Final Fantasy Hacktics

General => Mercenaries => Archives => Mercenaries Spriting Forum => Topic started by: Archael on November 16, 2008, 09:16:00 pm

Title: Ramza, a sprite change for Mercenaries?
Post by: Archael on November 16, 2008, 09:16:00 pm
is he getting a cosmetics / portrait change?

I see so many people getting revamped looks

I think ramza should look noticeable different (and not just his armor...?)

ideas
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Post by: LastingDawn on November 16, 2008, 09:42:48 pm
Well he'll more then likely have Black armor as shown in his production art, as well, his first battle Ramza should have a cape, aside from that... I'm not sure, what do people have in mind for Ramza's look?
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Post by: Archael on November 16, 2008, 09:46:50 pm
can anything be done with his portrait?

something subtle

I mean.. he's gone down another path this time

totally different attitude I pressume
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Post by: DarthPaul on November 16, 2008, 09:51:57 pm
Yes his current portrait says "pure" to me at least.  Now it need to say "i fight for money(and women)".
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Post by: LastingDawn on November 16, 2008, 09:57:45 pm
You are correct... his face at least should be a little bit more rugged, perhaps a bit more sad, or angry.
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Post by: Clockwork Seal on November 16, 2008, 10:03:53 pm
Five O'Clock Shadow?
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Post by: DarthPaul on November 16, 2008, 10:24:46 pm
lol possibly or give him one of the long evil Beoulve goatees.
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Post by: dwib on November 16, 2008, 10:26:39 pm
darker hair? i think facial hair might be too profound of a change
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Post by: LastingDawn on November 16, 2008, 10:35:28 pm
I agree, facial hair does not fit Ramza at all, though I don't think a hair color would make him seem more malevolent either. Basically, I still want it to be recognizable as Ramza. Hmm... a more malevolent look? A different hair style?
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Post by: DarthPaul on November 16, 2008, 10:36:23 pm
Maybe a scowl of some sort.
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Post by: Archael on November 16, 2008, 10:40:12 pm
hair style could work

what about his armor?

the armor shown in the portrait can say alot
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Post by: LastingDawn on November 16, 2008, 10:41:10 pm
That's true. Should his armor be changed around?
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Post by: Archael on November 16, 2008, 10:41:12 pm
maybe his expression can change slightly

and nothing more

a couple of hair lines and eye / mouth angles can do alot (look at alternate squire / thief / ninja portraits) etc etc
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Post by: LastingDawn on November 16, 2008, 10:42:49 pm
That's certainly true. Ramza is and always will be Ramza, I personally felt his Mercenary look was the least attached, he looks needlessly innocent as a Squire and very confident as a Heretic, but as a Mercenary he just seemed to look, very uncaring, incidentally his Mercenary  Portrait is my least favorite, hehe. So, maybe we should do something to make it stand out a bit more.
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Post by: boomkick on November 16, 2008, 10:44:38 pm
Maybe everything about him darker, hair and armor. Not skin tone or that. And a scar.
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Post by: LastingDawn on November 16, 2008, 10:47:54 pm
Why would he have a scar though? Maybe eventually but should it really be at first? Zeakden, yes... I suppose that could singe him a bit (read Mello's scar)  but would that really give him more character?
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Post by: boomkick on November 16, 2008, 10:53:04 pm
Quote from: "LastingDawn"Why would he have a scar though? Maybe eventually but should it really be at first? Zeakden, yes... I suppose that could singe him a bit (read Mello's scar)  but would that really give him more character?

It would make him look less innocent, like he did now after shedding blood for so many years. You could also base him of Dycengarg's portrait. Take the face and change the hair and features.
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Post by: Archael on November 16, 2008, 11:03:02 pm
nah no scar

thats pushing it

a portrait angle change on his face might be all that's needed, maybe a change in eye brows or eyes

anyone got the special Generic portraits around?

those are a good example of what im talking about

give his face more expression
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Post by: boomkick on November 16, 2008, 11:07:02 pm
http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Cate ... ait_Images (http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Final_Fantasy_Tactics_Portrait_Images)

just a few.
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Post by: LastingDawn on November 16, 2008, 11:09:26 pm
I agree, I think I'll rename the thread, so people will know what the thread is about.
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Post by: Archael on November 16, 2008, 11:17:18 pm
I was referring to these guys

same unit, but totally different look; see?

(http://www.ffhacktics.com/forum/images/avatars/gallery/Others/93.gif)

(http://www.ffhacktics.com/forum/images/avatars/gallery/Others/92.gif)

(http://www.ffhacktics.com/forum/images/avatars/gallery/Others/94.gif)

(http://www.ffhacktics.com/forum/images/avatars/gallery/Others/95.gif)

(http://www.ffhacktics.com/forum/images/avatars/gallery/Others/152.gif)


something like that, but for Ramza
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Post by: DarthPaul on November 16, 2008, 11:19:15 pm
I think the mediator has the right expression.
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Post by: LastingDawn on November 16, 2008, 11:24:20 pm
The mediator's look is quite cruel, but would that really fit Ramza? He's not cruel, just disconnected, more or less, looking for his purpose in life.
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Post by: boomkick on November 16, 2008, 11:25:16 pm
Maybe take away the frown or make it less noticeable.
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Post by: Archael on November 16, 2008, 11:26:22 pm
I'm not saying take those same looks for Ramza

it was just an example on the type of change that would be good

subtle change

can make a big difference

u gaiz are dense
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Post by: LastingDawn on November 16, 2008, 11:27:38 pm
Heh, sorry. I think we might need a spriter from here on out in this thread to give us a few options.
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Post by: Xeno3 on November 17, 2008, 02:05:03 am
hmm... in my opinion, it would be the moth of the squire but the face of the monk, or a mixture of the two expressions to make up what to your looking for. And btw you forgot to add Gustav's face portrait to your list, Gustav was basically the second in command in the Death Corps until Weigraf kills him for holding the Marquis for ransom, and his face portrait was an alteration of the Knight one if I remember correctly.
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Post by: Cheetah on November 17, 2008, 03:04:09 am
I have already done a few alternate emotions for Ramza. Obviously the yelling one can easily turned into just a scowl. I also have a surprised look. Real easy to do.
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Post by: Archael on November 17, 2008, 07:31:35 am
exactly cheetah

something like that
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Post by: LastingDawn on November 17, 2008, 04:59:44 pm
Indeed, actually I still have a plan for that, which I don't think I've... revealed... yet?
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Post by: Sonata on November 19, 2008, 01:14:25 pm
MENACING RAMZA
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Post by: DarthPaul on November 19, 2008, 01:43:34 pm
That is quite menacing and yet...... its still Ramza well done. Now to sit back and nitpick and i shall blast you later.
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Post by: dwib on November 19, 2008, 06:47:51 pm
blegh chapter 1 ramza looks like a baby. i'd prefer using the capter 2/3 or 4 portrait and sprite if he ever intends to look menacing, wouldn't you agree? definitely good work though!
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Post by: gojoe on November 19, 2008, 09:41:54 pm
(http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm294/gojoechris/corrupt-1.png)

corrupt ramza?
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Post by: DarthPaul on November 19, 2008, 09:47:51 pm
I could see it.
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Post by: Archael on November 19, 2008, 10:21:26 pm
Quote from: "gojoe"blargh[/img]

corrupt ramza?

no.

more like "bad sense of fashion" ramza
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Post by: gojoe on November 19, 2008, 10:36:01 pm
or that
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Post by: DarthPaul on November 19, 2008, 10:57:52 pm
Quote from: "gojoe"or that

punt
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Post by: dwib on November 20, 2008, 12:14:21 am
oooOOOOooo but one hell of an idea!
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Post by: Sonata on November 20, 2008, 11:20:46 am
Update on caped Ramza (I started to work on it XD)
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Post by: Zozma on November 20, 2008, 11:49:48 am
dude like this. join the cape to the collar, or it looks wierd. dont try to mimic the character art 100% or things wont look right anyway
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Post by: Archael on November 20, 2008, 12:15:39 pm
HOLY SHIT

just too kyooooote!
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Post by: Sonata on November 20, 2008, 04:53:52 pm
nother updaate XD
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Post by: ArkDelgato on November 20, 2008, 05:09:05 pm
eyepatch
Those things just ooze corrupt broody past if your not a pirate.
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Post by: LastingDawn on November 20, 2008, 05:40:09 pm
Heh, no eyepatch, I want Ramza to be very recognizable, but just a slight change to his face might be needed. Probably for his squire default picture, quite a depressed picture. Since Ramza is down and out, living off of Daravon at the beginning really.
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Post by: Raven on December 16, 2008, 12:39:43 pm
I agree that a cape would be a nice addition as would a more rugged appearance and darker hair.

My main suggestion is get rid of the cowlick or whatever is going on with his hair.
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Post by: DarthPaul on December 16, 2008, 12:41:23 pm
That's an ahoge and it's meant to make him look childish/innocent.
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Post by: Dominic NY18 on December 16, 2008, 04:43:29 pm
The cowlick is probably his most distinguishing physical characteristic. No reason it should go.

