:
Attack
Goblin Punch - Deals damage in HP difference, success = PA+X.  melee range, single target.
*Eye Gouge - Inflicts darkness and confusion at PA+X.  melee range, single target.
Bloodthirst - Drains target of 33% HP, at MA+X.  melee range, single target (think Mutilate, only weaker)

Bomb - Fire-based monsters, able to kamikaze when in peril.  
Equips:  Helmets and Hats
R/S/M: Critical quick, float
Immunities:  Poison, Frog, Petrify, Undead
Elements: absorb fire, half ice, weak water, cancel earth
Abilities:
Attack
Self Destruct - complete with a 100% chance to inflict Addle
*Small Bomb - 3 range, 1 AoE at 2 vert.  MA*X damage, fire elemental.
Ignite - 4 range, 1 AoE at 1 vert.  Faiths*(MA+X) chance to inflict haste.

Panther - 4-legged and fierce with amazing regeneration capabilities.
Equips: None
R/S/M: ???? + Move HP Up
Immunities: Frog, Death Sentence
Elements: Weak earth, half lightning
Abilities:
Attack
Poison Claw - 4 range, success = MA+X (high)
Lick Wounds - 100% Self heal
*Blaster - 2 range, success = MA+X.  Inflicts either stop, petrify, or darkness

Mindflayer - Squid-faced mage types
Equips:  Robes, Staves, Rings, and Cloaks
R/S/M
Immunities:
Elements: Weak lightning, absorb water, ha;f fire+ice.
Abilities:
Attack
Mind Blast - 3 range with 1 aoe + 1 vert.  MA+X chance to inflict either confusion or berserk


Skeleton
Swords, Shields, and even Bec De Corbins, their protective garb is Armor, Armguards and Cloaks

Ghoul
Robes

Flotiball

Juravis

Uribo

Woodman
Rings

Minotaur
Clothes, Armguards, and Armlets

Morbol

Behemoth

Dragon

Hydra
Just another rebel plotting rebellion.

LastingDawn

Quote from: "philsov"Posting this for now, I'll update here shortly.  Stars as for proposed blue mage skills.

Chocobo - These little warkables are fast and mobile, able to pick off weakened units and even cure allies of both HP and MP.
Equips: None
R/S/M: Counter, Ignore Height
Immunities: Don't Move, Slow, Stop
Elements: Neutral to all
Abilities:
Attack - standard PA * PA*Br/100
*Choco Cure - self-aoe 1 at MA*X
Choco Ball - PA * PA/2 damage, evadeable.  4 range, 0 AoE.
Choco Vitalize - single target MP restoration at MA*X.  

That seems a bit... generic. It's basically FFT Chocobo with one new move. I'm sure we can think up some other things? What does FFTA2 give us on Chocobo's as well as FFXII?

QuoteGoblin - Grunts of the monster world, specializing in melee-range combat.
Equips:  Hat, Clothing, Shoes, Rings, and Armlets
R/S/M:  ????
Immunities: They have accessories for status immunity.
Elements:  Weak to ice.  Absorb earth.  Half darkness.
Abilities:
Attack
Goblin Punch - Deals damage in HP difference, success = PA+X.  melee range, single target.
*Eye Gouge - Inflicts darkness and confusion at PA+X.  melee range, single target.
Bloodthirst - Drains target of 33% HP, at MA+X.  melee range, single target (think Mutilate, only weaker)

This makes them very similar to their 1.3 selves. Don't misunderstand me, 1.3 Goblin is pretty interesting, but may I ask what was wrong with the rather long distance unit, with Frog Drop and Magic Hammer?

QuoteBomb - Fire-based monsters, able to kamikaze when in peril.  
Equips:  Helmets and Hats
R/S/M: Critical quick, float
Immunities:  Poison, Frog, Petrify, Undead
Elements: absorb fire, half ice, weak water, cancel earth
Abilities:
Attack
Self Destruct - complete with a 100% chance to inflict Addle
*Small Bomb - 3 range, 1 AoE at 2 vert.  MA*X damage, fire elemental.
Ignite - 4 range, 1 AoE at 1 vert.  Faiths*(MA+X) chance to inflict haste.

I say have them cancel Dark as well (made way too many of those weapons...)

Self Destruct is... pretty interesting, I like the Addle addition.
Small Bomb, I'm not so fond of, I think this is another instance when we should look beyond FFT's bindings and see what else Bombs have possessed throughout the ages.

Though I do like Ignite. It acts as a deterrent, a heal, and a possible buff.

QuotePanther - 4-legged and fierce with amazing regeneration capabilities.
Equips: None
R/S/M: ???? + Move HP Up
Immunities: Frog, Death Sentence
Elements: Weak earth, half lightning
Abilities:
Attack
Poison Claw - 4 range, success = MA+X (high)
Lick Wounds - 100% Self heal
*Blaster - 2 range, success = MA+X.  Inflicts either stop, petrify, or darkness

Probably have them half Dark as well. Odd immunities, they work though.
Not sure Lick Wounds works really well, an odd thing to picture. I know FFXII has some interesting abilities for the Couerl's if memory serves me right. Blaster is of course a mainstay, and your version looks good.


