Final Fantasy Hacktics

Projects => New Project Ideas => Topic started by: Asmo X on November 06, 2010, 02:55:31 am

Title: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Asmo X on November 06, 2010, 02:55:31 am
Making a patch is probably not going to be a great deal of fun, especially if you want to create a new story and a new world. Here is where most patch ideas go wrong:

1) You have an elaborate fantasy world with a great story and a million characters. Who cares. Your lore isn't going to get a game made. 99% of making this world happen is event editing and other mindless drudgery. Can you edit events and are you willing to? Does your patch need ASM hacks and who is going to supply them? These are the relevant questions and until you can answer them, kindly keep your elf story to yourself.

2) Your idea is probably too big. I've said this before, but a lot of people around here don't seem to have much of a frame of reference outside of huge, bloated JRPGS. When the time comes to make a patch, people want to make something as large in scope as a normal JRPG because they don't have faith in the elegance of shorter stories or don't have the requisite experience with storytelling in other forms to realise that short, succinct stories can be better and more worthwhile than huge, bloated epics. Most people are not good writers, but many people want to make a game or a patch. Think small. Learn the art of being concise and removing elements from your story that are beloved but unnecessary.

Common counter arguments:

1) I'm working alone. Cut me some slack.
A: Working alone is only a big deal if your idea is beyond the capability of one person. You may love the idea you are working on, but it might not be a project you can complete. There will be other, smaller ideas that you love.

2) I'm doing it for fun.
A: I find it hard to believe people enjoy working on unfinishable projects. If you're throwing work at a project, that is work you are intending to drive the project towards completion. That is what you want. Don't then try to cop out of this by insinuating that finishing is optional. You want to finish, admit it. Then admit that your project is beyond your means.

3) Real life gets in the way.
A: It invariably does when you take on a project that requires 5 straight years of your life.

This is an article written by the creator of Spelunky about finishing games. Everyone needs to read it: http://makegames.tumblr.com/post/1136623767/finishing-a-game

"Writing your idea down is not starting the damn game. Writing a design document is not starting the damn game. Assembling a team is not starting the damn game. Even doing graphics or music is not starting the damn game. It's easy to confuse "preparing to start the damn game" with "starting the damn game". Just remember: a damn game can be played, and if you have not created something that can be played, it's not a damn game!"
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Archael on November 06, 2010, 03:44:24 am
Truer words have never been uttered in this site. I lost count of how many projects I've seen that never went anywhere because of the scenario Asmo is describing above. This post reeks of experience and everyone looking to make an enjoyable, >FINISHED, PLAYABLE< mod for this (or any game) should take this advice to heart.

If the above advice is followed, this site's productivity (and the amount of playable content) will skyrocket.

10/10
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Cheetah on November 06, 2010, 11:11:27 pm
That is a great link.
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Dominic NY18 on November 08, 2010, 08:09:35 pm
I've linked this topic to the (revamped) Announcement topic. Hopefully, people are reading and taking it to heart.
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Kagebunji on November 09, 2010, 01:48:48 pm
True, yeah. But truth is, that people still give too much of a fuck about all new sprites(and if they can't do it themselves, they count on us, and spriters number have depleted lately, sadly), jobs, and lastly story(wich is really the basic of patch). So people, read this, follow these points, and you will have nice patches that hopefully get finished somehow.
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: MysticKnightFF5 on January 01, 2011, 06:28:56 pm
Well this thread is mean. Accurate to all hell, but mean. xD
That article forgot to mention perseverance all on its own. Some people just do not have what it takes to make a full game and REQUIRES partners to help finish it, or start it.
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Zuzka on March 28, 2011, 05:20:45 pm
What a negative outlook. This would be better titled 'Why I'll never amount to anything' :gay:
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: MysticKnightFF5 on March 28, 2011, 06:25:06 pm
The truth cannot be negative, only the truth.
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Dome on March 28, 2011, 06:32:18 pm
This may look a little harsh, but, once upon a time, FFH was flooded by people that wanted to make patches with OVER 9000 changes of everything, only managing to use bandwith and make Xif pay more the domain
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Celdia on March 28, 2011, 10:19:05 pm
I think you're missing the spirit of the message here, Zuzka. If you didn't read the link that's at the end of that first post, do so. Its a long read but its a good one that everyone trying to make a patch here should read. Asmo may come off as harsh but every point he makes is a valid one.
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: The Damned on March 29, 2011, 03:23:51 am
As usual, I have to agree with Celdia. I didn't even see that link all the times before that I looked at this thread (or perhaps I just didn't ever make away to reading it), but really is just sensible advice; further more, it doesn't come as harshly as Asmo, though just because Asmo is (always) harsh-sounding doesn't mean his points are any less legitimate.
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Zuzka on March 29, 2011, 04:35:18 am
Okay after reading the link I understand. I missed the possible humor and the link.
Quote from: Dome on March 28, 2011, 06:32:18 pm
This may look a little harsh, but, once upon a time, FFH was flooded by people that wanted to make patches with OVER 9000 changes of everything, only managing to use bandwith and make Xif pay more the domain
Quote from: Celdia on March 28, 2011, 10:19:05 pm
I think you're missing the spirit of the message here, Zuzka. If you didn't read the link that's at the end of that first post, do so. Its a long read but its a good one that everyone trying to make a patch here should read. Asmo may come off as harsh but every point he makes is a valid one.
and I can see the reason for the negative tone Asmo presented this link in now I've seen the archives.
Also I don't assume you're  :gay: nor care if you're  :gay:, just wanted to use it.