*Tries to smooth out the cowlick towards the back of his own head, to no avail.*
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Post by: Zuka on December 21, 2008, 10:36:16 am
I think Ramza could do with a dash of stubble (not really facial hair but what may have once been) And I like the scar Idea, I think it would really suit to see him more disheveled though, perhaps a bloodstain somewhere on his outfit, or maybe even some tattering of his cape (which I totally think he should have) I think yeah, a recolor on his armor would be cool, though I've always liked the purple, if i were going to go with anything else it would be black with gold or gray(as close as one can get to gun-metal) highlights. Those are my ideas, I hope one of them is to your liking.

A red cape, I think, yeah, that would be my ideal "Troubled" Ramza
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Post by: LastingDawn on December 21, 2008, 03:40:38 pm
Well my favorite outfit of Ramza in FFT, is Mercenary Ramza, which doesn't have a cape, the cape is only for Squire Ramza, which is in accordance to the production art of him, also it distinguishes his character a bit more in the opening cutscenes.
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Post by: phrygian on December 22, 2008, 07:21:00 pm
I think Izlude's mug might be a good place to draw ideas from....he always had a determined look, that might work well with merc Ramza.
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Post by: LastingDawn on December 22, 2008, 10:11:34 pm
Hmm... that's not a bad idea.
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Post by: Kuraudo Sutoraifu on February 11, 2009, 12:39:59 am
I'm just throwing some altered portrait ideas your way.  The Chap 4 Ramza with the Beoulve beard is half-joke, half-serious.

Chap 1 Ramza has his cape and a slight mood alteration.
Chap 2-3 Ramza has shoulders which I think makes him look a little tougher.
Chap 4 Ramza now has a beard.
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Post by: PX_Timefordeath on February 11, 2009, 01:08:59 am
By chap 4 Ramza should look intimidating, because he should be the badass merc that everyone fears. Like Ike. A beard would be awesome.
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Post by: boomkick on February 11, 2009, 11:43:58 am
Beard looks awkward.
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Post by: Archael on February 11, 2009, 01:37:11 pm
dislike beard

ramza has always been a clean boy he shave

he shave.
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Post by: LastingDawn on February 11, 2009, 04:54:51 pm
Whoa, whoa, whoa! Chapter 1 portrait is amazing! I love that slick robe he seems to be fastened around. If I could see a couple frames of sprite animation for this, I might consider changing Chapter 1 Ramza to such. That robe, hood thing is too awesome to pass up!

The beard's a bit unnoticable... also for some reason seems to clash with Ramza's character.
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Post by: Kuraudo Sutoraifu on February 11, 2009, 05:27:47 pm
Chap 1 was supposed to be for Sonota/Zozma alteration, but I'll see what I can muster up.  Also, you mentioned Chap 2-3 having black armor instead of purple, would you like me to make that change.

And for Chap 4, I was thinking that Ramza's armor should be dramatically different from the Vanilla Ramza's Chap 4 armor.  I was thinking, since he stays with Gafgarog longer this time around, maybe he should adopt a similar armor.  Your thought, LD?
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Post by: LastingDawn on February 11, 2009, 06:56:10 pm
Quite an interesting idea... originally my plan for Ramza was just to simply keep his Mercenary armor, but that's a bit bland after a point. I agree then, since Gafgarion is a driving force behind Ramza in this story some similar armor would not be a bad idea.
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Post by: boomkick on February 11, 2009, 07:06:38 pm
Hmm, maybe a mimic armor for ramza.

Here's a description of what i could imagine in my head. He would have body armor just like Gafgarion (mantle would be a nice addon). Shoulders would be buffed up just slightly to look as if hes a veteran. There could also be a turtleneck kinda feature that only covers up his mouth, not his nose or anything. The turtleneck would be going outward, a little less then 160 degrees relative to the ground. His armor would be brown/black. His other armor would look normal. Hair I think should stay the same so the resemblance can be seen between Chapters.
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Post by: Kuraudo Sutoraifu on February 11, 2009, 11:35:55 pm
Quote from: "boomkick"There could also be a turtleneck kinda feature that only covers up his mouth, not his nose or anything.

/giggle

But in all seriousness, interesting ideas.  I was definitely considering the furry mantle that Gaffy has, but I don't want to do anything to Ramza head, specifically any type of helmet or face covering.  Especially a helmet since hair is one of the only distinguishing marks between most character.  I'm trying Gaff's armor with different color schemes right now, and I'm only coming up with few good ones.  Mainly green and green-blue.
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Post by: LastingDawn on February 11, 2009, 11:42:10 pm
Hmm, Ramza with Gaff's feather mantle would be awesome! That is quite an idea right there! I'm one to believe that Gafgarion's armor is basically rusted, instead of Bronzed, (with bits of ?gold? here and there) it fits his character's personality in the normal game, kind of.
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Post by: PX_Timefordeath on February 12, 2009, 12:14:06 am
How about a Ramza scar on his cheek???? It'll make him look more like a mercenary.
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Post by: boomkick on February 12, 2009, 01:37:30 am
If he did cover his nose he would be ninja.
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Post by: LastingDawn on February 12, 2009, 01:39:58 am
I don't like the idea of a scar, after all, Gafgarion doesn't have a scar, and he's still a fine mercenary, also scars are a bit cliche.
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Post by: Kuraudo Sutoraifu on February 13, 2009, 08:58:33 pm
Possible Chapter 4 Ramza below.

Gave him back his ponytail since Gaffy has one.  The sprite is mostly Gaff's armor but with different pauldrons and a recolor.  I also removed Ramza's cowlick on the front of his hair.
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Post by: Archael on February 13, 2009, 09:00:51 pm
wow

the avatar is amazing

colors on the sprite don't fit together that well IMO (the teal + black make it look a little futuristic  )


and perhaps less shoulder bulkage

but otherwise

thats fuckign awesome gj
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Post by: Kuraudo Sutoraifu on February 13, 2009, 09:06:46 pm
Thanks!

I'll try some more recolors.  Red/Black and Black/Black work well, but both make him look evil which is not my goal.  I'll keep switching it up though.
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Post by: Archael on February 13, 2009, 09:08:14 pm
Quote from: "Kuraudo Sutoraifu"Thanks!

I'll try some more recolors.  Red/Black and Black/Black work well, but both make him look evil which is not my goal.  I'll keep switching it up though.

I like the idea on having him look a little more battle-ready (with that heavier armor)

I wanna know what LD thinks
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Post by: LastingDawn on February 14, 2009, 12:34:51 am
I agree, the sprite is... a bit odd looking as Voldemort has pointed out.  Red/Black sounds good, what of Gold/Black? Or any such? The avatar though is great! Only thing missing is a "disillusioned" look on Ramza's face. I love the obvious comparison now though to Gafgarion's armor. Also the ponytail was a stroke of genuis! That gives him so much more character. I'd say you understand Ramza's role prettyt well. I think a recolor would look great.
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Post by: Cheetah on February 14, 2009, 02:43:35 am
Give Ramza a helmet there and change the colors and it would make a good gladiator sprite. Though I'm not sure how it looks for a Ramza costume, makes him look too much like a huge hulking mammoth of a man.
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Post by: PX_Timefordeath on February 14, 2009, 11:24:47 am
Wow... f--king awesome avatar.
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Post by: Archael on February 14, 2009, 11:58:53 am
yeah maybe tone down the bulk a little bit and recolor

the rest is perfect IMO

and shame on you Cheetah

thinking of turning this into a Gladiator sprite

you inhuman corruptor
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Post by: LastingDawn on February 14, 2009, 11:59:12 am
Quote from: "Cheetah"Give Ramza a helmet there and change the colors and it would make a good gladiator sprite. Though I'm not sure how it looks for a Ramza costume, makes him look too much like a huge hulking mammoth of a man.


Yes, a helmet's not quite advisable for anything dealing with Ramza (only notable things main character's have are faces anyhow. Perhaps it is a bit on the "buff" side, though...

Though I'm pretty sure that's because it's blue (blue on Ramza immediately invokes images of his final relatively spandex outfit...) so I think that might be the reason for such, once it is colored more like armor, it sounds like it would fit well.
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Post by: dwib on February 14, 2009, 12:56:05 pm
the gloves look like mittens... maybe use ramza's vanilla ch 4 arms?
not a big fan of the loin cloth lookin thing either. it gives him a barbarian feel.
i love this idea though.
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Post by: LastingDawn on February 14, 2009, 01:51:39 pm
The loin cloth is what Gafgarion is basically wearing, but a larger version of what Gafgarion has. As it stands it's quite a defining feature in the new outfit. A helmet would basically be against Ramza's character, especially any helmet close to Gafgarion's one of a kind Hades Helm.
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Post by: Cheetah on February 14, 2009, 03:20:40 pm
Oh I wasn't talking about giving Ramza a helmet, that would be terrible. I was just saying that if the sprite had a helmet, it would make a good gladiator. Though like Voldemort says, I don't see a need for such a job.

