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FFT Arena Season 6 Discussion

Started by Barren, July 21, 2011, 07:37:27 am

Barren

I don't know about you guys, but I'm excited as hell about using Arena as our next AI tourney! We could use something different than 1.3

I know it's going to take a while for it to happen (meaning probably will happen sometime in the fall or the end of the summer if lucky) and there's still some rules to consider or propose but let this be an open discussion!
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Malroth

I'd like to suggest as an improvent to add a reflectable, evadable dark element spell to black magic that does more damage to low faith targets.  example formula would look something like (Dmg = (100-T_faith)* (100 - T_faith) /12)  with an accuracy of (40+2xMa).  Ideally it would be expensive and slow  but would at least give the Wizards an option vs the 40 faith targets

Shade

Quote from: Malroth on July 21, 2011, 04:52:24 pm
I'd like to suggest as an improvent to add a reflectable, evadable dark element spell to black magic that does more damage to low faith targets.  example formula would look something like (Dmg = (100-T_faith)* (100 - T_faith) /12)  with an accuracy of (40+2xMa).  Ideally it would be expensive and slow  but would at least give the Wizards an option vs the 40 faith targets


Or just use Flare?
Upupupu...

Zetsubou

Squidgy

Currently the only anti-low-faith is PA-based... would be nice to get an MA one also, though that might ruin the whole point of Faith. As long as good buffs/heals/raise are still exclusively Faith.

Yeah, and Flare will kill 40 Faith units most the time.

The Damned

(This seems a bit earlier, but eh, might as well.)

So, when exactly would be planning on doing this given that August is almost upon us?

Also, have we made sure there's no problems with skills that are currently around? Like Hawk's Eye? While looking over Archer, it occurred to me that it might have that "the AI is too stupid to realize that moving will cancel this move" problem.
"Sorrow cannot be abolished. It is meaningless to try." - FFX's Yunalesca

"Good and evil are relative, but being a dick cannot be allowed." - Oglaf's Thaumaturge in "The Abyss"

"Well, see, the real magic isn't believing in yourself. The real magic is manipulating people by telling them to believe in themselves. The more you believe, the less you check facts."  - Oglaf's Vanka in "Conviction"

FFMaster

That problem has already been fixed. I just need to implement it for 131.
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The Damned

(Ugh. I should have been in bed hours ago.)

Ah, so it did/does exist. Nice to have confirmation. Almost as nice as to know that it can be fixed.
"Sorrow cannot be abolished. It is meaningless to try." - FFX's Yunalesca

"Good and evil are relative, but being a dick cannot be allowed." - Oglaf's Thaumaturge in "The Abyss"

"Well, see, the real magic isn't believing in yourself. The real magic is manipulating people by telling them to believe in themselves. The more you believe, the less you check facts."  - Oglaf's Vanka in "Conviction"

Odal

Quote from: Barren on July 21, 2011, 07:37:27 am
I don't know about you guys, but I'm excited as hell about using Arena as our next AI tourney!
Eh... I'm not.  Hope you all have fun anyways :)

Malroth

Innate Magic Defence up for Mediators?  god knows they need something.

Barren

I guess so, I mean mediators stats aren't too hot
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Squidgy

I mainly look at HP values and Speed, so the way I see it for stats (also considering innates/equips):

Best: Squire, Paladin, Monk, Thief, Scholar, Mime
Good: Priest, Oracle, Geomancer, Lancer, Bard, Dancer, Time Mage
Okay: Archer, Wizard, Summoner, Samurai, Ninja
Bad: Chemist, Mediator

I'll throw up more opinions in stat/ability discussion.

Malroth

Quickening really needs a CT value

Barren

I agree, it has shown that its OP especially since it can be mimed over and over again instantly
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The Damned

(Damn it, I keep forgetting this.)

So, since this has stalled a bit and the other thread for S5 died a while ago, I figure that I might as well bring up a point that Wiz brought up during S5 if we're going to be talking about this: We really need to come to agreement on what qualifies a map as "small", "medium" and "large" because a lot of the time, those descriptions are...less than accurate even with normal Move.
"Sorrow cannot be abolished. It is meaningless to try." - FFX's Yunalesca

"Good and evil are relative, but being a dick cannot be allowed." - Oglaf's Thaumaturge in "The Abyss"

"Well, see, the real magic isn't believing in yourself. The real magic is manipulating people by telling them to believe in themselves. The more you believe, the less you check facts."  - Oglaf's Vanka in "Conviction"

Barren

Well for starters, I think we need a list of maps again and someone needs to specify what is a large/medium/small map

plus i think the large/medium/small map order for rounds 1 2 and or 3 is perfect

the other way around can work too
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Barren

I know this discussion has been dead for a while, but when Arena is ready for possibly another release (since there are errors to fix in spreadsheet) We could hold a tournament in the winter like everyone discussed on IRC chat several weeks ago.

Maybe we can use the No JP Cap rule and 1 copy of equip/ability rule only like we did in season 5 or we can go back to seasons 1-4 rules with the JP Cap rule and 2 copies of equips/abilities. I'm fine with either one
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RavenOfRazgriz

Sticking with Arena's current rules for its first real tournament outing seems best, personally.  "Season 6" may as well be Season 1 since Arena's not really /had/ much of a definitive tournament yet, FDC's small grab-and-go from posted teams aside, at leas that I can recall, and it's now far different from the 1.3 release it was based on.

Shaking the rules up in later tournaments would be cool, but the first outing really should be with the standard rules, to me, since those are a large part of what Arena is actually balanced around.

FFMaster

For rules, I think sticking to the "standard rules" should be the method. As Raven has said, this will basically be the first real tournament for Arena, the others basically another way of generating videos to help balance.

I have however, thought up of a plan to get this tournament under way without any trouble:

1) Version 135 will be used for a league until the tournament. Like what fdc did before, we should set up a league. I can post videos now, and if possible, ask for help from others as well. No commentary is needed, if the uploader wishes to do commentary though, he/she may do so. The main purpose of this is to seed the players, say top 8. The number will depend on number of competitors for the actual tournament. The duration of this should be about 3-4 weeks.

2) Knowing what is too strong, we will either ban those items/skills or release a SMALL patch decreasing the effectiveness of such abilities/items. Complete remakes/reworks will not happen. If a concept is deemed overpowered, it will have to be banned.

3) Signups will begin. I suggest that we leave about 1-2 weeks for signups, testing and any errors in submission.

4) Just my opinion here, tournament should NOT be Single Elimination. Double Elimination is probably best. Swiss will take forever. If you have a better format, please suggest.

And now, here is a problem I have found while typing the above. If all this were to happen either immediately or 1 week after, we would be going through Christmas, and I'm sure many will be visiting relatives/friends/whatever, me included. The best solution that comes to mind for me is to run the league until about a week before December 25, give 2 weeks to form a team, and then run the tournament on January. Once again, if you have a far better idea, once again please post here.

If you can help with anything like bracket setup, videos, updating posts or whatever else is needed to make this run smoothly then you can also volunteer here.
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Barren

I can run videos if you need my help FFM. I have enough time on my hands to do so
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doriantoki

If anyone wants to give me a quick run-through (unless "quick" is impossible) on how to get videos running as they are set-up for the tournament, I would be willing to help.  Yes, I have a legitimate copy of the game, yes I have the ISO, and yes I have video capture software.  I'm not particularly knowledgeable when it comes to using the patches (which ones I should be using and so on).  But I am willing to learn and set it up on my system.  Just throwing that out there.