Can someone make :more: smileys like this?
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: MysticKnightFF5 on March 29, 2011, 06:50:57 am
oh dear god...smily spamming, you ma'am, belong at Dome's side.
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Celdia on March 29, 2011, 02:05:29 pm
Well in her defense, they are cute smilies. I'm glad you did go read everything, Zuzka.

And yes, I could make piles of smilies like those. I'm just not inclined to. :P I certainly have the tools to do it. However if this discussion is going to continue on about smilies we should take it to a new thread elsewhere.
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Asmo X on April 05, 2011, 12:39:04 pm
Was not expecting to see half a dozen new posts here after not being around for several months. This whole OP can be summed up very easily like this. You see in that link how there's that diagram where the 3 circles overlap? You see the "Games I want to have made" circle? You see the big part of that circle that doesn't overlap with any other circles? That's where those hacks belong that you used to see on FFH all the time where the person wanted to hack the whole story. Those games do not get finished. Those patches are fun to think about, but that's it. They don't go anywhere.
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Dome on April 05, 2011, 01:37:21 pm
Quote from: Asmo X on April 05, 2011, 12:39:04 pm
Was not expecting to see half a dozen new posts here after not being around for several months. This whole OP can be summed up very easily like this. You see in that link how there's that diagram where the 3 circles overlap? You see the "Games I want to have made" circle? You see the big part of that circle that doesn't overlap with any other circles? That's where those hacks belong that you used to see on FFH all the time where the person wanted to hack the whole story. Those games do not get finished. Those patches are fun to think about, but that's it. They don't go anywhere.

Long time no see Asmo!
What's up?
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: MysticKnightFF5 on April 05, 2011, 08:51:23 pm
Quote from: Asmo X on April 05, 2011, 12:39:04 pm
Was not expecting to see half a dozen new posts here after not being around for several months. This whole OP can be summed up very easily like this. You see in that link how there's that diagram where the 3 circles overlap? You see the "Games I want to have made" circle? You see the big part of that circle that doesn't overlap with any other circles? That's where those hacks belong that you used to see on FFH all the time where the person wanted to hack the whole story. Those games do not get finished. Those patches are fun to think about, but that's it. They don't go anywhere.

What he said.
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Phlashblazer on July 24, 2011, 03:36:52 am
Really great insight built upon other members experiences, def a solid read for all members to get some sound advice.
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Durbs on January 14, 2012, 11:30:53 am
I think this is a good contribution here:
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: MysticKnightFF5 on January 14, 2012, 02:32:19 pm
That was hilarious! XD
Sadly, it had absolutely nothing to do with the topic.
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Durbs on January 14, 2012, 02:42:59 pm
Quote from: Dunkelritter Luna on January 14, 2012, 02:32:19 pm
That was hilarious! XD
Sadly, it had absolutely nothing to do with the topic.


It had everything to do with the topic; how many new people can't you think of that ask for custom sprites almost immediately when they come to FFH to supplement their patches that will never get completed? I even did once. :?
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: MysticKnightFF5 on January 14, 2012, 03:49:08 pm
lol, in spite of newbies being a little sprite greedy, that doesn't have anything to do with the fact that they'll never finish the patch that they want the sprite for.
Title: Re: Why your project isn't going to be finished
Post by: Lockeadon on November 25, 2015, 06:47:56 am
i didn't ask for any! though i guess technically i'm not really new either! existing sprites had everything i wanted anyway, and i'd rather learn how to make them rather than badgering people. this topic sure seems to have been proven since then. o.o