Are you really wanting a complete sprite change for Ramza LD? I thought the whole point of Mercenaries was for it to take place between chapters 1 & 2, and that Ramza would just be in his chapter 2 armor for the majority of the plot. Though many of these suggestions for Ramza are kind of cool, I just don't want the spirit of the patch to be lost.
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Post by: Asmo X on February 14, 2009, 10:17:09 pm
Still pushing this as a possible Ramza design:

(http://media.giantbomb.com/uploads/0/208/308053-heidern2001bq_large.jpg)

LD thinks it looks like a soldier but that's what mercenaries in the real world tend to look like.

(http://www.geocities.com/madmikehoare/TheColonel.jpg)

(http://rahachirimayotte.oldiblog.com/sites/images/articles/441/article_441329.jpg)
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Post by: dwib on February 14, 2009, 10:18:25 pm
boo

i like where it is heading now
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Post by: Kuraudo Sutoraifu on February 15, 2009, 11:52:07 pm
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v672/Powerguy500/merclarge.jpg)

Here are some color mock-ups.  I personally like the fourth one, but I'm interested in hearing what others like.

And btw, Gaffy's mittens are staying on the sprite.  And buttpants are a must.
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Post by: Archael on February 15, 2009, 11:57:45 pm
1st and 2nd look barbarian-ish

not bad but I dont think it's what LD is looking for

3rd one sucks color-wise


4th one is the best but looks like golden armor... almost like royalty

thats my input

the sprite itself is amazing tho, just talking about the colors
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Post by: Cheetah on February 16, 2009, 12:17:18 am
I like the design of the sprite Kuraudo, just not for Ramza. Recolor Iron Giant's head and put it on either of those first two sprites though and you would have a Super Saiyan Gaffy on your hands. Gafgarion Zodiac Form GO!

Like so:
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Post by: Kuraudo Sutoraifu on February 16, 2009, 12:51:28 am
To Arch:
1 is Garfgarog's colors. 2 is Garfgarog's colors inverted.  3 definitely is ugly.  4 is the best.  If you have any suggested colors, I'm open to them. I would seriously appreciate a second set of eyes, colorwise.

To Cheetah:
He got a big o' hed!

I could make a wicked sweet helm out of the new iron giant's head though.
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Post by: Archael on February 16, 2009, 12:54:01 am
meh if only that heavy armor sprite could be used when he's in a Warder job

:O
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Post by: boomkick on February 16, 2009, 10:41:09 am
I think making the gold on the 4th one a shade bright would make it look not so dark for gold.
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Post by: dwib on February 16, 2009, 01:28:16 pm
Genius! I bet brightening up the armor would make it look less dark you are absolutely right boomkick.

...
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Post by: Goomba on February 18, 2009, 06:18:14 pm
Why does Gafgarion wear a loincloth anyway?
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Post by: gojoe on February 18, 2009, 09:42:20 pm
Quote from: "Goomba"Why does Gafgarion wear a loincloth anyway?

cuz he likes a breeze and secretly wants ppl to see this
(http://www.ffhacktics.com/forum/files/1097464039032_160.png)
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Post by: dwib on February 19, 2009, 02:50:03 am
WHAT!!!!!!!!
:O
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Post by: LastingDawn on February 19, 2009, 01:53:22 pm
Well, quite interesting, but I like the fourth one best as well. I always thought though that Gafgarion's armor was once another color, but over time it of course, had rusted. His armor looks worn, more then it does bronzed.
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Post by: philsov on February 19, 2009, 01:59:04 pm
Quotecuz he likes a breeze and secretly wants ppl to see this

Just when I had forgotten about that picture...
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Post by: Goomba on February 19, 2009, 07:40:37 pm
It makes you feel guilty about killing him. He was a simple man with simple pleasures.
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Post by: Kuraudo Sutoraifu on February 23, 2009, 06:31:38 pm
My processor for my computer finally burn itself out; so, no spriting for me until I get a job.  Sorry, LD!!!
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Post by: Cheetah on February 23, 2009, 07:26:22 pm
NOOOO Kuraudo, Ashley needs your expertise. My graphics computer died on me about a month ago as well, it makes life much more difficult.
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Post by: LastingDawn on February 24, 2009, 02:42:37 am
Gmph!!! Ah well... these things happen. Mercenaries can do for the time being with the normal Ramza sprites.
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Post by: DarthPaul on February 24, 2009, 11:13:49 am
Quote from: "philsov"
Quotecuz he likes a breeze and secretly wants ppl to see this

Just when I had forgotten about that picture...





Why did he have to do that. I had forgotten about gaffy too.
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Post by: LastingDawn on February 24, 2009, 02:40:32 pm
Hmm... maybe I should put a "scandalous photo" somewhere in Mercenaries... I can replace those still arts after all, and who doesn't enjoy seeing Gaffgarion in his bare essentials?
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Post by: gojoe on February 24, 2009, 04:17:03 pm
make the undies an accessory
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Post by: LastingDawn on February 24, 2009, 04:18:29 pm
Heh, well you can't equip Gafgarion with anything, he's never in your group to do so.
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Post by: gojoe on February 24, 2009, 06:19:46 pm
you could make a cut scene where ramza picks em up, then sprite change!

ok enough kidding around, maybe just a simple recolor of his armor would suffice? (anything but purple)
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Post by: LastingDawn on February 24, 2009, 08:13:55 pm
Well the cutscenes actually show his armor as black, which would be pretty cool looking, for the time being anyhow.
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Post by: Smitson on March 02, 2009, 05:07:53 pm
He needs to look somewhat different.
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Post by: gojoe on March 02, 2009, 05:09:21 pm
or just cover up his ass
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Post by: LastingDawn on March 02, 2009, 05:16:31 pm
Darkness? Corrupt? Evil? What gave you that idea? The character's in FFT are very grey, even Dycedarg can't be considered full evil, Gafgarion in the normal game is a pitiable sacrifice. He wasn't evil, he was just doing his job. He even tries to convince Ramza to not go through with his actions, and openly stands up to Dycedarg in regards to trying to kill his own brother.

Ramza in Mercenaries is just a boy disillusioned with the world. Tietra's death showed one thing to Ramza and another to Delita. He eventually also sees Gafgarion as a father figure (a replacement father, really). One thing Mercenaries will have tons of is character development among the main cast, the focus won't fall away from the main six players (Rad, Ramza, Gafgarion, Lavian, Alicia, Agrias) at any time.
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Post by: boomkick on March 02, 2009, 06:01:06 pm
I don't believe that there was any main "human" character in FFT that was not grey and fully black and white (Alma is the only exception i can think of). Ramza has struck people down before, that makes him grey. His morals may be good, but he is not perfect. Vormav and the other Zodiac Monsters could be considered truly evil/corrupt. But i don't believe Ramza would/should become such in Mercs.
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Post by: Desocupado on March 02, 2009, 08:30:28 pm
What about a small beard and a haircut?
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Post by: LastingDawn on March 02, 2009, 10:16:26 pm
Beard just doesn't work on any baby face Ramza.
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Post by: gojoe on March 02, 2009, 10:16:40 pm
i hold my ground on the assplate
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Post by: Smitson on March 06, 2009, 07:12:00 pm
Ramza looks too young and innocent IMO.
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Post by: DarthPaul on March 06, 2009, 07:14:41 pm
Quote from: "gojoe"i hold my ground on the assplate


I shall hold that stance with you gojoe Ramza need an assplate of some kind.
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Post by: gojoe on March 06, 2009, 07:25:15 pm
I think this says it all

(http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm294/gojoechris/Untitled-1.jpg)
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Post by: LastingDawn on March 07, 2009, 01:20:36 pm
My least favorite of his outfits, mainly because it makes him look like some saturday morning cartoon super hero, gah, worst design choice ever... that will not make it into Mercenaries.
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Post by: Kuraudo Sutoraifu on March 07, 2009, 03:29:24 pm
Inever cared for that color scheme.  I thought it was lamer version of Delita's Chap 2 and 3 armor.
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Post by: Smitson on March 10, 2009, 06:03:10 pm
Quote from: "LastingDawn"My least favorite of his outfits, mainly because it makes him look like some saturday morning cartoon super hero, gah, worst design choice ever... that will not make it into Mercenaries.

I don't mind one, the sprite I can't stand is chapter one Ramza. Thank Ajora he doesn't make it in  :D
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on March 11, 2009, 12:00:57 am
Maybe an imitation of gafgarion's armor and change it abit ^^
Since gafgarion's armor is mercenaries armor right? ^^
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Post by: Kaijyuu on March 11, 2009, 01:58:10 am
I've always liked chapter 3 ramza. Except the butt armor, of course. That's always been silly.
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on March 11, 2009, 02:21:34 am
Lol. Yea.
And i hate chapter one's ramza sprite. Haha =p
I feel chapter two is the best ^^
Maybe use chapter two's sprite but make some changes...like maybe colors, abit changes of the armor design, something like that.
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Post by: LastingDawn on March 12, 2009, 08:05:06 am
Originally the plan was to use Squire Ramza for two fights (Zeakden and Gariland) then switch over to Mercenary armor (Cheetah even plans to make an event for the donning of the armor and a celebration of Ramza joining the troupe) as it stand though that event will not make it into the demo.