QuoteMindflayer - Squid-faced mage types
Equips:  Robes, Staves, Rings, and Cloaks
R/S/M
Immunities:
Elements: Weak lightning, absorb water, ha;f fire+ice.
Abilities:
Attack
Mind Blast - 3 range with 1 aoe + 1 vert.  MA+X chance to inflict either confusion or berserk

Did I... never post my ideas for the monsters that Actually went into that Monster Demo I made long ago?
"Moment's anger can revert to joy,
sadness can be turned to delight.
A nation destroyed cannot be restored,
the dead brought back to life."

Art of War

Beta & Gretchen Forever!!!!

SilvasRuin

FFTA2 Chocobos have a variety of abilities, usually shared with at least one other color.  Choco Cure, Esuna, Meteo, I think there's one for haste, and I know there's one for healing ally MP, sort of like Chakra.  All of these support moves affect the Chocobo and surrounding allies like FFT Choco Cure does.

Draivyn

for the chocobos in a2

Yellow: Has no special unique abilities, simply the standard Choco Cure to heal surrounding units, Choco Beak to attack,    and Choco Barrier to cast Shell and Protect on surrounding units.
Green: Can use Choco Esuna to remove debuffs from surrounding units.
Brown: Can use Choco Guard to boost Defense, Magic Defense, and cast Regen on surrounding units.
Red: Can use Choco Meteor to do damage.
White: Can use Choco Recharge to restore MP to one unit
Black: Can use Choco Flame to attack from a distance

philsov

QuoteIt's basically FFT Chocobo with one new move.

That's what most of these are >_>.

I'll rework later <3
Just another rebel plotting rebellion.

philsov

QuoteChoco's seem a bit... generic. It's basically FFT Chocobo with one new move. I'm sure we can think up some other things?

Well it's not like there's much room to work with, either.  I think they need the choco cure ability, and a long-range sniping type ability (either meteor or ball, or something -- chocos are mobile, and these synergize well), which leaves us space for 1 new ability.  I went with MP curing for lack of better options, but using FF12 as an example, I'm pretty sure they had a berserk type ability when another choco died.  But I don't think the AI will ever choose to self-inflict berserk.  But they do make great support units, and the MP curing thing seemed rather fitting (moreso than choco esuna or protect/shell/regen infliction) *shrug*.  There's room for a melee-range attack, maybe?  Chocobop or chocorush or something.  But I do want to avoid melee range straight damage attacks, because that's the whole point of the attack command.

Similarly bombs suffer from the same space dilemma -- they really do need self destruct, and small bomb basically plays the role of a fire AoE that the bomb can use to heal itself, or damage, or both.  Ignite's a fun little twist, and I'm glad you like it, but something like small bomb or spark seems really fitting.

Quotemay I ask what was wrong with the rather long distance unit, with Frog Drop and Magic Hammer?

Frog Drop seems very out of place, but magic hammer seems quite fitting.  I never really see them as long range units, though.  I'd just like to see a monster or two specialize in melee, and goblins seemed like a good candidate.

I'll dig through older FAQs and wikis and see what I can pull up for most of these monsters.
Just another rebel plotting rebellion.

Aensland

Quote from: "LastingDawn"It's a thematic means, to make each piece of equipment truly seem to be worth its price. Part of Mercenaries theme is the feeling of Never having enough money and scraping by with hardly any thing. Believe me, it deals nothing with Steal itself being immoral.
Ah, themes. Okay, I buy that :)

As for monster skills, how about Chocoraise?

LastingDawn

Hmm, well monsters should likely get a Raise ability. Though I don't think it works too well with Chocobo's. It might work with another monster type though. Hmm...

Instead of Frog Drop on Goblin, should we give him Phoenix Down (A reference to a gone-item) Or perhaps... we might want to upgrade and change monsters depending on progression in the story (Chapter 1 Goblins, basic abilities, Goblin Punch, (Something?) and Magic Hammer.  Chapter 2 Imp Captains - Goblin Punch, Phoenix Down, Yell (Sp+1), etc.

So probably for the first patch we might want to make monsters pretty basic, with only the higher echelons of monsters (Dragons, Hydra, etc) with truly threatening skills? The way to implement Blue Mage is to keep each skill unique to the "family" that appears through the patches, so the Goblin, Imp Captain, Domovoi, Trickster, for instance, would all keep Goblin Punch.

This should keep monsters, refreshing and scaled patch by patch, I would imagine. But for now, lets stick with what we think for Chapter 1 Monsters.
"Moment's anger can revert to joy,
sadness can be turned to delight.
A nation destroyed cannot be restored,
the dead brought back to life."