Though Kuraudo's designs are now very close to my heart, he did a wonderful job and if anyone were to take up the task of sprites for Ramza I would stress that it be one of those sprites.
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Post by: Sephirot24 on March 16, 2009, 01:57:17 am
Ch2 Sprite with altered colors + Cape = WIN

There should be black and effects could be violet / red / silver / white...
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Post by: Azrael on April 08, 2009, 03:41:34 am
As for the face, I think Ramza should look.... troubled... Not confident, not innocent, but, beleaguered.. The events from Zeakden have been traumatic, evidenced especially by his massive change of direction in life. I picture Ramza as being conflicted, and not necessarily all dark and gung-ho... you might as well be creating a different character, otherwise. To best take into consideration this 'new' Ramza, you have to consider the difference in his reaction to Zeakden. My gut says that Ramza, after abandoning Beoulve and witnessing the death of his best friend and sister, would be mostly numb and bitter. It'd be way to drastic of a personality change for Ramza to become evil, unless of course this is something that progresses across the story. He has too big a heart to just cast away all of his morals like that. I'm sure he'd be uncomfortable in his new shoes.


....and although agreeably a tad ridiculous-looking, I believe that's not 'butt armor', but rather leggings showing through a region that LACKS armor.

Either way, no one wants to see the hero's ass crack accentuated...
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Post by: LastingDawn on April 08, 2009, 04:57:07 pm
Ah? Evil? Definitely not evil, have you seen the (now defunct) opening? It opens up to Ramza dreaming in a blank expanse (basically a flashback) where he relives Zeakden. Every night it's the same dream, that always ends with the death of his best friend and sister.

The reason he stays with Gafgarion is, as you've put it, a bitterness towards the nobility, one of the lines at Zirekile to emphasize this "change" in character.


QuoteRamza: Return the princess to us, Delita.

Delita: You would sacrifice an innocent, have you truly sold your soul to them?

Ramza: Innocents... what is so innocent about her?! A noble through and through! Have you so quickly rid your mind of Zeakden! Of your sister?!

Delita: That is why I do this! You would see another Tietra here and now, if you proceed with your wishes!

Ramza: You delude yourself!


A different scope on life, but not evil, calling really anyone but the Lucavi evil in FFT, is a bit... flawed. There's a lot of grey shades.
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Post by: Verdeni on April 08, 2009, 04:57:53 pm
Quote from: "Azrael"....and although agreeably a tad ridiculous-looking, I believe that's not 'butt armor', but rather leggings showing through a region that LACKS armor.

Either way, no one wants to see the hero's ass crack accentuated...

Lol I agree. Even though everyone knows that it's leggings.




ANYWAY, I was looking through this thread, and saw a very uncompleted Ramza w/cape sprite by Sonata. I thought it would be useful, so I took the liberty of finishing sed sprite. It also includes a less... 'innocent' face

Tell me if there's any errors.  8)
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Post by: LastingDawn on April 08, 2009, 05:23:24 pm
Fantastic! thank you very much Verdeni! This will work very well! At least for the time being, I am still drooling over Kuraudo's Ramza sprites.
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Post by: Verdeni on April 08, 2009, 05:25:24 pm
Quote from: "LastingDawn"Fantastic! thank you very much Verdeni! This will work very well! At least for the time being, I am still drooling over Kuraudo's Ramza sprites.

Your welcome. :D


-EDIT-  Oh yes, also, I have the same sprite with the cape, but in a nice shade of red, if you'd prefer it. I like the red one more than the blue one IMO.
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Post by: Sephirot24 on April 08, 2009, 05:39:25 pm
Red Ramza looks better too IMO.
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Post by: LastingDawn on April 08, 2009, 05:52:37 pm
Whoa, Red Ramza is pretty fantastic looking!
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Post by: Archael on April 08, 2009, 06:14:57 pm
looks very good...
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Post by: Verdeni on April 08, 2009, 06:55:30 pm
Sonata gets most of the credit though, if he hadn't started the cape, I doubt I would have had the moxy to make/start/finish it myself. xD
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Post by: gojoe on April 08, 2009, 09:33:58 pm
the cape is too square on the back standing view... other than that Red Ramza FTW!
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Post by: Verdeni on April 08, 2009, 09:52:20 pm
You're right, I'll fix that.


-EDIT- fixed, the back view is better now. I tested every pose in battle, and it functions really nicely.  :D

If there's something i may have missed, don't hesitate to inform me.
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Post by: boomkick on April 09, 2009, 11:42:07 pm
simply amazing.
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Post by: Vault Survivor on April 10, 2009, 09:24:17 am
it is amazing but i dont think he should be in that sprite for most of the game. it is mostly for him still being in royalty in chap. 1. He only is living in igros in chap. 1.
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Post by: Redux on April 10, 2009, 09:35:30 am
Quote from: "Vault Survivor"it is amazing but i dont think he should be in that sprite for most of the game. it is mostly for him still being in royalty in chap. 1. He only is living in igros in chap. 1.
True, but i like the red lasting all throughout the game. The color scheme anyway. It marks Ramza as different than Vanilla ramza. He is harsher. Nice new acocount, bor. Not cliche'd or anything.
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Post by: Vault Survivor on April 10, 2009, 09:51:33 am
Quote from: "Redux"
Quote from: "Vault Survivor"it is amazing but i dont think he should be in that sprite for most of the game. it is mostly for him still being in royalty in chap. 1. He only is living in igros in chap. 1.
True, but i like the red lasting all throughout the game. The color scheme anyway. It marks Ramza as different than Vanilla ramza. He is harsher. Nice new acocount, bor. Not cliche'd or anything.

i dont think a color could just make someone harsher

but if his facial expression is changed then that would work
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Post by: LastingDawn on April 10, 2009, 02:50:51 pm
Well, it is Only for two battles, and three cutscenes, but it's the attention to detail that's important, right off the bat one can tell this is not Alazlam's Ramza.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on August 31, 2009, 07:28:55 am
Quotebut it's the attention to detail that's important, right off the bat one can tell this is not Alazlam's Ramza.

Sir LD, I think we should also change Ramza's colors for chapter 2/3 and 4.
A darker Ramza. :)
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Post by: Kagebunji on August 31, 2009, 08:31:07 am
It won't be a problem, I can do it myself if anyone want.
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Post by: Asmo X on August 31, 2009, 08:56:49 am
The cape design is pretty nice but I think the edges should be changed. Going from dark, straight to light at the edges and having it be uniform from top to bottom makes it looks board-like. This is most pronounced on the side-on view where it hangs like a piece of cardboard.
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Post by: Kagebunji on August 31, 2009, 09:16:10 am
(http://i29.tinypic.com/wo08p.png)

recolored, only portrait is missing.
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Post by: Asmo X on August 31, 2009, 09:58:58 am
You swapped the palette accurately; I just think you need a little more inspiration when choosing colours.
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Post by: Vanya on August 31, 2009, 01:41:52 pm
How about one of these for a new Ch2/3 Sprite?
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Post by: LastingDawn on August 31, 2009, 01:43:21 pm
Problem is... it Can't be new, as the Evtchr's would all be screwed up then, this is just a palette swap on the Chapter 2-3 Clothes, though if you happen to have something regal in mind for Chapter 4 Ramza sprite?
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Post by: Vanya on August 31, 2009, 01:57:14 pm
I'll think about the ch4 one, but ...
Palette swap only? How about this:
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Post by: Kagebunji on August 31, 2009, 02:04:35 pm
I did only palette swap, so what is wrong?
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Post by: Vanya on August 31, 2009, 02:12:37 pm
I don't really think any pure palette swap will ever look good.
But, then again, I hate the original sprite with a passion.
Then the problem becomes that this sprite has like a billion extended animations.
This makes changing the sprite a massive undertaking.
Perhaps changing the colors to 2 complementary colors would be a better route...
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on August 31, 2009, 03:57:21 pm
I liked Kage's palette swap. :)
(http://i29.tinypic.com/wo08p.png)
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on August 31, 2009, 03:57:33 pm
EDIT:
aww.. sorry..
since I suppose we will change the events, we might not need some event sprites.. :(
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Post by: mav on September 02, 2009, 05:46:36 pm
Kage's is pretty decent, in my opinion. It's a little reminiscent of his original palette, but whatever. Anyway, I tried out a red/black/gold scheme, lemme hear what ya think.
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Post by: dwib on September 02, 2009, 06:35:36 pm
I like vanya's recolor a lot... assuming we use one.
Not liking red/black/gold at all
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Post by: Vanya on September 02, 2009, 08:53:10 pm
I kinda like Mavs, actually. I was gonna try to do something like that but i couldn't get the browns right.
Maybe try it with my armor color, with more leathery looking browns for the legs/gloves, and dark grey pants?
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Post by: SilvasRuin on September 02, 2009, 09:00:30 pm
Mav's matches the new beginning Ramza sprite more than the others.  That has some value to it.  Then again, black or purple is more suitable for being the underling of a dark knight.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 02, 2009, 09:28:22 pm
Quote from: "SilvasRuin"Mav's matches the new beginning Ramza sprite more than the others.  That has some value to it.  Then again, black or purple is more suitable for being the underling of a dark knight.

Agreed. I like mav and Kage's palette swap. :)
But I think black would fit better.
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 02, 2009, 11:21:30 pm
Quote from: "MiKeMiTchi"I liked Kage's palette swap. :)
(http://i29.tinypic.com/wo08p.png)

This is the most appropriate (as most fanart either shows him in black or purple armor) it's very fitting I feel.
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Post by: Archael on September 02, 2009, 11:30:23 pm
Quote from: "LastingDawn"
Quote from: "MiKeMiTchi"I liked Kage's palette swap. :)
(http://i29.tinypic.com/wo08p.png)

This is the most appropriate (as most fanart either shows him in black or purple armor) it's very fitting I feel.
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Post by: Vanya on September 02, 2009, 11:32:45 pm
Well all the official artwork and the PSP videos have him in black armor. There's no doubt there.
His gauntles and greaves look silvery and his pants seem more brown than in Kage's.
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Post by: Archael on September 02, 2009, 11:35:40 pm
(http://i29.tinypic.com/wo08p.png)

maybe the black on the chest could be lightened a bit? this one's very dark... but it might look better on an actual FFT map
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Post by: Vanya on September 02, 2009, 11:59:21 pm
How about something like this?

I maintained the Standard FFT 'black' as the darkess shade.
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Post by: Archael on September 03, 2009, 12:00:39 am
I can't see the details anymore, by lightening the very dark parts the 2 black tones are now too similar
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Post by: Vanya on September 03, 2009, 12:05:50 am
Well, that's why this is a bitch of a sprite. There are basically 8 shades of grey. It has to be tweaked to the point where the light shades aren't too light and the dark ones aren't too dark. I pro'ly need to lighten one of the shades of brown in the pants. Kage's has 1 less shade of grey; the 2 darkest are the same shade in his.
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Post by: Archael on September 03, 2009, 12:15:10 am
hmm I see

keep Kage's for now then
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 03, 2009, 02:29:19 am
I guess Vanya's edit looks too dark. :P
Let's see.. I'll test Kage's.
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Post by: mav on September 03, 2009, 07:23:12 am
Kage's reuses a couple colors, keep that in mind, and there may have been some slight edits to the sprite itself. If you choose a different shade for the boots, that might get taken care of. So what color should his boots be? I mean, technically it can be tweaked so that they're two different colors that look exactly the same, but whatever.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 03, 2009, 07:45:17 am
Yep. I knew that. :)

Here's some screenieees..
(sprite bmp attached, in case..)
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Post by: Archael on September 03, 2009, 08:32:48 am
looks good imo
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 03, 2009, 09:56:47 am
Quote from: "Voldemort"looks good imo

That's what I think, too.
Hmm..
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 03, 2009, 10:24:36 am
I didn't knew you were testing my sprite :D

Looking good for dark knight apprentice IMO.
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Post by: Vanya on September 03, 2009, 02:04:48 pm
That one has the original shades for the gauntlets & greaves, right?
The only thing I might tweak is the amount of red in the pants & the light parts.
Otherwise it looks pretty damn close to what the artwork is like.

Something like this maybe?
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Post by: Archael on September 03, 2009, 03:04:05 pm
sprite is growing on me

I like the silver boots / gauntlets vs the black torso
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 03, 2009, 03:11:55 pm
I agree, the silver is very nice, and the black compliments the silver very wel.
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Post by: Vanya on September 03, 2009, 03:34:37 pm
I'd like to see it in action, but I'm heading out now.
If anyone cares to try it I'd appreciate a screen shot.
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Post by: mav on September 03, 2009, 04:14:40 pm
Good job guys. I was about to do this myself, but got sidetracked by a very long post. I like the shade used on the boots in MiKe's a bit more--since it looks a little dirtier, but both sprites like magnificent. I'm too tired to test it myself. :P
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Post by: Archael on September 03, 2009, 04:19:47 pm
so it's grey vs gold

gonna be tough
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 03, 2009, 04:25:48 pm
I prefer the silver glow, as it is a bit more stylish than the gold seen on almost every other character.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 03, 2009, 06:28:37 pm
Quote from: "Vanya"I'd like to see it in action, but I'm heading out now.
If anyone cares to try it I'd appreciate a screen shot.

I care.
I'll test that sprite, then compare it to Kage's. :)
Let's see..
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Post by: mav on September 03, 2009, 07:29:02 pm
Quote from: "LastingDawn"I prefer the silver glow, as it is a bit more stylish than the gold seen on almost every other character.
Gold is definitely overused, but MiKe's has this champagne-type color. It's neat, but either way the silver definitely pops more.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 03, 2009, 07:45:11 pm
Yup, it makes Ramza cleaner.
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Post by: mav on September 03, 2009, 08:03:54 pm
They both look good--though I still prefer the "dirty" one.
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Post by: Vanya on September 03, 2009, 09:44:59 pm
Even I'm torn between them! =P
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Post by: mav on September 03, 2009, 09:46:40 pm
I was hoping one of the sprites wouldn't look as good in game as the other one, but that wasn't the case. I guess it's up to LD.
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Post by: SilvasRuin on September 03, 2009, 10:09:43 pm
I prefer v2 for the softer contrast.
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Post by: Sephirot24 on September 03, 2009, 10:19:41 pm
I like V1 a little more, but both look really great.. so it's practically the same.
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 03, 2009, 10:45:41 pm
I'm going to go with Version 2 on this one, it just looks better to me, I'm not too great of a sprite critiquer though so... I can't really say much more.
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 04, 2009, 08:12:41 am
I think V2 is better too.
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Post by: GeneralStrife on September 04, 2009, 09:49:12 pm
V2
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 10, 2009, 11:56:38 am
I have recolore Ramza ch4 a bit (don't mention hair, I did it to see how it would look), red hair is quite good on him :).

(http://i29.tinypic.com/2s9bxwn.png)
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Post by: mav on September 10, 2009, 03:00:04 pm
Hmmm....the darkest grey seems to be melting into the sprite poorly. I like the light armor, but I don't think it fits Ramza's current scheme.

And I was under the impression that Ramza's final sprite was going to be custom...
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 10, 2009, 03:07:03 pm
I tried dark armor, but the problem is that clothes(?) in the middle are melting with armor, and it all look VERY messed up.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 10, 2009, 07:13:11 pm
Hmm.. I think you failed on that one, Kage.

QuoteAnd I was under the impression that Ramza's final sprite was going to be custom...

Yeah, I thought Ramza's final sprite would be a custom one,
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 11, 2009, 09:24:36 am
I know Mike, it's just that this clothes are preventing me from making dark armor, I will post pic later, so you can see.
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on September 11, 2009, 10:58:19 am
I know what Kage is talking. There's some black portion at the chest there and at the rear as well.
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 11, 2009, 12:43:19 pm
Well I maked his clothes darker, and tried dark armor, I think something is wrong...

(http://i28.tinypic.com/10p90yp.png)
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Post by: Vanya on September 11, 2009, 01:21:32 pm
LD said earlier in the thread that he was thinking of "something regal" for the Ch4 Ramza sprite.
I haven't come up with anything yet.
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Post by: Archael on September 11, 2009, 01:40:51 pm
I don't know about the ch4 sprite

it'll need to be amazing and/or suffer some edits to look better than the current ch2 black
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Post by: Sephirot24 on September 11, 2009, 04:26:33 pm
It'd have to be original rather than a recolor. But anyways, it'd have to follow the story and as I don't want to spoil myself IDK anything about it XD
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 11, 2009, 06:52:50 pm
Quote(http://i28.tinypic.com/10p90yp.png)
Yes kage, the outline shade should a bit darker.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 16, 2009, 08:42:18 am
I lied a bit, I said I won't work for a while, but since LD gave me an idea for the final sprite for ramza,
here's a 'possible' portrait:

(Credit mostly to Seushiro) - It's his avatar.
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on September 16, 2009, 10:55:24 am
I think this fits Ramza Ch4. Its a really looking cool sprite.
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Post by: Vanya on September 16, 2009, 11:57:41 am
The actual sprite itself is just a WotL Dark Knight with Ramza's head. Any ideas about that?
Balbane's sprite has similar armor. Perhaps giving Ramza his father's old armor would be interesting?
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 16, 2009, 12:04:49 pm
Hmm.. Smash's FE armor Vanya?
let's wait for Sir LD for approval and comments..
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 16, 2009, 12:30:22 pm
Well that pretty much goes against the story of Mercenaries, though the transitioned look is good, I was looking or something a little more tragic to him, notice on Delita, Holy Knight sprite how you can see that the face portrait looks pretty tortured, you can see visible bags under Delita's eyes and an almost depressed facial expression, something more similar to that would be perfect.
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Post by: Vanya on September 16, 2009, 12:44:11 pm
He should have short hair, right?
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 16, 2009, 12:54:35 pm
Oh hair doesn't matter, as long as he has the ahoge everything is fine.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 16, 2009, 12:59:29 pm
Hmm.. partially copied delita's look (eyes and expression)

Giving Ramza long hair for this one makes the sprite edit easier (darkknight)

Here's an update:
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Post by: Vanya on September 16, 2009, 12:59:58 pm
Does enough time pass between ch3 and ch4 to allow for his hair to grow back then?
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on September 16, 2009, 01:02:37 pm
That's looking great Mike!
Erm..I guess it could...How long between chapter 3 and chapter 4?
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 16, 2009, 01:39:04 pm
-removed ponytail
-look more like ramza
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Post by: Sephirot24 on September 16, 2009, 01:43:34 pm
That's very very nice Mike. He looks a little bit surprised though, maybe because of the larger eyes.