Art of War

Beta & Gretchen Forever!!!!

philsov

scaling... isn't much of an issue, with the exception of straight PA*X or MA*X abilities.  But refreshing?  sure.

QuoteThe way to implement Blue Mage is to keep each skill unique to the "family" that appears through the patches, so the Goblin, Imp Captain, Domovoi, Trickster, for instance, would all keep Goblin Punch.

We can also hold out on some skills until the monsters are at a higher teir, if you'd like.
Just another rebel plotting rebellion.

LastingDawn

That might be the best way of it. Considering I had planned something similar for Summons (will get to that when some tangible work has been done on that.)

Perhaps 4 skills each patch? Or is that too restricting for the Blue Mage class?
"Moment's anger can revert to joy,
sadness can be turned to delight.
A nation destroyed cannot be restored,
the dead brought back to life."

Art of War

Beta & Gretchen Forever!!!!

philsov

I'd rather seen it frontloaded a bit.  Maybe 8 up front and then the rest trickle in at 3-3-2?  Or 10 and then 2-2-2 / 3-2-1?  Meh.
Just another rebel plotting rebellion.

LastingDawn

That sounds much better for the Blue Mage. Yes, 8 at the start then, still need to finalize what we're going to use though for all of that.
"Moment's anger can revert to joy,
sadness can be turned to delight.
A nation destroyed cannot be restored,
the dead brought back to life."

Art of War

Beta & Gretchen Forever!!!!

philsov

for the advancing teirs of demons/monsters -- do you want them to keep the same set of elemental abilities, reactions/innates, and status immunities, with the largest changes being to their skill selection and possibly ratcheting up in multipliers?  Or shall they increase in power with additional elemental resistances, more status immunities, and possibly an additional innate X?

imo if we change anything we should add onto (ie, all bombs are absorb fire, but the final tier may half:water) and never really remove stuff from the lower ranks.
Just another rebel plotting rebellion.

LastingDawn

I think they should increase in power, as the player and NPC's do, with more than just levels. The trouble with monsters is their lack of versatility and their small pools of abilities. Thus I think it is necessary to increase their powers steadily as the patches go on.

EDIT: What you describe is nearly Exactly what I'm looking for.
"Moment's anger can revert to joy,
sadness can be turned to delight.
A nation destroyed cannot be restored,
the dead brought back to life."

Art of War

Beta & Gretchen Forever!!!!

philsov

request -- can you make rare/good poaching goods impossible to obtain on maps with d2+ water?  I want to have innate slots pretty much maxed out (possibly via multiple reactions, if nothing else), and I don't want to lose an innate slot to "cannot enter water" to avoid the Wet Poaching bug?

Edit:  more succinctly, can you not include monsters that poach for good loot never appear in d2 maps?  

this is:

Barius Valley
Beltha Sluice
Finath River
Obronne - Outside
Thieves Fort
Zigolis Swamp
Zirekile Falls

If this list is too long/restrictive, then the monsters included on that map will either have crap poaches or innate cannot enter water, and if you choose the latter please let me know so I can ration off some slots :)
Just another rebel plotting rebellion.

LastingDawn

Did you never find out what I had done with "poaching" all together, Philsov?

Poaching has been turned into Bounty Hunting, with each of the old monster slots turned into unique foes that upon being defeated (with Bounty Hunter equipped or felling them with Gafgarion) will yield a prize that goes to the "Warden's Office" based on a "Ticket" received for the Bounty. I might take out rare poaches all together in this system.

EDIT: Goodness me, I could have sworn I made a topic about this... alas. Here's the main information you might want Philsov.

QuoteNew Addition: Bounty Hunting and the Warden's Office!

Once again with the help of Zodiac, The ability "Poach" has been changed into "Bounty Hunter". This is not just a simple name change. In randoms, sidequests, and sometimes even story missions there will be unique units, with special descriptions. These descriptions read right off of a wanted poster, telling the player the crimes of the Bounty and their strengths, also including the "ticket" one can receive for capturing them. (Not to mention you will likely get a Gil Reward at the end of battle purely for them) If these units are defeated with Bounty Hunter equipped (Gafgarion always has Bounty Hunter innate) their capture will allow you to obtain a "ticket" at the Warden's Office and buy the item reward.
"Moment's anger can revert to joy,
sadness can be turned to delight.
A nation destroyed cannot be restored,
the dead brought back to life."

Art of War

Beta & Gretchen Forever!!!!

Zozma

I had thought about a skill for my own patch that inflicted doom/haste/quick all at once which would instantly bring afflicted unit's counter to 2, but then again the AI might not like the idea of seeing a buff be cast on its enemy. then i considered also making it add "dont act"

er i mean for the floaty-eye monster thingies
  • Modding version: Other/Unknown
Wiegraf: Draw your sword Ramza!
Ramza: But im a monk!!

Draivyn

Ahrimans? is there a valid roulette in the game? Its been awhile since I let an ahriman get a turn( I kill them first on general principle)