PS: I knew you wouldn't be able to not stop by the site everyday. No one can XD haha
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 16, 2009, 01:46:18 pm
yes, I guess I should work on the eyes..
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Post by: dwib on September 16, 2009, 05:51:59 pm
liked the old facial expression but i like the new hair
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Post by: Wasabi on September 16, 2009, 05:57:40 pm
That's amazing work Mike! I'm really torn between your recent submission of Ramza and the one with him having a ponytail. :) The recent one looks more characteristic of Ramza, partiicularly the hair, but I can't help but appreciate the more down-to-earth look with the Delita/Dark knight influences.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 16, 2009, 10:23:46 pm
QuoteI knew you wouldn't be able to not stop by the site everyday.

Once I get home, I'll be working like nuts!
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on September 17, 2009, 12:10:14 am
Looking great Mike ^^
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 17, 2009, 02:06:17 am
Next would be the sprite!!! the sprite!
YES..! my exams this week are over..

What I was planning for the sprite is the same as Seu's Magic knight concept.
I would probably give Ramza, a longer hair (matching the portrait).
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 17, 2009, 02:10:24 am
Hmm, it's an interesting concept, alright let's see how it looks.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 17, 2009, 09:16:58 am
Here's my first draft of the sprite, and the updated portrait.

changes:
SPRITE
-based on Seushiro's concept.
-based from WotL dark knight armor, and Ramza ch2.

PORTRAIT
-edited eyes and hair


I need everyone's opinion.
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 17, 2009, 11:05:10 am
I like this concept, but I think he shouldn't have those "legs-armor" from DK(it can be seen in any back-view), it will look kinda strange with this IMO
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 17, 2009, 11:07:20 am
Aw. I didn't know that was armor. I thought that was a cape.

Any suggestion?
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 17, 2009, 11:26:51 am
How about removing it, and replacing it with Lancer cape(just recolor to black)?
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on September 17, 2009, 11:34:26 am
This is looking good. However, that "yellow thing", what Kage said making it look weird. It's something like a waist-cape or something.
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 17, 2009, 11:59:28 am
I didn't said it was yellow :P

here is pic of how it looks:
(http://i25.tinypic.com/j7gsiv.png)
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on September 17, 2009, 12:36:48 pm
I know you didn't say yellow. I meant the thing that you are talking about is yellow ^^
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Post by: Vanya on September 17, 2009, 02:30:31 pm
Those thingies look like they should be fairly easy to remove. Also, I have no idea what the hell they're supposed to be. This sprite is loosely based on the FF3ds version of the dark knight, but that version doesn't have the yellow thingies.
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 17, 2009, 04:18:36 pm
Now that I look at this, his left leg(our right) looks kinda off, like one pixel too much to right, or is it because of brighter shades?
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Post by: Wasabi on September 17, 2009, 04:19:47 pm
I always adored the waist cape on the male DKs in WotL, but with the silver leggings that Ramza is sporting in this sprite would look very awkward.

I would say a retouch on his leggings would do well to match with the waist cape, but the Lancer cape idea is pretty appealing as well. And I have no qualms if the waist cape is removed otherwise.
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Post by: Vanya on September 17, 2009, 04:44:38 pm
I always liked the ch4 legs better than the ch2/3 ones.
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 17, 2009, 04:55:05 pm
I absolutely Hated the Ch. 4 legs, one of my least favorite things about FFT in total, I would much prefer Anything to those sorts of leggings, also I can't help but feel the Lancer Cape is a bit overused by this point. Out of curiousity how would Balmafula's cape look on a guy?
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Post by: Vanya on September 17, 2009, 04:57:49 pm
Tiny.
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Post by: Sephirot24 on September 17, 2009, 05:00:56 pm
Well.. I definitely don't see anything bad about the sprite. Maybe because I like dark-themed / obscure stuff. His left (right for us) leg does look a little warped though, and his left glove is silver while his right is black.
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Post by: dwib on September 17, 2009, 05:29:25 pm
Ramza and capes don't sound like a good idea to me... it would make him too stereotypical of a hero and Ramza (especially as a merc) is not the superman of FFT. That's delita's job.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 17, 2009, 06:48:34 pm
I don't know much about the story of ch4 ramza, so somehow I have no idea what to replace.

All points taken.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 17, 2009, 07:39:08 pm
Sorry guys, I kinda rushed this..
but still, I need your opinions..
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 17, 2009, 07:40:49 pm
Oh, very fancy! I have to say I love that!
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Post by: Zozma on September 17, 2009, 07:42:19 pm
that looks really nice, and ramza looks older actually
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 17, 2009, 07:45:10 pm
Haha.. Sir LD thanks for liking it, coz' I used ramza's original ch4 legs.

Quotethat looks really nice, and ramza looks older actually

Yes, that's what I need to do, too..

Any criticisms?? So that I can start working on the sheet.
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 17, 2009, 07:47:12 pm
If only I were fit to criticize... I'll do my best...

The shoes are definitely interesting, but do they fit all that well? Also that black spot on Ramza's left hand is a bit distracting... is that a part of the armor or is it a transparent dealing?
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Post by: Zozma on September 17, 2009, 07:48:42 pm
no buttpants right?? thats all just no buttpants!
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 17, 2009, 07:50:44 pm
Quoteno buttpants right?? thats all just no buttpants!

Hahaha.

QuoteThe shoes are definitely interesting, but do they fit all that well? Also that black spot on Ramza's left hand is a bit distracting... is that a part of the armor or is it a transparent dealing?

Yes, I don't think that the white for shoes doesn't fit, and will definitely fix the left hand.
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Post by: Vanya on September 17, 2009, 08:57:40 pm
I'd do something else with the hands and feet, the way it is now makes him look like a medieval adidas jogger to me.
Maybe use the browns or blacks on the hands & feet and use the left over colors for a nice cape.
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Post by: mav on September 17, 2009, 09:49:42 pm
Ramza needs a new hairstyle. The armor looks too badass for a fella with a bun on the side of his head...

Great sprite though, MiKe. This may be one of the best Ramzas I've seen...
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Post by: Zozma on September 17, 2009, 09:51:08 pm
b-but the bun is what makes ramza, ramza! lol...
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 17, 2009, 09:59:14 pm
Yeah, the ahoge can't be discarded, it's too vital to Ramza's character.
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Post by: mav on September 17, 2009, 10:01:46 pm
Hmm...good point. I just think his face, his portrait specifically, needs to look a bit less innocent. I took a look at it with Ch. 4 Ramza's face, but he still had an unnecessary level of niceness. I gave him Dycedarg's eyes, yet no avail.
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Post by: Zozma on September 17, 2009, 10:03:30 pm
unless you made a lengthy scene thats main point was him untying the thingy and letting it down... lol
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 17, 2009, 10:36:32 pm
Guys, I'm planning to change his legs.
Any suggestions?
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Post by: mav on September 17, 2009, 10:39:35 pm
Ch. 2 Delita? Orlandu? I'm terrible at this.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 17, 2009, 10:55:52 pm
I think DelitaCh2 legs is worth a try, but for Orlandu, I think his legs won't fit.
I'll try them later.
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on September 17, 2009, 10:58:54 pm
Looking great Mike ^^
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Post by: Wasabi on September 17, 2009, 11:51:52 pm
Does giving him a ponytail make his portrait any more serious? Just a thought.

I was just thinking of Ch.2 Delita legs, too. And I'm sure it's agreed that Ramza should have no butt pants in Mercernaries.
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Post by: Seushiro on September 18, 2009, 07:13:19 am
Quote from: "MiKeMiTchi"Sorry guys, I kinda rushed this..
but still, I need your opinions..

I'm liking this one too. ..  great job with the hair for portrait and Sprite. . .
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 18, 2009, 10:21:00 pm
Update!
-used delita's ch2 legs
-balmafula's cape
hmm.. which looked like ramza's got long hair!
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Post by: Vanya on September 18, 2009, 11:18:30 pm
That's much better. Being ever the advocate for trims... the greaves from Delita's sprite could use some to make it match the armor better. Aside from that I have a feeling I'm not really gonna like the Balmafra cape too much. It's a bit over used and not very manly looking. I still need to see the back view to be sure, but I think a good alternative would be the Male Onion Knight's cape which is of a similar design.
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on September 18, 2009, 11:20:27 pm
I  think its looking good, Mike. Though, are you planning to keep that waist cape thing?
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 18, 2009, 11:21:44 pm
I see. Yes, good points.
Thanks. I'll be editing it over the weekend, but I wont post something
til 2 days.
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Post by: mav on September 19, 2009, 01:10:58 am
Give the greaves some brown trim, like the rest of the armor, and it'll look perfect. And with the portrait's armor ready, I think a slight face change shouldn't be tough--I'll get to that if no one else wants to.
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Post by: dwib on September 19, 2009, 03:43:08 am
yup greaves definitely need trim but other than that it looks awesome
i don't get what the need for a cape is though, seriously
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 19, 2009, 07:19:52 am
We're just testing him with a cape. haha.


I made this without reading your comments, since I was
away.

Used Rondel's cape, btw.
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 19, 2009, 08:32:01 am
Post some back views please, so we could see it from back and say something more about it.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 19, 2009, 09:03:01 am
Quote from: "Kagebunji"Post some back views please, so we could see it from back and say something more about it.

Sure, but don't expect me to finish something quickly..
I'm still busy this weeeek... :(
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 19, 2009, 01:31:48 pm
I know this pain Mike, I'm busy cause I have 3 exams this week -_-
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 20, 2009, 08:31:46 am
Yes, the pain.
But here's a 70% finished sprite!
All I need is to trim and recolor.
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 20, 2009, 09:17:01 am
As mentioned Ramza and cape don't mix, but this...awesome, you are working fast.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 20, 2009, 10:28:25 am
but.. but.. I really like Rondel's cape! haha.
I also have a version without cape.. :)
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 20, 2009, 11:11:17 am
Without a cape might be best, if there was any cape I had planned for it to be small and innocuous. But no matter, no cape will do fine.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 20, 2009, 11:40:40 am
I'll just do a caped Ramza and non-caped Ramza. :P
Maybe we can find use with both of them.

Maybe in an event where Ramza throws the cape?
That would be coooool.
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 20, 2009, 12:33:25 pm
Good idea, but is it possible? And why he would do that?
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 20, 2009, 12:56:37 pm
Oh there are definitely reasons, hehe... Great thinking ahead MikeMitchi.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 20, 2009, 07:41:56 pm
Haha.. good to hear.

btw, here's the non-caped Ramza,
although he's not fixed yet.
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Post by: SilvasRuin on September 20, 2009, 11:17:07 pm
I believe it looks better without the cape, but the red and brown are messing with me.  I can't give all that great of an opinion with those colors distracting me.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 21, 2009, 03:52:24 am
I expect criticisms..
-gloves not yet recolored
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Post by: dwib on September 21, 2009, 04:11:17 am
in his standing pose it looks like he is missing his shoulder pad on the far arm
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Post by: SilvasRuin on September 21, 2009, 04:14:15 am
What is going on with that top right pic?  It looks weird.  I prefer the palette with the black greaves and brown... um... skirt?  That said, I like the color used for the armor trim for the other one.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 21, 2009, 04:18:37 am
Quotein his standing pose it looks like he is missing his shoulder pad on the far arm
Yes, the pads are not given originally from the DK sprite. I'll have to improvise.

QuoteWhat is going on with that top right pic? It looks weird. I prefer the palette with the black greaves and brown... um... skirt? That said, I like the color used for the armor trim for the other one.
Ramza's attacking. haha. Which one did you liked? The original one from DK? or the latest one?
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Post by: SilvasRuin on September 21, 2009, 04:35:38 am
The yellow trim.  Don't really care much for that palette besides the yellow trim.
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Post by: Vanya on September 21, 2009, 07:28:34 am
The alignment of the legs to the upper body looks a tiny bit off in some frames. Could just be me, though.
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Post by: Sephirot24 on September 21, 2009, 02:02:08 pm
Ramza looks like a bodybuilder with that armor on. At least that's the impression it gives me... maybe it's the shoulders...
Also, I like the palette :)
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 21, 2009, 05:25:37 pm
Quotebodybuilder with that armor on.

That's what I'm working on so far.
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 21, 2009, 07:05:22 pm
Your... goal is to make him look like a body builder?
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Post by: dwib on September 21, 2009, 07:28:26 pm
he looks fine if you just give him another shoulder pad and it will look like he has very heavy armor on... it looks fine "buff-wise"
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 21, 2009, 07:29:58 pm
I personally do not want him to look "buff" that's just not Ramza, I feel.
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Post by: Sephirot24 on September 21, 2009, 07:33:31 pm
Quote from: "LastingDawn"I personally do not want him to look "buff" that's just not Ramza, I feel.

Yeah, I agree. I think he meant he'll try to fix that, as Mike mentioned before that he wasn't 100% satisfied with the arms positions.
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 21, 2009, 07:34:15 pm
Ah alright, I must have misunderstood a comment then.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 21, 2009, 09:32:20 pm
Quote from: "LastingDawn"Your... goal is to make him look like a body builder?

No, Sir LD.
Sephirot24 was right. :P
Sorry, I was preparing to go to class when I posted that.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 30, 2009, 07:28:33 am
I'm proud to tell everyone that I've finished the 2 Ramza sprites. :/
(Caped and no cape version)

see attachments:
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Post by: Cheetah on September 30, 2009, 11:02:46 am
These are looking very good Mike. I always hated the hoods on he capes, but it works well in this case.
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Post by: Vanya on September 30, 2009, 12:39:58 pm
Very nice. I like them both. ^_^
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 30, 2009, 12:53:00 pm
Indeed, thank you very much Mike! They both look great!
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 30, 2009, 01:09:43 pm
Good job Mike, the cape is from Pieke right??

Btw, will your name above won't interrupt or anything?
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Post by: Vanya on September 30, 2009, 03:13:45 pm
I hope you don't mind, Mike. I modified your palette a bit. When I was looking at the sprites in my editor I noticed the palette wasn't to PSX standards. I fixed that and and I noticed that there were two nearly identical colors so I axed it since it was largely unused. That gives you one extra color to work with in case you want to make any further modifications.

Here are your sheets with the corrected palette:
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Post by: Kagebunji on September 30, 2009, 03:30:51 pm
In second animation(standing) his head is one pixel too far to our left, it looks kinda strange.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on September 30, 2009, 05:51:44 pm
^ It's becasue if the armor. Looks fine in-game though.

Quote from: "Vanya"I hope you don't mind, Mike. I modified your palette a bit. When I was looking at the sprites in my editor I noticed the palette wasn't to PSX standards. I fixed that and and I noticed that there were two nearly identical colors so I axed it since it was largely unused. That gives you one extra color to work with in case you want to make any further modifications.

Great! Thanks Vanya. That was helpful.
The palettes were out of sync bec. I am editing the HSL values. :P
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Post by: Archael on September 30, 2009, 06:30:47 pm
wow.

that is the best ramza sprite I have ever seen

holy ****

is this for ch4 ramza?

----


right now, I like the cape-less one better, but only because the cape is too light colored imo and clashes hard with the rest of the outfit

try a darker yellow / orange for the cape? like a dark gold?

plz
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Post by: mav on September 30, 2009, 06:46:29 pm
The version without the cape fits better, in my opinion. Though both sprites look terrific.

Can we try a different color that brown for the pants/trim? The brown doesn't look bad or out of place, just a tad bit unexciting.
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Post by: LastingDawn on September 30, 2009, 07:03:32 pm
They're both being used, as Mike has made them they both fit in Very Well storywise.
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Post by: Sephirot24 on September 30, 2009, 07:21:06 pm
Great job guys! It looks really great. I personally don't mind the cape color much.
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on October 01, 2009, 02:13:49 am
Awesome job there Mike!! Awesome. I agreed with Sir Voldemort. I liked the cape-less one too, for now.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on October 01, 2009, 03:59:27 am
At least we have two versions that can be playable for Ramza. :)

Also, I did tried it with a hood> (portrait)
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Post by: dwib on October 01, 2009, 04:28:08 am
dude i hope that portrait is used so badly... very very nice work mike
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on October 01, 2009, 05:16:05 am
Another nice work Mike ^^
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on October 01, 2009, 05:17:28 am
Hehe. Thanks. I was planning if I can make walking sprites for the hooded Ramza version,
for an event where he conceals himself in a chapter introduction, then later shows his face then throws his cape
or something like that in the first battle of that chapter.
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on October 01, 2009, 05:23:41 am
Hmm....Great idea Mike. Interesting way of revealing himself, something like Gafgarion at the Executioner place where Ramza fell into the trap ^^
But let's here what boss has to say ^^
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Post by: LastingDawn on October 01, 2009, 01:14:45 pm
That is a very interesting proposal, especially because of story purpose... if possible the hooded one could replace the caped one, (which could still be use for a few scenes) because of the 4 patch/4 chapter setup Ramza could have as many sprites as needed per chapter, so three sprites of Cape, Hood, and Capeless sounds great!
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Post by: mav on October 01, 2009, 03:31:55 pm
Mercenaries Ramza is Return of the Jedi's Luke Skywalker! Hah, awesome work MiKe. Fix up his right cheek on the portrait though.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on October 01, 2009, 10:47:10 pm
^ Ah sure mav. Thanks for noticing.

Quoteso three sprites of Cape, Hood, and Capeless sounds great!

Glad you like it Sir LD. I'll work on it~
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Post by: winshmo on October 02, 2009, 06:36:26 am
Quote from: "mav"Mercenaries Ramza is Return of the Jedi's Luke Skywalker! Hah, awesome work MiKe. Fix up his right cheek on the portrait though.

Gafgarion eventually would say something like "Ramza, I am your father..." Ramza "Nooooooooooo!"

Very nice idea having multiple sprite changes per events
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Post by: SolidSnakeDog on October 03, 2009, 12:27:51 am
Well...i AM his father! And he killed me during the original story!!! I will have my revenge....someday...YOU HEAR ME RAMZA???

winshmo say : Very nice idea having multiple sprite changes per events.

I approuve the 3 new Ramza's Sprites ! Can't wait to see em in action !
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on October 09, 2009, 10:39:58 pm
cape+hood:

Do you guys think I still need to do the capeless+hood?
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Post by: dwib on October 09, 2009, 10:46:13 pm
capeless + hood would look weird
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on October 09, 2009, 10:57:32 pm
Ramza looks like a Jedi master. lol. XD

Quotecapeless + hood would look weird

Haha. yeah.
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Post by: LastingDawn on October 10, 2009, 03:33:43 am
Fantastic! I love it! That will definitely see use.
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Post by: mav on October 10, 2009, 11:35:32 am
Which browns did you use for the cape and hood? I say use Orlandu's colors, cause for some reason the current ones just don't sit with me. That's my opinion though, you don't have to...

Phenomenal sprite, by the way.
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Post by: Kagebunji on October 10, 2009, 12:22:33 pm
I see some mistake with it though, look at hood in forward facing position and compare it to diagonal back view, you can see that hood in forward facing one ends below nose, while diagonal back ends before it even reach eyes (it's Rofel hood I believe). If you were to fix that, then it would be supreme.

You ofcourse don't have to do it, it's just my opinion here.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on October 10, 2009, 12:48:21 pm
@mav, I used browns from the hair. I'm lazy editing those, so if someone wants to improve it, do so.
@kage, hmm.. I didn't do any edits with the hood, that's what I got for copying and pasting.
I didn't test this sprite in-game though. :)
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Post by: Kagebunji on October 10, 2009, 01:02:10 pm
I thought you only did copy/paste. it doesn't look bad now btw.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on October 10, 2009, 01:34:56 pm
Yeah. All these can be improved later. :)
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on October 10, 2009, 09:28:06 pm
Looking great Mike.
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Post by: Sephirot24 on October 11, 2009, 10:03:49 pm
I like him caped and hooded :)
Dark / mysterious style FTW
Nice work Mike ^^
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Post by: Kagebunji on October 12, 2009, 09:42:35 am
So every sprites for Ramza are done right?

This red-caped Ramza for Ch1, my black armored for ch2/3 and Mike's Ramza for Ch4.

Now we can concentrate on Rad.
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on October 12, 2009, 10:27:34 am
Yes. How bout Gaffy?
I think he doesn't need a new look. LD?
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Post by: Fein on October 12, 2009, 10:31:58 am
Yeah, with all these sprite changes, I think Gaffy should have some too :D
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on October 12, 2009, 10:35:38 am
Haha. For me, I don't think he needs one. He's the boss. :P
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Post by: Fein on October 12, 2009, 10:38:30 am
Well, I suppose you're right. He does have a sprite change already, with the no helmet sprite and what-not.
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Post by: Kagebunji on October 12, 2009, 10:41:09 am
For me he doesn't needs it either, let's wait and see what LD thinks about this.
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on October 12, 2009, 10:44:53 am
Yeah, I don't think he need sprite change. Though, let's see what Sir LD has to say about it ^^
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Post by: LastingDawn on October 12, 2009, 02:55:40 pm
Yes, Gafgarion is a constant, it's slightly symbolic but it's also because it's not very fitting of the character, to have too many sprite changes.
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Post by: mav on October 12, 2009, 05:37:41 pm
Helmetless Gafgarion is such a fantastic piece of art, in both his sprite and portrait, so keeping him constant is definitely a good idea. And keep in mind that he's not on your formation screen like Rad and Ramza; we see those two so often that they need sprite changes, unlike Gafgarion (the same thing went with the generics in Vanilla: with all the job changes, you never really needed to alter their appearances)...

And Rad and Ramza are still kinda young: think about how many times you may changed your hair style, clothing style, facial hair, etc when you were younger (or at your current age). Now look at some of the older folks you know: they tend to stay relatively the same over the span of a couple years.
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Post by: Archael on October 12, 2009, 06:40:25 pm
(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r228/MiKeMiTchi/SpriteWorks/sprstatus-1.png)

some of those look very nice

are they for mercenaries? I could see some of them being used for male generics
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Post by: Kuraudo Sutoraifu on October 12, 2009, 07:02:16 pm
LD, I haven't checked this topic in a few months, and I was curious if Ramza was still gonna have the ponytail I gave him?  I was very proud of it, but apparently not proud enough to read 12 pages of the thread I missed.
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Post by: LastingDawn on October 12, 2009, 08:54:24 pm
Hmm, it seems that sort of fell by the wayside, but perhaps Mike would be willing to look at it, in his Chapter 4, Caped Ramza?
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Post by: MiKeMiTchi on October 12, 2009, 11:28:02 pm
QuoteAnd Rad and Ramza are still kinda young: think about how many times you may changed your hair style, clothing style, facial hair, etc when you were younger (or at your current age). Now look at some of the older folks you know: they tend to stay relatively the same over the span of a couple years.

Nice deduction.


Quoteare they for mercenaries? I could see some of them being used for male generics

Well, I hope that the first one would be able to make it in Mercs.
The 4 last ones, excluding the pumpkin, will be in Mercs. :)
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on October 13, 2009, 12:18:56 am
Those are very nice Mike. Yes, first and second should keep. They are looking great. Yea, the armor is too bulky. ^^
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Post by: Archael on October 13, 2009, 01:09:12 am
Quote from: "MiKeMiTchi"(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r228/MiKeMiTchi/SpriteWorks/sprstatus-1.png)

Well, I hope that the first one would be able to make it in Mercs.
The 4 last ones, excluding the pumpkin, will be in Mercs. :)
Others are just concepts, currently.

I think they are all great

please finish them
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Post by: dwib on October 13, 2009, 01:16:03 am
the sprite on the right of rad needs to be finished above the others... even though it has anime-like blue hair it is a damn good sprite

there is also a sprite that looks like it has a fox tail or something? looks cool
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Post by: SilvasRuin on October 14, 2009, 01:36:40 am
I recognize the second as Laharl from Disgaea, but I don't recognize the others out of the first six.
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Post by: ffta707 on October 27, 2009, 07:18:15 pm
How about like a different color mercinary armor. This has a helmet, but it doesn;t have to.
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Post by: LastingDawn on October 27, 2009, 07:48:02 pm
Well that's part of Gafgarion's charm. He actively goes around in Rusted armor it shows his age and experience to trust his fate to such.
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Post by: mav on October 27, 2009, 08:22:39 pm
Silver may be too reminiscent of his rival, Rondel...

We gotta keep one character constant though, and I think Gafgarion's gotta be that character...
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Post by: ffta707 on October 27, 2009, 08:33:54 pm
I was gonna use this, but decided I should check with you guys first just in case lol. I agree, It almost looks Like Rondel.

Thats interesting about gaff, I had no clue lol. Thts sweet.
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Post by: ffta707 on October 27, 2009, 09:05:29 pm
O, I meant this armor for ramza, lol. Sorry, I did word that wrong. Anyways, this could be ramza's, since they are both mercinaries. Then by chapter four it could be rusted:) lol.
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Post by: LastingDawn on October 27, 2009, 09:29:51 pm
It was suggested, but it looks far too bulky on Ramza.
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Post by: ffta707 on October 27, 2009, 09:46:38 pm
yes it does look rather bulky lol. He would look fat.
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Post by: jimmyjw88 on October 28, 2009, 02:27:39 am
If this is for Gafgarion, I think its not bad actually. Ramza, not really though.